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How do you stop bruiser assassins?

Roran Atriedes··1 votes·933 views

My teams keep getting destroyed by people like Diana , Jax , Pantheon , Zed and Fiora . All of these champs have the ability to build nearly no dmg items, fill out with tank stuff, and wreck two and three people at the same time! Any advice on what I could do or tell my teammates to do for any one of these or the whole group would be amazing. Please note that I play top most of the time, and that my main is Poppy Current B2 Max S1

8 Comments

EndlessSorcerer2 votes

Um, most of the champions you listed typically build several damage items before getting defensive items, if they bother getting them. At minimum, they have 2 or 3 offensive items before itemizing large amounts of defense in most cases (except maybe Pantheon jungle with Warrior -> Hexdrinker/Brutalizer->Defensive Items).

Roran Atriedes1 votes

Its more their general ability to have that ability to both duel and output teamfight dmg that is bothering me. I mean, if I can't duel them and focus them down, but I can't get my buddies to ambush them, what do I do? As to the dmg items, the only one I know of that buys a lot of dmg first is fiora, and that helps her bc her ult lets her get back from 1/4 health to full with a hydra.

EndlessSorcerer1 votes

Jax typically gets Trinity Force and Blade of the Ruined King before building tanky items.

Zed typically gets Blade of the Ruined King, Youmuu's Ghostblade, and Last Whisper (at minimum) for damage items before investing much in defensive stats.

Fiora typically gets Ravenous Hydra, Black Cleaver or Youmuu's Ghostblade, and Last Whisper.

Pantheon really varies, but he typically has at least Warrior and Hexdrinker or Brutalizer before getting tanky.

Diana has pretty low base damage and utility, but pretty good ratios so she needs some early ability power if she wants to play as an assassin. I can't really comment on tanky Diana builds, since I never really see it.

If you are having issues with them, Fiora and Zed are very vulnerable if you can hit them with CC (since they are very squishy), Jax is primarily single-target damage and can be kited, and Pantheon falls off pretty hard later in the game because he has low AoE damage or CC.

Jax is more difficult, since he's intended to scale into the late-game but he can be kited in teamfights, harassed down from range (in siege situations), has little waveclear (hard for him to defend towers without being able to engage), needs to stay in a fight to do the most damage (if you kite him, his passive falls which reduces his damage).

Roran Atriedes1 votes

You must be playing at a different level than I, because most of those builds are way too dmg focused compared to what I see. For instance, zed normally builds Brutalizer-Botrk-tier1 boots- tank item. Jax bulids triforce-randuins, sometimes stopping for a vamp scepter between, etc. Diana has decent base dmg, and I'm not talking about 100-0 people like full assassins, I'm talking about too much total dmg for the tankiness they can build. You got me on panth and fiora. I only put them in as a late game focus, since they can both 1-2 under turret past 25 min in. As to jax being kited, I find that very hard to believe due to ward jumping, jump stunning, move speed from tri and botrk's active. I like the idea of poking from range, though he often out sustains that. Thank you for giving me some ideas, or at least taking this seriously.

EndlessSorcerer1 votes

Kiting Jax is difficult because of his Leap Strike, stun, Trinity Force movement speed, and Bilgewater/BoRK active. However, this is mainly an issue in 1v1 fights where you have a limited amount of CC and might not be able to kill him during their duration. Perhaps I was using the wrong word for it, but he has to be in melee range to deal damage, so having allies peel away from him while hitting him from range in teamfights isn't too difficult with a bit of coordination. If he can't get in melee range, he can't attack or lifesteal/spellvamp to sustain himself.

Jax is a champion who excels in 1v1 fights, so if you want to fight him straight up you need someone similar. If you want to 1v1 Jax, I'd recommend trying Trundle, Mundo, Nasus, Riven, Tryndamere, or Udyr. They all have to tools to help them kite him out, escape Jax, or trade with him at pretty much every point of the game. Don't just stand there hitting eachother, but try to kite out his ultimate and back off occasionally to let his passive fall off.

I'm not really sure what level I'm playing at since I get matched with people between gold and diamond pretty much randomly in normals (I haven't bothered with ranked).

Renaille1 votes

They all buy damage and are somewhat useless full tank.

Leblancs Boob1 votes

Literally all of those champions will build multiple damage items. With the exception of jax and maybe pantheon the rest will usually build glass cannon

Roran Atriedes1 votes

I feel like you have missed the real message, which is my fault I guess. I am talking about champions who have oppressively high duel potential, yet still have the ability to fight multiple people at the same time. This combined ability makes them seem nearly invincible. Champs that fit this description to me (Jax LeeSin Diana MonkeyKing Gnar RekSai All have powers that either have multi-hit cc, near invincibility windows, or shields of varying effectiveness. Put them together with competence in play and you have a champ who really only needs one or two damage items to out do nearly anything. This allows them to build tank and become able to tower dive or soak massive damage, which can swing a fight all on its own.

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