Seriously, Riot, fuck you.

Niyumi··1 votes·1,065 views

Honestly, that's all I can say to you. Fuck you. The way you run your company, and the fact that you're F2P, is just asinine. I really hope the God damned brats that enabled the whole F2P scam wake up and realize what they caused.

But hey, it's fun to destroy entire industries for the sake of entitled, lazy kids who need to grow up -- but that goes against what society preaches, so it'll never happen.

Sure is nice to watch the hobby you've loved for as long as you can remember die in front of you, and knowing there's not a thing you can do to save it. Thanks for destroying gaming, kiddies.

18 Comments

darkmatchwaldo4 votes

Who pooped in your cereal?

alasarcher3 votes

Seems like someone lost game to Teemo Teemo Nothing else could make a person this mad

ModWulf Helhammer1 votes

I don't exactly see how this version of the free to play model is a problem when the only stuff you can't get from playing the game is cosmetic

Niyumi2 votes

Have you ever worked at an F2P company, or talked to anyone who does?

If not, let me explain a couple things to you:

  • First, in a P2P game, your income stems from player retention, which you earn through quality of content and frequent updates. In other words: If people are having fun playing your game, you make money.

  • In an F2P game, your income stems from cash shop sales. This means that you will do whatever it takes in order to push people into spending money.


So what does that mean for you, as the consumer?

If you're playing a P2P game, it means that the developer wants to keep you happy and having fun, so that you keep paying that subscription, which makes them money. So they will make sure the game is fun and enjoyable at all levels, and release quality content that keeps you coming back for more.

  • Balance is a big deal here, since FOTM classes / characters don't make money through spikes in skin/cosmetic sales.

  • Lore is a high priority, since a lot of people play video games for the story -- and in a P2P game, you actually make money off your lore.

  • New content is frequently released, and old content will often get touched up from time to time, to keep it fresh.

  • The game is made to be challenging, but enjoyable, so that people don't beat it in a day and get bored.

  • Quality is a very high priority, since shoddy workmanship will make players dissatisfied.

So, basically, a P2P game is made with quality in mind, since it's that quality that makes them money, since quality enables player retention. Now, of course there will be a bit of time-gating through weekly/daily lockouts, the whole concept of levels and so on, but, generally, the time gates enhance the experience.

Now, let's say you're playing an F2P game! Here, your income source is the cash shop -- your base game is irrelevant if people don't throw money at things. Oftentimes, this means that companies will make the base game so unbearable that you're all but forced into throwing money at the cash shop for "premium" services and whatnot -- more often than not, these "services" are things that should have been in the game to begin with, but was withheld by the developer as a source of revenue.

  • Balance is irrelevant, since (in most cases), if every class/character was viable, there would be no way to spike sales for cosmetics/skins.

  • Lore is irrelevant, since it costs money to write, and ultimately has no income potential.

  • New content is on the back burner, and will be half-assed and rushed.

  • The game is made to be so fucking easy that a braindead toddler could not only play the game, but excel.

  • Quality is irrelevant, since player retention is not the goal.

So, in an F2P game, the developer focuses on the cash shop over their own game, and really doesn't give a damn about anything but money. At ANet (an NCsoft owned company that runs GW2), employees in the various departments are assigned a quota for items in the cash shop, and are forced to drop any and all real content they're working on in order to fill said quota. If they don't, they risk being fired or docked in pay. Content and player retention aren't the goal anymore, so they will do the bare minimum to keep people playing, and nothing more.

P2P = Quality, player retention

F2P = Greed, player extortion


So, even if a company has "good" F2P models, it's still an F2P company. Riot is no different.

ModWulf Helhammer1 votes

Yeah sure, if the f2p model charges for things that help you in game and what not. If the only thing that costs you money is stuff that is purely optional to buy, you're only going to buy stuff if you want to.

You are making a huge generalization when it comes to the overall market of free games vs paid or subscription based games

Niyumi1 votes

Again, it doesn't matter what they charge for; the F2P philosophy is one and the same. If Riot could get away with selling power boosts and whatnot without pissing off the entire playerbase, you should damned well be sure they would.

And, you ever wonder why it takes them 8-10 months to make a new champion with four buttons, or to update an old champion? It's because they don't make a whole lot of money from it. Making little "events" to promote skins and whatnot is where most of their money comes from, as well as LC$.

Or how about the fact that it takes them years to fix a bug? Or disabling an item for an entire patch cycle because they're too cheap to upload the fix?

That's the consequence of F2P in this game.

ModWulf Helhammer1 votes

No, they would not, because that would lead to people leaving, in the same sense of a subscription model.

There is no benefit to them for making the game so bad that a large percentage of people leave it because, either way, they still lose money. If they were a subscription model, then people would drop subs. They are a free model, so if people leave, then there is no one to buy skins.

You can't just say "it's this model, so therefore it's the exact same way every time", because it's not. If anything, Riot has an even more incentive to keep people, as skin purchases are essentially subscriptions, but are unreliable since people don't need them to play. So if people don't like the game 100%, they aren't going to buy skins

Niyumi1 votes

"... without pissing off the entire playerbase..." -- didn't read that part, did'ja?

If the income from selling power is larger than the loss from people leaving, then it will eventually happen. Thankfully, people aren't quite that moronic -- yet.

And actually, Riot doesn't care if you play a day or a decade; so long as you throw money at the cash shop, it's a win for them -- and you'd be surprised what people will throw money at. 100% liking the game isn't a factor for the large majority of the people who play this game.

After watching many companies go from great to horrible, and watching many horrible companies crawl out of the muck, yeah, I can pretty confidently say that there is no such thing as a "good" F2P company -- they're all slimy, greedy cesspools that I wish didn't exist.

SithesisLord2 votes
  • First, in a P2P game, your income stems from player retention, which you earn through quality of content and frequent updates. In other words: If people are having fun playing your game, you make money.

Wrong. If people are paying, you make money. Fun has no place in the equation. You know why? Some people, most actually, wrongly purchase the lifetime subscription or a yearly subscription, and in most P2P games, safe for some exceptions, subscriptions provide little to no advantage whatsoever.

  • In an F2P game, your income stems from cash shop sales. This means that you will do whatever it takes in order to push people into spending money.

Wrong again. Riot does not push you to purchase RP to buy things. Because firstly, RP priced items that are not cosmetic only also cost IP(Rune pages, runes, champions). The cosmetic only items are optional. I don´t see Riot forcing you to buy that DJ Sona, Spirit Guard Udyr or PROJECT Yi skins. Sure, the marketing is convincing, but it´s not pushing. It´s marketing. It´s how the business works. You advertise something with the 'this is irresistible' implication stapled to it. If people get convinced, they buy. If not, they don´t.

If you're playing a P2P game, it means that the developer wants to keep you happy and having fun, so that you keep paying that subscription, which makes them money. So they will make sure the game is fun and enjoyable at all levels, and release quality content that keeps you coming back for more.

  • Balance is a big deal here, since FOTM classes / characters don't make money through spikes in skin/cosmetic sales.

  • Lore is a high priority, since a lot of people play video games for the story -- and in a P2P game, you actually make money off your lore.

  • New content is frequently released, and old content will often get touched up from time to time, to keep it fresh.

  • The game is made to be challenging, but enjoyable, so that people don't beat it in a day and get bored.

  • Quality is a very high priority, since shoddy workmanship will make players dissatisfied.

So, basically, a P2P game is made with quality in mind, since it's that quality that makes them money, since quality enables player retention. Now, of course there will be a bit of time-gating through weekly/daily lockouts, the whole concept of levels and so on, but, generally, the time gates enhance the experience.

This is VERY often the same for most F2P games.

Now, let's say you're playing an F2P game! Here, your income source is the cash shop -- your base game is irrelevant if people don't throw money at things. Oftentimes, this means that companies will make the base game so unbearable that you're all but forced into throwing money at the cash shop for "premium" services and whatnot -- more often than not, these "services" are things that should have been in the game to begin with, but was withheld by the developer as a source of revenue.

  • Balance is irrelevant, since (in most cases), if every class/character was viable, there would be no way to spike sales for cosmetics/skins.

No, balance is relevant. Without balance, the game would get stale pretty fast, with a single way to do things. Despite Riot's balancing being a bit biased(Then again, even P2P games have that), it exists. It´s not perfect, but it exists.

  • Lore is irrelevant, since it costs money to write, and ultimately has no income potential.

Bilgewater Event. Jhin teasers. Kindred. Illaoi's story. Need i go on?

  • New content is on the back burner, and will be half-assed and rushed.

A game company can have as much money and as many employees as they want, content will still be difficult and time consuming to make. Besides...Taric rework. Yorick rework. Mage update. Aurelion Sol(Rippi in kippi Ao Shin). All those are contents being worked on. But Riot is taking is slow in order to get at least most of it correctly.

  • The game is made to be so fucking easy that a braindead toddler could not only play the game, but excel.

Hyperbole OP.

  • Quality is irrelevant, since player retention is not the goal.

Is League a quality game? Better than the crap EA has been putting out ever since BF3. And better than what Ubisoft's been doing since Rainbow Six 3.

So yes, it is. The community just make it seem bad. And yes, player retention is A goal. Not THE goal, but A goal. If it wasn´t the case, normal, bot and custom games wouldn´t exist. ARAM wouldn´t exist. Only ranked would, and everyone would start out in it from level 1 onward.

So, in an F2P game, the developer focuses on the cash shop over their own game, and really doesn't give a damn about anything but money. At ANet (an NCsoft owned company that runs GW2), employees in the various departments are assigned a quota for items in the cash shop, and are forced to drop any and all real content they're working on in order to fill said quota. If they don't, they risk being fired or docked in pay. Content and player retention aren't the goal anymore, so they will do the bare minimum to keep people playing, and nothing more.

The same old 'F2P is garbage' blah blah blah. Seriously, if you hate it so much, why the heck are you even still here? So you can drag your ass on burnt coal and hurt it more?

P2P = Quality, player retention

F2P = Greed, player extortion


So, even if a company has "good" F2P models, it's still an F2P company. Riot is no different.

Except Riot is actually doing a good job in most points.

All i can get from this thread is a major butthurt. Honestly, one downvote is far too little for this.

BeatzBoyFTW1 votes

But hey, it's fun to destroy entire industries for the sake of entitled, lazy kids who need to grow up

Sounds like you got permabanned for being toxic huh. How sensitive were YOU?

Niyumi2 votes

Nope, never been banned from any game. Just tired of companies pandering to kids who really shouldn't even be playing video games, since they might have to put in an ounce of effort.

DexterousGecko1 votes

Are you going to tell us what exactly you're upset about? Something obviously happened. Tell us. Enough of this vague f2p bullshit.

Niyumi1 votes

I'm upset that Riot doesn't give a damn, and blatantly lies to our faces about things like "balance" and the fact that they "care" about their game.

I'm upset that my childhood hobby (gaming) is just dead and buried because of the whole F2P / DLC scam that morons enabled, leading to the rise of a bunch of greedy as hell companies that release garbage.

I'm upset that my free time consists of sleeping, staring at a wall, or playing video games/watching shows/reading books I really can't stand.

I'm upset that greed is the driving force in society, and that everyone is taught to be a horrible person.

I'm upset that people don't care about what they do anymore, and just do what it takes to make money.

And so on.

Support Bοt1 votes

What the hell are you talking about? It is their product, if they want to destroy it, they may do it aswell... You are not forced to play(i hope), so if you are not happy just leave it.

Pacothegint1 votes

INB4 Riot is near to releasing a way to get free cosmetic Items.

Swerzz1 votes

Let's just take 20% off the top there why don't we bud

Earl Eulrich1 votes

there´s sooo much right now to call them out for...and you choose the single thing they did right?

f*** ***

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