Riot is looking to buff mages that are underplayed/outclassed. Can you look at Brand?

Yfrappefort·Jul 17, 2014·8 votes·1,103 views

Let's be fair, Brand is a hot mage. I like him a lot. But currently, there is no reason to pick him. At all.

is supposed to be the king of AoE/raw damage and is what I consider a "mid range mage" (long range being and , for exemple). Yet he is outclassed by some mages pretty hard atm.

got as much damage as he does. However, he also brings safety, more waveclear/pushing power and global pressure.

again got as much damage. However, she also brings loads of utility (MS, slow, shield) and her ultimate is simply devastating.

Add to this that their ultimate are way more reliable then Brand's (this guy MUST have minions/other champions around when he ult or it goes to waste, and even then it's still random).

What else does Brand bring aside from damage. A stun? and also got one, but it does not require them to hit the enemy with 2 spells to connect. Syndra can also stun many targets pretty quickly (and it last almost as long as Brand). Brand's stun is pretty unreliable and hard to land when fighting any champions with mobility (hello current meta!) It's not even that rewarding to land (Only last 2 seconds at all rank. Maybe scaling it to 3 secs at rank 5 would make it feel better?).

So what can we do to make Brand stands out? I think the first thing would be to remove some of the limitations of his ultimate. Make it bounce on himself when there is no other targets around (similar to E). This way, you don't feel bad when using it in a 1v1 scenario when no minions are around.

Another thing would be to maybe revert the range/mana nerf on his E. Brand is supposed to be a lane bully, yet again the mages above do a better job then him at that.

Anyway, I'dd really like if could get some attention. Since his release in early 2011, this guy really never stood in the spotlight (unlike who just got buffed a bit again to help her reclaim some popularity).

22 Comments

NateKillerJul 17, 20142 votes

I agree. He could use some help.

xXSomeoneElseJul 17, 20142 votes

yes brand could use a nice little buff, maybe reduce his mana costs or cds, I enjoy playing a lot but his abilities cost so much mana im dry after like 4 spells, as with all champs some are better than others depending on personal preferences and playstyles for instance, I am not able for the life of me to land a Blitzcrank rocket grab, but im god with the Thresh hooks but I do agree that needs some kind of attention to bring him back in the meta because he is a really fun champ to play.

Czar Matt DamonJul 17, 20142 votes

there are many mobility-based mages and assassins that are top-pick right now, which outscale many of the traditional mages, like brand, xerath and syndra. syndra is less so, however, because her stun can also push people away if she misses and is pretty reliable to hit, with a huge hitbox and range. xerath is easier to hit than brand's because his is just one button. he doesn't have to set up a combo just to stun a person.

brand's entire kit revolves around combo'ing. the only problem with this is that his entire combo relies on hitting one spell and then another: his stun. there needs to be more variance to how brand combos in most situations.

YfrappefortJul 17, 20141 votes

I was thinking that maybe they could give some of his spells the "ablaze" effect by default, but make them stronger when the target is actually ablaze.

For exemple, his Q could stun for like 1/1.25./1.50./1.75/2 secs when not ablaze and 2/2.25/2.50/2.75/3 secs when ablaze. It's still a single target stun, but it should feel more rewarding if you actually set the combo up.

His W would stay the same (I don't see how we could change it). His E could spread by default, but deal more damage if the initial target was ablaze.

His ultimate should be at maximum projectile speed by default and would prioritize champions if the first target is ablaze.

Anyway, just tossing out some ideas.

Czar Matt DamonJul 17, 20141 votes

would probably do something, although i doubt they'd make his stun last even longer than 2 seconds. many complain about it already, although he needs the two seconds.

E should probably have limited spread, say to 3 objects, then have it spread to all if ablaze.

Czar Matt DamonJul 17, 20141 votes

i like your ult idea though.

KSHarrisonJul 17, 20141 votes

Would love to see Brand resurge. I posted the same idea on GD in a Brand main thread a while back and they said that his ult bouncing off himself would be OP?

Dunno. Ziggs and Ori are OP though, Ori for a long time now, or maybe she should be the "Renekton bar" of what other non-mobility mages need to be.

Czar Matt DamonJul 17, 20141 votes

orianna is probably a great bar to set for non-mobility-based mages. another good bar would be zyra with her super-ult.

FunsterJul 17, 20141 votes

The only way to help him now is to give him his obscene levels of damage back or to give him mobility like every single other mage that gets picked.

League of Mobility will not allow Brand to exist in a satisfactory state.

LastProtagonistJul 17, 20141 votes

I main Brand and wreck a lot of players with him. I think he's in an alright spot, but that being said, I think the idea to let the ult bounce off of himself is a wonderful idea.

I don't know how you build Brand, but my go to start is two Doran's Rings, Rylais, Liandry's, Tanky stuff (Zhonya's, Randuins, etc.) If you build Brand into being a slow burn utility mage/off tank, he can really balance out a lot of team comps since his passive continues to proc Rylai's and Liandry's.

I would not be against some mana/mana cost buffs, however.

Czar Matt DamonJul 17, 20141 votes

i start with doran's, move to athene's, then sorc boots and rylai's plus liandry's. i haven't tried getting rylai's first yet though. after that, i usually build rabadon's then zhonya's. beyond rylai's and zhonya's, i haven't used tanky items on brand because i prefer being able to 100% a carry.

Ashe JungleJul 17, 20141 votes

item 3116 item 3020 item 3151 item 3135 item 3110 ( item 3102 / item 3027 )

Makes brand pretty tanky, pretty devastating with aoe damage.

PhailRaptorJul 17, 20141 votes

I gagged at item 3110 You'd be much better with item 3174 for mana, and item 3157 for Armor. Both of which give you a much higher damage output to boot.

Ashe JungleJul 22, 20141 votes

OP was talking about tank builds, so I gave one.

If I build Athene's, I lost out on armor, which works really well with the high hp from rylai/liandry. If I build zhonya's, I lose a little tankiness, mana, and cdr.

As a midlane mage brand should be relying on positioning to keep him safe over tankiness, so I think it would be better to build your two items than FH and banshee's; my build is more suited to Tulane. However, the punt remains that OP asked for tanky builds, so that's what I gave -- a tanky build that relies on passive & liandry to do damage, not his ratios.

PhailRaptorJul 17, 20141 votes

His ultimate is the only thing holding him back. If it was made to be more reliable, he would easily join the upper tier crowd.

Czar Matt DamonJul 17, 20141 votes

the ult isn't good in 1v1s unless you have something else to bounce off. in 2v1s it really shines however. in teamfights, if you manage to spread fire using W and E, his ult can easily deal huge amounts of damage, and can be added onto if you decided to Q, E, R then W after the ult has finished for an extra 25% damage off the W passive.

it is true however that brand's ult is unreliable unless you light people on fire first, the fact remains that the only easy way to do it is using W.

PhailRaptorJul 17, 20143 votes

Even if you light multiple targets on fire and hit them with his ultimate, his ultimate likes to play with minions that are not on fire. I can't begin to tell you how many times I've fought an opponent in a minion wave, had the passive on the enemy champion and 3+ minions all in range. Ult bounces off the enemy, through 3 minions, then finally back to the champion. Instead, it should have bounced from the enemy, to a burning minion, back to the enemy, another burning minion, and then the 3rd hit on the enemy.

It's even more inconsistent than GD's moderation.

ILoveTiramisuJul 17, 20141 votes

brand outclassed/underplayed? In EUW I see him everyday.

The5lackerJul 18, 20141 votes

I wouldn't say Ori has nearly the same damage as Brand, his burst rotation is downright ludicrous. Ziggs is an enormous problem child at the moment mostly due to his incredibly easy and lazy zoning. Syndra's stun actually does require two spells, and Xerath's is only a 2 second stun at extreme ranges.

Brands identity is that he does damage. And he does a LOT of damage. That's what he does. That's all he really need to do, as he does a METRIC FUCKTON of it. Brand is one of the few mages that scares tanks, that is in and of itself worth noting.

YfrappefortJul 19, 20141 votes

Indeed, Syndra's stun does require two spells, but you don't NEED to hit both of them. In fact, most of the time you will see her dropping a ball in the fog of war, and then bam, she launch a very fast stun at her opponent from there. It's way more easy to set-up and hit then Brand's stun, and it's also AoE.

The5lackerJul 29, 20141 votes

Yes, it also doesn't last 2 seconds and Syndra doesn't have nearly the same AoE damage as Brand, nor the potentially bizarre utility (Rylai's + Liandry's. What are these "tanks" you speak of?)

Brand is fine. He has a potentially ludicrous damage output, strong harassment, fairly reliable single target CC, and one of the strongest 2v1 ults in the game. He's unpopular due to his lack of mobility. That's kinda immobile mages in general. Only thing he really needs changed is a mana cost reduction on his E. Short range as hell and mediocre damage, no reason for it to cost 90 mana.