Trying to make a Fiora jungle build with high ganking potential. I'm experimenting with rushing all three of these:
1.) Stalker's Blade Warrior (+10 ar-pen) 2.) Ghostblade (+10 ar-pen) 3.) Last Whisper
Is that too much too fast?
Stacking penetration is actually one of the best ways to improve damage on a "caster-type" AD champion (Fiora, Pantheon, Kha'Zix, etc.) Basically, think of pen as multiplying whatever your current physical damage output is.
The only concern is making sure you're not sacrificing other needs of the champion. Fiora does have great synergy with Tiamat for bonus splash damage for her ulti, for example. Increasing your durability can increase your total damage output significantly more than a Brutalizer.
It's only too much when it becomes....Shall we say "unsafe". XD
When he says Base Damages he's means the damage of a skill without the scaling ratio, not auto attacking.
What he's asking is it better to build lots of Armor Pen because the base damage is high enough that Penetration scales better than actual AD, or is penetration deal less damage than AD stacking. Fiora is in that very close state of balance where Pentration and AD are very close in effectiveness, but that AD slightly outscales Penetration in a normal situation.
In my very limited Fiora Jungle experience (I've only tried once on live, and a couple times on PBE), I normally do:
-> 
-> 
and then depending if I need more damage or chase power I either build 
or 
first respectively.
After that, it really depends on how the game goes, but I'll normally pick up 
as my last offensive item and then by that time the game will be over.
Flat penetration should be sufficient enough on Fiora until mid/late game, but if the enemy starts stacking armor, I'd pick up the LW before finishing Youmuu's.
EDIT: Fixed up the items.
as fiora jungle I would be rushing skirmishers blade (bonus on-hit true damage), getting tiamat and boots, finishing the jungle item with warrior, then finishing hydra. After that is 100% situational.
usually going for a bork or cleaver/yomuu's (they building hp or armor?), then a defensive item (randuins, Banshees, Frozen mallet, warmogs)
would be a rather common end game build for me P:
is good with armor pen like madly...but i had a tricky question... so i have Shiv and decide to get sorcerers shoes with magic pen affect the magic damage from shiv? i would think it does.
i rush ghostblade 2nd and LW 3rd on zed because armour has a % of damage reduction so i try to get it as low to 0 as possible, is this a good idea or am i being inefficient with my build?
Is that too much too fast?
You can never have too much penetration. lol ^That's what she said. God, I'm horrible... I miss the days when I was never like this =/
P.S. Serious note, you should always rush Hydra on Fiora as first item. Always. Then you can build whatever else you want.
101%
If i'm going AD Carry, or rather and dps based champ I like to go health/critical chance/ crit damage/ armor pen to execute your spells with it's fullest potential.
On someone like Fiora, it's not a bad idea to get all three of those items, but only get Last Whisper if the enemy team is building tons of armor. In the early game you won't get a whole lot of value out of LW unless the enemy tank gets fed and mananges to get tons of armor to counter your tons of damage.
I did the same thing but arrived at a bit different conclusion. You see going from 0 to 100 armor gives you double the effective health (if your health is 2000 then the amount of physical damage you can take goes from 2000 to 4000) and here 10 flat armor pen reduces that effective health by 200 to 3800 effective health. If you do the same math for 200 armor you would see you end up with reducing their effective health by 200 again but this time it is 200 of 6000 effective health thus a smaller percentage reduction than the first case (5% against 3.3%) which i would say is the correct way to do the comparison. This becomes especially clear when you check the effect it has on lets say 1000 physical damage you deal to your opponent.
Ghostblade gives 20 ar pen fyi
I would wait to get Ghostblade until you have Tiamat, but after that it just depends.
LW is a counter item, you don't build it every single game no matter what and typically not as a rush. You build in response to armor on the targets you're fighting. (E.g. if you're successfully diving the squishies it doesn't matter if the tanks have a lot of armor.)
There's no such thing as too much flat armor pen. (Though I don't play Fiora, I'd think she's a bit AA heavy to love it as much as say Riven does.)
Flat armor pen can reduce armor below 0. As such, you can NEVER have too much of it. Last whisper is only as good once the enemy has around 50+ armor, and only better when they start to build lots of armor items.
I do not yet understand why certain champs(Zed/Jayce/Riven/Talon) seem to rush Last Whisper as a 3rd item, even when the enemy team has no armor built.
