I feel Rengar's "counterplay" are really only countermeasures

Divewing·Dec 26, 2015·137 votes·6,625 views

Because when he jumps at me I usually disappear because I don't have the 0.003 reaction time necessary to perform a "counterplay"

152 Comments

OhthePiplupDec 26, 201582 votes

Snide comment telling you that you were at fault

DivewingDec 26, 201571 votes

Pointless elo-based retort to prove you wrong

OhthePiplupDec 26, 201562 votes

Obviously angry reply bringing up how it isn't my main account, stating how it is in diamond

DivewingDec 26, 201562 votes

Obligatory scepticism

HayRossDec 26, 201536 votes

Laughing Fish comes out of nowhere and starts posting gifs

Nidalee SO NYAAADec 26, 20153 votes

he does not hang out on the gameplay board :P

Laughing FishDec 26, 201568 votes

http://persephonemagazine.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/elf-throne-of-lies.gif

HighH1Dec 26, 201513 votes

Laughing Fish for Boards President 2016

Laughing FishDec 26, 201514 votes

http://img.pandawhale.com/98728-that-goes-without-saying-gif-g-he7c.gif

Laughing FishDec 26, 20159 votes

Say my name gif

RikariDec 27, 20153 votes

Rengar main stating his weaknesses and drawbacks

ZerglingOneDec 26, 201545 votes

Maybe Riot will notice the 100th time I post this.

He'd be completely fine if and only if the following 2 conditions are met. A. The vision on his ult becomes global instead of almost-globally localized. Like TwistedFate ult. (Yes, this is actually a Rengar buff, but hold on) B. The vision on his ult informs you that you're visible just like every other vision granting ability in the entire game. And I do mean every single other vision ability in the game. I've checked.

When TwistedFate ults, you back the fuck up. You see that Eye of Sauron over your head. When Ashe hawkshot lands in an area, you leave the area because you see the sparkles in the air and know you can be seen. When Warwick blood scent pops up over your head, you see the eyes and hear the howl. You know he's around and possibly coming for your head, so you leave wherever you are.

It's an opposite kind of scenario, but the visual intelligence portion and jump scenario is valid so I'll list it, when Nocturne ults you run backwards toward your tower or huddle in with allies and prepare any defensive ability you may have to prevent him from killing you. He yells DAAAAARKNESS and your screen goes red. You know he's coming so you act differently. When you hit a Nidalee , Caitlyn , Teemo , or Shaco trap, abilities where you know you are or were visible, you immediately go on high alert mode and begin behaving differently because they could be anywhere near you and you have to be ready when they pop out on you.

When Rengar ults, he sees you and you have no god damned idea where he is on the map until he's within a hair's breadth of his jump range and then you're gone. You didn't know you were visible, you didn't know he was coming, nothing, you're just dead and he walks off with a new trophy and 300 gold.

I don't think it's out of the question to ask Riot to bring his ultimate into consistency with every other vision granting ability in the game. His numbers can remain completely unchanged and he can have what he has now if they just put this simple piece of balance into the game for him. Keep him consistent Riot, there should be no special bullshit for 1 character when similar mechanics already exist and have gone through 100+ iterations of balancing. I didn't even list all of the vision granting abilities, but I assure you, they all inform you of your visible status.

Gunslinger744Dec 26, 20154 votes

I don't really understand, you mean make the "!" above your head appear when he ults, wherever you may be on the map?

ZerglingOneDec 26, 20157 votes

{quoted}

I don't really understand, you mean make the "!" above your head appear when he ults, wherever you may be on the map?

It doesn't have to be an exclamation point, it could be eyes over your head like most of the vision granters, but yes. You play differently when you know you're seen.

His ultimate is the only skill that breaks what is otherwise an ironclad rule of similar skills.

originary91Dec 26, 20151 votes

{quoted}

It doesn't have to be an exclamation point, it could be eyes over your head like most of the vision granters, but yes. You play differently when you know you're seen.

His ultimate is the only skill that breaks what is otherwise an ironclad rule of similar skills.

Evelynn has perma stealth that is detectable at a smaller range than Rengars Rengars is detectable at 1250 range, Evelynn's at 1200. Shaco has spammable stealth that has no warning signs. Kha Zhix has stealth with no warning signs. Uh what?

TreyenDec 26, 20159 votes

eve doesn't have a teleport that makes that 1200/1250 range pointless (though she is still op anyway but not cause of her stealth, imo) khazix stealth lasts almost no time and usually is used in the middle of combat to try and live or to reset passive for damage..you know where he is shaco is horseshit and we can all just be glad that almost no one actually plays him.

Joe DreddDec 26, 20151 votes

khazix can stealth 3 times for 2 seconds each time lmao

ShrimpKeithDec 26, 20154 votes

Yes but why evolve stealth?

Joe DreddDec 26, 20151 votes

Because it's good? What else are you going to upgrade? W? LMAO

HahahahyenaDec 27, 20152 votes

w is a lot better then triple stealth

Joe DreddDec 27, 20151 votes

k m8 keep thinking whatever you want

HahahahyenaDec 27, 20151 votes

heals 4 dayz plus item 2043 completely negate the 3 invis

Joe DreddDec 27, 20152 votes

you do know that the heal doesnt stack

ÄrtoriasDec 27, 20152 votes

Twitch Can stealth longer than rengar early on and just come up behind you and start unleashing hell with no notifier

U4fyn2vZzWDec 26, 20158 votes

This has been suggested for god knows how long. It would be way more thematic and overall badass if Rengar let out a mighty roar when he ulted, notifying everyone he's on the hunt and removing that "!" over their heads to compensate.

OneSmoothDudeDec 27, 20152 votes

Uhm, well, I disagree with the thematics part. He's a stealth champion. Announcing it globally is pretty much the exact opposite of what Rengar would want.

In terms of gameplay though, yeah that would be nice.

U4fyn2vZzWDec 27, 20151 votes

Just because its stealth doesn't mean its not thematic.

Rengar, in his roots, is extremely prideful, proud, eager, etc. His ultimate is named "Thrill Of The Hunt" (something that is a part of his lore) which is something that you would assume would show him being determined and eager for a kill so it makes sense he would release a loud roar everyone could hear.

OneSmoothDudeJan 5, 20161 votes

But that's not how cats hunt... Mufasa taught Simba to stalk during pouncing lessons, not roar and rush them down. Like why have stealth if it's not stealthy.

shrug

originary91Dec 28, 20152 votes

{quoted}

Uhm, well, I disagree with the thematics part. He's a stealth champion. Announcing it globally is pretty much the exact opposite of what Rengar would want.

In terms of gameplay though, yeah that would be nice.

Dude, don't bother. Boards is retarded as hell when it comes to Assassins... 'Buhbuh, things should totally be like this so that Assassins can't punish me as hard!!1!, WAAAH, WAAAAAH'.

OneSmoothDudeJan 5, 20161 votes

I'm slowly figuring that out. lol People always say that ADCs were the whiny ones but man, mage QQ threads are out of control right now.

originary91Dec 26, 20156 votes

{quoted}

Maybe Riot will notice the 100th time I post this.

He'd be completely fine if and only if the following 2 conditions are met. A. The vision on his ult becomes global instead of almost-globally localized. Like ult. (Yes, this is actually a Rengar buff, but hold on) B. The vision on his ult informs you that you're visible just like every other vision granting ability in the entire game. And I do mean every single other vision ability in the game. I've checked.

When ults, you back the fuck up. You see that Eye of Sauron over your head. When hawkshot lands in an area, you leave the area because you see the sparkles in the air and know you can be seen. When blood scent pops up over your head, you see the eyes and hear the howl. You know he's around and possibly coming for your head, so you leave wherever you are.

It's an opposite kind of scenario, but the visual intelligence portion and jump scenario is valid so I'll list it, when ults you run backwards toward your tower or huddle in with allies and prepare any defensive ability you may have to prevent him from killing you. He yells DAAAAARKNESS and your screen goes red. You know he's coming so you act differently. When you hit a , , , or trap, abilities where you know you are or were visible, you immediately go on high alert mode and begin behaving differently because they could be anywhere near you and you have to be ready when they pop out on you.

When ults, he sees you and you have no god damned idea where he is on the map until he's within a hair's breadth of his jump range and then you're gone. You didn't know you were visible, you didn't know he was coming, nothing, you're just dead and he walks off with a new trophy and 300 gold.

I don't think it's out of the question to ask Riot to bring his ultimate into consistency with every other vision granting ability in the game. His numbers can remain completely unchanged and he can have what he has now if they just put this simple piece of balance into the game for him. Keep him consistent Riot, there should be no special bullshit for 1 character when similar mechanics already exist and have gone through 100+ iterations of balancing. I didn't even list all of the vision granting abilities, but I assure you, they all inform you of your visible status.

TF has a teleport. Nocturne reduces enemy vision to almost 0 and travels at a bazillion miles per hour. WW is a toggle, Shaco, Cait, Teemo and Nidalee are irrelevant. Let me leap from halfway across the map and I'll be okay with everyone knowing I'm coming. This just completely defeats the concept of 'stealth', 'unseen predators' and 'tracking/hunting'. But it's boards, so what can you expect?

MrSlowDieDec 26, 20151 votes

{quoted} When blood scent pops up over your head, you see the eyes and hear the howl. You know he's around and possibly coming for your head, so you leave wherever you are.

you can deactivate it though

TaarkiDec 26, 20157 votes

But then he can't see you.

JariDec 26, 20151 votes

Well, there is a chance he knows and just doesn't want you to catch him yet.

TaarkiDec 28, 20151 votes

Then he sees you from something else besides his skill, such as a ward.

JariDec 28, 20151 votes

He could just know you're in the bush. You don't require a ward in the bush to see someone low enough run into a bush.

And if your elo is low enough you can just pretend you never saw it until you reach a certain point and then press E and jump on him.

TaarkiDec 28, 20151 votes

Okay, but if you saw him go into the bush, how does the skill have anything to do with it. You can literally do that with any champion. You could say that you pretended to never see them go into it and then suddenly drop a ward and jump on him.

JariDec 28, 20151 votes

Well I guess in that case you don't need the ward.

I never said it's as unfair. I'm just giving an example of where he can have it off and still know your location without wards, just paying attention. Then again, a difference here between Rengar and WW is that Rengar uses an ult for it. :P

TaarkiDec 29, 20151 votes

No, if they know that a person is in there without the skill, then the skill is unnecessary and not factored in. You could be playing anyone and see someone walk into a bush.

SpoofghoulDec 26, 201511 votes

Why not give him a global/semi global announcement when he starts ult like Sions ult. You hear it anywhere ont he map you still don't know here hes at but you know hes coming for someone.

doombotMECHADec 26, 20155 votes

YES. this would also be an excellent change.

AdaloreDec 26, 201521 votes

Well at least poppy flips him off as your team retreats. She can stand next to the "clearly his target" character and just W. Depending on how far out he stealthed he won't have the time to wait out the anti-dash field.

Otherwise, may your enemy rengars never be fed.

FadedFreezyDec 26, 201517 votes

He's an assassin whose kit is designed to attack from stealth. I'll use an analogy to explain how I combat Rengar.

Why fight a fire when you can practice fire prevention?

What do I mean by this?

Ward up, there's nothing better than a warning that Rengar is on his way. When a champion of this nature is on the rift you have to practice map awareness. Rengar thrives on the element of surprise and a tactically placed wards, team communication and paying attention to the mini map (where he is, where did he gank last, is he camping a lane) can create a famine of easy gank situations for the king of the jungle (dun dun tiss). Finally, be prepared for him once you see the exclamation mark above your champion. item 3143 item 3110 are examples of some items that might help you combat Rengar. In addition, if your support player is willing ask that they build a item 2045 or item 2049 and finish those off.

The element of surprise can be taken from Rengar. Be aware of his location. Be cautious of the jungle.

AbodyHUN666Dec 26, 201513 votes

Don't forget getting GA. That item gives Rengar nightmares.

A Miss FortuneDec 26, 201512 votes

Ward up, there's nothing better than a warning that Rengar is on his way.

Same counterplay for literally every champion in the game. I don't see how he's an assassin that relies on stealth, you can put 50 pink wards in a bush and he still can jump out at you. Can I just mention how cancerous top lane Rengar is because his jump has no real cooldown and your speakers blow up with some sort of dying bear-like cry.

Finally, be prepared for him once you see the exclamation mark above your champion. are examples of some items that might help you combat Rengar. In addition, if your support player is willing ask that they build a or and finish those off.

Great so we got vision on him, now maybe if I just threw my item 2043 on top of him he won't do 3k+ damage in less than .3 seconds

RivvyDec 26, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=A Miss Fortune,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=0oYqwObz,comment-id=00010001,timestamp=2015-12-26T13:59:47.970+0000)

Same counterplay for literally every champion in the game. I don't see how he's an assassin that relies on stealth, you can put 50 pink wards in a bush and he still can jump out at you. Can I just mention how cancerous top lane Rengar is because his jump has no real cooldown and your speakers blow up with some sort of dying bear-like cry.

Great so we got vision on him, now maybe if I just threw my on top of him he won't do 3k+ damage in less than .3 seconds

"Warding is counterplay against every champion in the game, therefore it is an invalid argument against Rengar. Get roasted scrub."

chipndip1Dec 26, 20155 votes

{quoted}

"Warding is counterplay against every champion in the game, therefore it is an invalid argument against Rengar. Get roasted scrub."

Warding is a counter-measure, not counter-play.

Counter-play is REACTIONARY. It's a response to someone's play. Things like trading harder, blocking, and dodging attacks.

Counter-measures are PREVENTATIVE. They deter someone from making a play to begin with, or lower the effectiveness of that play if they do it anyway. This adds up to warding and positioning.

Teemo or FeedmoDec 26, 201510 votes

not 0.003, 0.001.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yW_st2H2Y2Y