Teamfight Tactics' ranked update... Are they for real? Like... REALLY?

Cräfty·Aug 7, 2019·27 votes·11,096 views

In general, we’re happy with how ranked TFT is working, but a couple inconsistencies have made it a little more forgiving than we intended, so we're making a few changes

Wait what?! Forgiving?! WTF are you talking about?!

You're telling me that spending hours grinding ranked and finally gaining 75 LP after playing 5 games only to lose it all in just ONE loss, where I had a bad game and placed 8th, is intended?

You're telling me that ruining and nullifying the whole progression of a day worth of grinding, by losing once or twice at 8th/7th place, is how you want the ranked system to work, hein?!

Are these guys for real?!

Did these guys even listen or even consider paying attention to the whole freaking community feedback?! Literally 100% of the community thinks the ranked system sucks in TFT and Riot is like:

In general, we’re happy with how ranked TFT is working

HOLY MACARONI, man! GODDAMN!

[zombie-brand-mindblown]

26 Comments

ChalangarAug 7, 20196 votes

I don't see the problem.

When you win 1st place you gain a huge amount of LP, which is rewarding because you outlasted 7 other players--its like winning 7 games of 1 on 1.

Likewise when you end up in 8th (and effectively lost to 7 other players) then you should lose the equivalent amount of LP.

Your reaction seems more emotional than logical. That's fine, not judging, but just saying the reward/punishment scales just fine, in my opinion.

UrgashAug 7, 201911 votes

{quoted}

I don't see the problem.

When you win 1st place you gain a huge amount of LP, which is rewarding because you outlasted 7 other players--its like winning 7 games of 1 on 1.

Likewise when you end up in 8th (and effectively lost to 7 other players) then you should lose the equivalent amount of LP.

Your reaction seems more emotional than logical. That's fine, not judging, but just saying the reward/punishment scales just fine, in my opinion.

You don't, i get 35 Lp max for first place, and lose up to 80-85 if i get 8th. And i'm only Diamond 4. For people in real High ELO this is even worse, i've heard people losing 95 LP on losses, and winning only 25 Lp for first.

So what you're describing is maybe fine in Silver, but not everyone is there.

SubdueAug 7, 20193 votes

{quoted}

You don't, i get 35 Lp max for first place, and lose up to 80-85 if i get 8th. And i'm only Diamond 4. For people in real High ELO this is even worse, i've heard people losing 95 LP on losses, and winning only 25 Lp for first.

So what you're describing is maybe fine in Silver, but not everyone is there.

When your ranking is far enough above the mean, there are too few players for you to play with. Diamond 4 is what, the top .5% in TFT? That means most of the time, you're getting matched with players lower than you. As a result, you are expected to win most of your games, and as such you gain less when you win, and lose more when you lose. The alternative is to make you wait however long it takes to gather 8 Diamond 4 players before letting you start. Your games would then be harder, but you'd also gain/lose about the same.

Worst JG WinsAug 7, 20191 votes

{quoted}

When your ranking is far enough above the mean, there are too few players for you to play with. Diamond 4 is what, the top .5% in TFT? That means most of the time, you're getting matched with players lower than you. As a result, you are expected to win most of your games, and as such you gain less when you win, and lose more when you lose. The alternative is to make you wait however long it takes to gather 8 Diamond 4 players before letting you start. Your games would then be harder, but you'd also gain/lose about the same.

I get these kinds of gains in D2-3 in games filled with players at the very lowest diamond 4 and at the highest top 10 challenger. The majority of my games are with other D3-D1 players. The system has a hidden MMR and if your hidden MMR sucks the game just refuses to give you LP even when you beat players with better MMR that are higher elo.

XinZhao2WinNhaoAug 7, 20191 votes

I'm in plat and my queue times are 5 seconds per game. Sometimes I can't even change my rift arena in the time it takes for me to get a game because the queue times are so short.

I'd rather wait a full minute to queue with other plat or gold 1 players rather than 5 seconds to queue with 2 silver, 3 gold, 1 plat and 1 diamond.

Plat 4 is top 8% of players in TFT I am sure that there are other plat 4 players out there, or players within 1 or 2 divisions. This isn't challenger.

I'm fine playing ranked with G3-P1 players, but please don't put a Silver 4 in my ranked games for the sake of a faster queue and then tank my LP gains.

UrgashAug 7, 20191 votes

{quoted}

When your ranking is far enough above the mean, there are too few players for you to play with. Diamond 4 is what, the top .5% in TFT? That means most of the time, you're getting matched with players lower than you. As a result, you are expected to win most of your games, and as such you gain less when you win, and lose more when you lose. The alternative is to make you wait however long it takes to gather 8 Diamond 4 players before letting you start. Your games would then be harder, but you'd also gain/lose about the same.

There are a lot of people hitting diamond in my friends list, i even went D3 about an hour ago, is this really the high end of players ? what you describe sounds like Challenger to me.

But Either way, like a lot of people here, i don't have the need for a game to start in 5 seconds if it can't be with people of my own rank and/or MMR. In any case, from Iron to Diamond i saw a steep decline in LP gains at First place, which i thought was normal and not a side-effect of different MMR between players. I just thought it was harder and harder to climb the higher you went. The whole thing is kinda opaque if you ask me.

SubdueAug 7, 20191 votes

{quoted}

There are a lot of people hitting diamond in my friends list, i even went D3 about an hour ago, is this really the high end of players ? what you describe sounds like Challenger to me.

But Either way, like a lot of people here, i don't have the need for a game to start in 5 seconds if it can't be with people of my own rank and/or MMR. In any case, from Iron to Diamond i saw a steep decline in LP gains at First place, which i thought was normal and not a side-effect of different MMR between players. I just thought it was harder and harder to climb the higher you went. The whole thing is kinda opaque if you ask me.

https://lolchess.gg/leaderboards?region=na

Diamond 4 consists of .64% of the population in NA.

UrgashAug 7, 20191 votes

{quoted}

https://lolchess.gg/leaderboards?region=na

Diamond 4 consists of .64% of the population in NA.

okay, here in EUW, i'm "only" top 3% by being Diamond 3 so it's a bit more but we have more players ofc.

CräftyAug 8, 20191 votes

https://lolchess.gg/leaderboards?region=euw

D4 are 0.55% and D3 are 0.18% of the player base in EUW.

Ryan hereAug 7, 20191 votes

You're Gold 3. It's very different the higher rating you get.

Worst JG WinsAug 7, 20191 votes

{quoted}

I don't see the problem.

When you win 1st place you gain a huge amount of LP, which is rewarding because you outlasted 7 other players--its like winning 7 games of 1 on 1.

Likewise when you end up in 8th (and effectively lost to 7 other players) then you should lose the equivalent amount of LP.

Your reaction seems more emotional than logical. That's fine, not judging, but just saying the reward/punishment scales just fine, in my opinion.

In high elo you often gain almost nothing. My last 5 wins or so in Diamond have all resulted in +34-36 for first place. 6th Place has given me as much as -61. 8th has taken me from 81 LP to 0.

You know how insane it is to get 1st 2nd 3rd and the 8th over 4 games and lose elo.

rescuedAug 7, 20191 votes

{quoted}

I don't see the problem.

When you win 1st place you gain a huge amount of LP, which is rewarding because you outlasted 7 other players--its like winning 7 games of 1 on 1.

Likewise when you end up in 8th (and effectively lost to 7 other players) then you should lose the equivalent amount of LP.

Your reaction seems more emotional than logical. That's fine, not judging, but just saying the reward/punishment scales just fine, in my opinion.

1st place you don't gain 75lp. Losing at 8th place can lose you 75+lp. Im in Gold 1, gaining 45 for 1st place and losing 65 for 8th

tiresAug 7, 20195 votes

Wait what? Losing at 0lp while at challenger immediately demotes you to diamond 1?

That seems extremely harsh... what were they thinking? Being demoted three full ranks for one loss that is insane

haaaaaaalpAug 7, 20191 votes

There are no promotions. You can gain a rank with just 1-2 high finishes. It shouldn’t be taking you a whole day to move up.

Ryan hereAug 7, 20191 votes

In lower ratings sure. Not when you hit high Plat +

haaaaaaalpAug 7, 20191 votes

I was +60 for first all the way to diamond. 2 first place was guaranteed more than a full rank.

Ryan hereAug 7, 20191 votes

I assume you have a different account you play TFT on then :P

CräftyAug 7, 20191 votes

Hmmm, unless you have a different account, your lolchess.gg profile shows you're at Plat 4 and never reached Diamond.

But you have a good WR, I'll give you that. So maybe you're right? Idk...

I don't have the best WR out there, I'mma be honest. But I'm usually top 4, if not top 3 / top 2, most of the time. Since Wins in TFT are calculated with how many times you reached 1st place. But still, for the average player, this current LP system sucks and is more frustrating than exciting or thrilling.

ChargeItDownMidAug 7, 20192 votes

{quoted}

Hmmm, unless you have a different account, your lolchess.gg profile shows you're at Plat 4 and never reached Diamond.

But you have a good WR, I'll give you that. So maybe you're right? Idk...

I don't have the best WR out there, I'mma be honest. But I'm usually top 4, if not top 3 / top 2, most of the time. Since Wins in TFT are calculated with how many times you reached 1st place. But still, for the average player, this current LP system sucks and is more frustrating than exciting or thrilling.

My bad. I changed accounts once I got my main to diamond because i’ve been trying to get the game to work on tablet. League is surprisingly bad at handling touchscreen mode and I’m getting to the point where I think I will need to get an auto hit key script just to reroll properly.

Anyway i feel the lp gains/losses were always fair and depended on the stray that I used. When I was going risky starts, I would lose a ton on 8th place but got large lp on first place. When I changed to a more consistent strat, I only got 10-30 for 2-4 but almost never got eight.

imortaloneAug 7, 20191 votes

I think the LP gain might be better on tft then on the normal rank... If your dead last your luck that match is the worst... lp loss hardcore makes since... your last dude. I've gotten 8th and 7th quite a few times..

if you finish 5th you still beat 3 other people so you lose less lp.. I like that idea.

also like how you dont have to win 2 out of 3 matches to move up a rank in TFT... Thats annoying in the normal rank.. Hate losing 1 match with near 0lp, then having to play 4-30 matches to get promoted again perhaps you wont even get promoted again: thats the normal rank system...

PS Waiting for the Normal Rank to reset again... Last normal rank reset wasn't a real reset..

Posui GartAug 7, 20191 votes

It was forgiving in another sense. You could lose at 0 lp without demoting. That resulted in people climbing at negative WR, their rank went up while mmr went down, which resulted in huge lp loss/low lp gains for them. At least thats what I think happened. It is also highly possible Riot just fucked up again

XinZhao2WinNhaoAug 7, 20191 votes

If you get 2 5th places you lose 25 LP when you demote since demotions auto take you to 75 LP, even if you would have lost only 5 LP per fifth place loss if you didn't demote.

So it balances out

Jennifer420Aug 7, 20191 votes

me: i know i shouldnt read it because riot is doing something r%%%%%ed again and ignoring all the feedback i know it!

also me a few seconds later: WTF ARE THEY DOING AND WHY DID I READ IT

i guess im as stupid as riot

Preheated OvenAug 8, 20191 votes

I dont understand why you would play a ranked game mode based off of complete RNG :\

CräftyAug 8, 20192 votes

I'm tired of answering to people who think TFT is 100% RNG and no skill. So here is my response on this matter, copy pasted from the dozense of threads and comments I wrote myself:

You're trying to have an opinion on the competitive aspect of TFT without actually trying it for yourself.

Every game, whether it's video games or other games like soccer or basketball, can seem less skill expressive when played at a normal " for fun " level, or not played at all. Take them to a competitive scene and you'll notice all the skills required to actually win against others and be among the best.

The same thing applies to regular League and TFT. You won't notice how the game actually requires skill until you participate in the war that is ranked. Once you get beaten by the ones better than you, even if the RNG was against them, because they are more skilled and made better decisions than you, then you will realize how skill actually matters in these games, as well!

Also, the game is not only luck and positioning. One of the hardest part of the game is knowing when to transition between comps and know when to give up on going a certain comp. The game, although screwed up by the current RNG system, still has a big skill element of decision making to it.

This becomes even more important when you have bad luck with items. Knowing how to bypass the bad RNG and make the right decisions based on what is or is not being played by other players, what units/items are available to me from the shop/PvE rounds, what state are the units in (2+ stars or not), what enemy comps have blitz, etc.

If you bypass the RNG aspect of the game, there is so much more to do and to learn from playing it competitively. As someone in D4, I can tell the difference between someone who plays the game only in normals, someone in silver, and someone in D4+. The quality of the games are so much different and the skill expression is very apparent in higher elos.

AaaandyAug 9, 20191 votes

{quoted}

I'm tired of answering to people who think TFT is 100% RNG and no skill. So here is my response on this matter, copy pasted from the dozense of threads and comments I wrote myself: Every game, whether it's video games or other games like soccer or basketball, can seem less skill expressive when played at a normal " for fun " level, or not played at all. Take them to a competitive scene and you'll notice all the skills required to actually win against others and be among the best. The same thing applies to regular League and TFT. You won't notice how the game actually requires skill until you participate in the war that is ranked. Once you get beaten by the ones better than you, even if the RNG was against them, because they are more skilled and made better decisions than you, then you will realize how skill actually matters in these games, as well! Also, the game is not only luck and positioning. One of the hardest part of the game is knowing when to transition between comps and know when to give up on going a certain comp. The game, although screwed up by the current RNG system, still has a big skill element of decision making to it. This becomes even more important when you have bad luck with items. Knowing how to bypass the bad RNG and make the right decisions based on what is or is not being played by other players, what units/items are available to me from the shop/PvE rounds, what state are the units in (2+ stars or not), what enemy comps have blitz, etc. If you bypass the RNG aspect of the game, there is so much more to do and to learn from playing it competitively. As someone in D4, I can tell the difference between someone who plays the game only in normals, someone in silver, and someone in D4+. The quality of the games are so much different and the skill expression is very apparent in higher elos.

Of course, this mode is not 100% RNG，however RNG plays a big part in this mode compared to other modes such as SR. I understand what you are saying, I'm in D4 as well and currently because of the poor Rank system I'm playing with my smurf account. It's really easy for me to get Platinum with my smurf account since my skill level is higher, I could almost guarantee to get Top 3 every game. However when I got Platinum, even just Platinum 4, my climbing speed kinda slows down since the difference of skill between me and other Platinum players is not that much. I got 7th/8th place a couple of times because of bad luck. And that's OK. What's not ok is the LP system. You lost way more LP than you gain in high elo games, and that doesn't make sense because in those games even if you are better than the other players, you are not like 2 times better than them, you might be 5-10% better than them, I know it's kinda impossible to measure skills in a percentage but you get the point. In those games, RNG is going to really affect the result. Therefore, It's really unreasonable when you win 2-3 games and lose 1 game and you actually lose LP in total.