Anyone else finding this World very disapointing?

Yfrappefort·Oct 25, 2015·210 votes·12,093 views

Most matches going 3-0, and pretty one sided. Sure, the group stage was fun, but god the bracket stage is horrible (not even one series got to 5 matches).

Team abusing broken picks like and (Riot's fault). Poor jungle and support diversity overall (aside the rare niche picks). Double is too dominant and suffocate pretty much any other strategy. The early game is now a farming chicken fest, since any aggression get punished heavily.

and being perma baned reduce ban choices for red team especially. To top it off, Korea VS Korea finals...

Sure, the most skilled teams deserve to advance, but I think Riot messed up big time by doing so many big champions changes just before Worlds.

Edit : Thanks for keeping the thread civilized for the most part, even if you don't agree with my opinion. I am reading all posts so keep sharing your thoughts!

261 Comments

TheNameIsJohnnyOct 25, 201556 votes

GP, Morde, Fiora and Catfish IS the main issue. Red side is basically fked. Riot dont care about real balance but "PLAYSSSSSSSSSSSSS" and "OPPPPPPPPPPPPPP".

Yuumi or LoseOct 25, 20159 votes

I never understood the whole red side thing. Explain why red side is screwed up?

YorukinOct 25, 20155 votes

Red side gets second pick, so any OP champions that slip through the ban phase always get picked by blue side right away. Once that happens, red is stuck needing to deal with overbearingly strong enemies, which at the Worlds skill level pretty much decides the game.

Photos of GhostsOct 25, 20153 votes

But red gets the first 2-pick rotation, so if you let all 3 OP chps go through you can have 2 as red side.

BiffoloOct 25, 20155 votes

Think of it like this, blue side last bans elise after none of the other op's are banned. Red then HAS to ban Gp, giving blue morde. Red can't just take the trade for gp and morde, since gp is better overall and counters morde in teamfights.

kile147Oct 25, 201533 votes

Blue side gets first pick, so the burden of banning the super OP champs is on Red side because if they don't ban them blue side can pick them up first.

Photos of GhostsOct 25, 20158 votes

They can pick ONE first, but then red side can pick two of them.

killd0zerOct 25, 201517 votes

very wrong

Not all "op" champions are created equally. GP and Mord are near mandatory bans. I ban op champs I don't like, you ban the OP champs you absolutely have to.

Photos of GhostsOct 25, 20152 votes

Uhm do you realise your 5 sentences (counting the , as a division) are totally unrelated one from another and from what I said?

dapositivevikingOct 25, 201515 votes

they meant you, as red side, have to ban those champs almost mandatorily or else it's almost a guaranteed loss

ChaoticPineconeOct 25, 20153 votes

Not really. In the Semis, SKT banned Morde and GP from the blue side game 1, and Morde from the blue side game 3. And if you watch the remade game between EDG and Fnatic, Fnatic called EDG's bluff - EDG were forced into first picking Morde since it was left open, but then in the remade game EDG went ahead and banned Morde on Blue.

Actually, if you look at the bans, you see a weird trend where the teams are outthinking themselves: In game 1 of the semis, SKT banned Tahm. In game 2, Tahm was open - but OG gave it to SKT. Was Tahm a necessary ban game 1? In game 1 and 2, OG banned Lulu. In game 3 Lulu was open for SKT to first pick, but they didnt even want it. Was it a necessary ban game 1 and 2 for OG?

Everyone seemed to forget that RekSai would be such a contested pick that they didnt think that securing Rek Sai 1st on the Blue side would leave everything else open on the Red side.

TurquoiseYoshiOct 25, 201539 votes

The top lane is too OP right now.

The jungle is too underpowered.

The mid lane is too boring (Teleport every match, Veigar being good)

The ADCs are just Jinx, Cait into Jinx, and Morde being banned.

The supports are the Kench, Alistar, and Thresh every game, with Braum and Morg being rare picks.

OshletOct 25, 20156 votes

I dislike how the current competitive meta essentially requires all junglers to rush cinderhulk, sightstone and then either aegis or dead man's plate. A carry jungler in the lcs might be fun to watch.

WeatheredOct 25, 20154 votes

{quoted}

The top lane is too OP right now.

The jungle is too underpowered.

The mid lane is too boring (Teleport every match, Veigar being good)

The ADCs are just Jinx, Cait into Jinx, and Morde being banned.

The supports are the Kench, Alistar, and Thresh every game, with Braum and Morg being rare picks.

The jungle is too underpowered? I agree with mostly the rest, but jg isn't really underpowered right now. Elise is a great pick, Lee sin is awesome, Tahm has been haunting challenger for a while, devourer runeglaive and cinderhulk give a variety of paths, etc.

TurquoiseYoshiOct 25, 20155 votes

It feels like, apart from some good early starts, none of the junglers have major impact late. They just do well early, and then try to be tanky late.

Beacon 0F LightOct 25, 201532 votes

Agreed. Sooo many factors have made this such a disappointing Worlds.

-All the dumb powerpicks that burden not only Red side specifically but both sides in general. Morde, Fiora, GP, Darius, Tahm, etc. Not to mention picks that have been strong for a while in competitive like Kalista, Thresh, Viktor, etc. -Cloud 9 making it instead of a team like Liquid (who I personally would've liked to see at Worlds). -NA getting wiped -No five game series -Semifinals only have two regions -Finals only have one region -Super dominant team (I hate teams like SKT and SSW that just completely dominate. Like, props to them for being so good, but it makes competition SOOOOO stale when pretty much everyone knows who's gonna win the whole thing before it even begins).

Granted most of this isn't Riot's fault, but it's just been sooooo boring the whole way through. The most exciting thing so far for me has been watching Pain make it further than any other wildcard team ever. Darius pentas don't even feel earned. Games either get dragged out too long or are done in the blink of an eye when SKT plays. If SKT wins the finals it will officially be the most disappointing Worlds yet.

FórsaOct 25, 20154 votes

I don't agree only with "-Semifinals only have two regions" it's not that bad when it's like 2-2. And ofc it's not Riot fault.

Dr PoroOct 25, 20157 votes

The only thing Riot could "fix" is the super dominant teams by simply throwing a bunch of RNG into the game. I doubt that is what people would like to see, though :p

Reynard the ƒoxOct 25, 201531 votes

Monte literally used the word 'bullshit' to describe the Worlds patch

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=axPGz_Hf_FA

I've been saying it since last month before Worlds began, 5.18 is an absolutely terrible patch to hold Worlds on. Honestly, this tournament has been a joke.

xJLx MCHammerOct 25, 201529 votes

I'm only disappointed how teams have tilted. FNC played very bad vs Koo. C9 that couldn't pick up one win CLG edg and lgd all looking really bad

And of course seeing the same team likely to win is also ugh.

Death VizierOct 25, 201521 votes

Is it just me or are players tilting more at this worlds?

WukongzOct 25, 201524 votes

I loved the group stages. However once we hit quarter finals, the games became boring.

Smart KittyOct 25, 201520 votes

Well I thought the group stage was very interesting. After that it got really boring.

Rinky DinkyOct 25, 201519 votes

This is statistically the most diverse worlds we have seen so far....

WhismurmurOct 25, 20159 votes

diverse doesnt mean more entertaining , they're all boring picks.

Rinky DinkyOct 25, 201519 votes

Has statistically been the most viewed and well received worlds

Just because a vocal minority cries doesn't mean you are right lol

CasterGilgameshOct 25, 20155 votes

first off the off meta picks are very slim and the only reason we saw zac was gragus was disabled its been nothing but Thresh Alistar TahmKench Elise Jinx Tristana Lulu Gnar Darius Fiora Azir

ModCaptainMårvelousOct 25, 201518 votes

And yet we've seen more unique picks now than ever.

Asides, that "abuse what's OP" argument is bullshit. Darius was considered OP for the first half of worlds and, surprise surprise, he dropped like a rock once teams figured out that he's not THAT good. I'd also say that, while I agree that double TP is a problem and there are outliers in balance, people are hardly abusing picks like Tahm or Fiora. You see them occasionally but in most cases they hardly are the sole deciding factor.

If anything, NA/EU needs to step up their game. There's only so much blaming you can do on the game before you stop and go "Hold on, we're still not advancing."

KatCraftOct 25, 20153 votes

No one is blaming the poor performances of NA on balance, if anything the wildly shaken up meta would help foreigners more if anything, but it's pretty clear Darius Gangplank and Morde were clearly far too over tuned and it impacted worlds negatively.

Darius didn't win every game, that is true, but the fact is when he did win, he starts 1v5ing the whole enemy even when he was behind. He is highly contested because regardless if the team is ahead or behind, if Darius gets 5 blood stacks he can single handedly change the game.

Worlds should be about teams showing their best, and the hap hazard patch changes to make worlds more entertaining instead reduced the integrity of some matches. Making a bunch of random champs op to make worlds more interesting is extremely lazy.

ModCaptainMårvelousOct 25, 20159 votes

So Darius is a feast or famine champion. How is this different from Riven? How is this different from other champions who could get massively ahead? Hecarim, in the last game of FNC vs. KOO, could freely tank and just wade in with zero issue. Orianna, if she gets ahead, can chunk entire teams with one good shockwave. And yet Darius is a problem because he can do this now? Better yet, on champs who can change the game, Orianna can do it with a single push of the button. Azir can do so with a single R. This is nothing new.

As an aside, "Making a bunch of random champions OP" was hardly the case. Outside of GP and Morde (Morde being the obvious outlier and GP being problematic since his rework), the most picked champions were ones who have been good for a long time. Rek'Sai, Gragas, Elise, Azir, Kalista, Jinx, Alistar.

But naw, top lane is the problem. Can't have them be good for more than one patch.

EDIT: Of the reworks, only two have seen consistent play/ban. Those two being Morde and Darius. Darius fell out of favor while Morde is still pick-ban. Fiora has existed like she has for about 3 patches or so? Tahm's been sitting as he is for 2-ish?

KatCraftOct 25, 20158 votes

The difference is Riven isn't building tank items. Darius is both a tank that also deals ridiculous amounts of damage. Team comps need to be built entirely around him to beat him. Hecarim also is not going to start 1v5ing a team and doesn't have near the damage Darius does.

Riven is not a champion that does well when people group. This is why she does well in solo Q but not in competitive. She thrives when people are split apart and out of position, cause her 1v1 is very strong. But being a good 1v1 champion is not useful in worlds where people get 2v1'd and organised in general.

And the new reworks weren't made competitively viable due to them being given healthy kits, it's literally just because they are walking balls of stats that are hard to kill and just deal obscene damage at the same time. Comparing these champions to carries that die in seconds due to any bad positioning is also not fair.

ModCaptainMårvelousOct 25, 201510 votes

She's not building tank items because she doesn't NEED them. Her shield has a massive AD scaling attached to it and she can survive fights thanks to immense lifesteal, whereas Darius needs to build tank for a chance at dealing damage. IDK if you've even been watching worlds. Darius does NOT shine in these games, even when he gets a pentakill. At best he's helpful, at worst he's just a meat wall.

Also, these kits are hardly walking balls of stats. You're going to tell me Skarner's passive changed is "just stats" rather than area denial/control? You're going to tell me Fiora vital proccing is "just stats"? Darius Q getting a delay and losing his innate MS is just stats? Tahm's totally a fat ball of stats but, regardless, complaining about guys like Darius warping the meta when they've had minimal to no impact is just silly.

KatCraftOct 25, 20157 votes

Skarner was a walking ball of stats when he was released. Why do you think he is no longer top tier once he was toned down?

I'm not sure how long you think Rivens shield lasts but it certainly is not that long 1.5 seconds. Darius on the other hand doesn't stop being a tank.

The new reworks aren't designed as walking balls of stats, but they are competitively strong because the numbers make them so. Darius isn't pick or ban now because his kit is competitively effective like Rek sai, Gragas, Azir, etc it's because the damage he has as a tank is extremely obscene. When he gets 5 stacks he instakills people. And you can't focus him like you can Riven because Rivens shield has a cd and timer, Darius doesn't stop being tanky.

I think you need to pay attention more to games involving Darius. I can give you examples where his team is losing or behind the majority of the game, but he activates his passive and immediately turns a team fight. Darius does not shine in games even when he gets a pentakill? You realise how stupid this sounds.

Gangplank is pick or ban just because his barrels deal AoE slow critical striking damage that ignore armor. Morde is pick or ban because he instakills everything that's within range of him, Darius is Darius, etc. You tone down the numbers of these champions and they all vanish from competitive just like Skarner because they don't actually have healthy kits. Just ludicrous numbers.

btw I'm not saying Skarner has an unhealthy kit, just using him as an example.

TheSequelsRBadOct 25, 201518 votes

Groups were great.

Bracket stage was meh.

Only Play DariusOct 25, 201516 votes

At first I thought the summoner 12 meta was fine. It was ok when it was toplaners taking it so that they can actually participate in fights early game. But for whatever reason the midlaner started taking TP every game ever since the start of worlds and it pretty much ruined worlds, at least for me. Thanks to double (and sometimes even triple) TP no one in any lane can make any picks or plays without having the enemy top/mid/jungler coming and instantly forcing them into a fight where they are outnumbered, and overall is just forcing early game into a game of chicken where it's all about who can play the most passively and farm up because any form of aggression gets instantly punished by teleport (and part of the reason TahmKench is broken right now is because he's the only support who can instantly make his ADC untargetable and rush them to safety when 2 enemies are teleporting botlane, his laning phase is pretty poor and he is vulnerable to getting poked out of lane but this weakness can't be exploited because of double TP).

Honestly they should keep TP cooldown on turrets unchanged (to help out champions like Nasus who tend to get bullied out of farm early game) but need to massively increase the cooldown on minions/wards so that people can still TP to teamfights but actually have to think about when to use it instead of teleporting the second another lane overextends. Or maybe instead make it so that minions being teleported to get bonus resists but can actually be killed to deny the teleport.

TrylobyteOct 25, 201511 votes

Too many big patches and major releases in the Worlds run-up. They didn't give champions like the Juggernauts (Morde, Darius) or Gangplank enough time to really settle and see where they fall. You're always going to have people who cry OP BS about the champions that get picked a lot, but in this case they have just a bit more of a point. But still not as much of one as they think - A number of these picks were unheard of in competitive play before Worlds, like Veigar and Tahm Kench.

Alioth Ex PainOct 25, 201512 votes

LOL Origen Soaz picked Fiora and sucked with it. It's not the champ is OP, the OP comes from who's playing them.

ChaoticPineconeOct 25, 20158 votes

I think youre looking through rose colored glasses.

Remember last season? Alistar top had a 93% ban rate, ZIlean had a 82% ban. Ali, Zilean, Maokai, Ryze, and Lee SIn had over 90% pick/ban (Alistar was 100%). The Junglers were dominated by Kha and Lee Sin (58 and 43 picks). Support was Janna and Thresh (45 and 44 picks). Double Teleport isnt any more dominant than the laneswap.

Art Of Solo QOct 25, 20156 votes

Sad but true, I'm at the point where I'm not going to even bother watching the lcs. I rarely watch live, usually check the vids a day or week later, but for worlds I normally check it the same day just not live. This worlds has been a complete waste of time, just as all prior were. I still haven't enjoyed one game, not a single game has actually be competitive.

Its clear "competitive" league is a joke. The true irony is, it has nothing to do with the fact we all know who is going to win, regional games nor the international ones. Because its when you take into account riots balancing philosophy, you realize there is no point.

They balance in cycles, not to seek true balance. They say they do, but how many posts do you see of players begging riot to only nerf the champ or item instead of both, how many posts do you see begging riot for a different change instead of the "gutting" they do to said champ. While keeping flashing champs never to far out of the meta or always dominant.

So basically, which ever teams are capable of adapting to the meta each shift will always be dominant vs true balance of teams finding their own style of play and being pit against one another. Riot doesn't care who wins and that's good, but its when they literally choose which champs will get played and decide which champs aren't worth seeing, now that is disgusting. All champs should be viable, teams should be allowed to build styles and I think that's when league would truly be great.

Truth is league will never be competitive until riot balances the game. It will never be lasting entertainment until riot accepts this and stops using cycles. As in it would be almost impossible to get bored since you wouldn't see the same champs every match for a patch, you would see EVERY champ eventually with multiple team comps and styles. Not just the ones who are clearly superior to every other one out there. Simply because there would be balance.

LintheOct 25, 20155 votes

YES! Agreeing 100%. I was so geeked for groups. And they were pretty entertaining. But each round since has been worse

The Mighty FleaOct 25, 20155 votes

Anything is better than last years worlds were everyone knew from the start that Samsung White would win.

Dr PoroOct 25, 201522 votes

It's kinda the same with SKT this year, though.

Beacon 0F LightOct 26, 20155 votes

It's arguably even worse this year. SKT could win without dropping a single game. Last year SSW even lost a game to TSM.

High5Oct 25, 20155 votes

I thought the group stage was ok, but as things became more focused, the quarters and semis were awful.

The mord and gp perma bans were stupid for a tourney that has seen 70 unique champs played.

I knew NA was weak. China failed as a region too. For both EU teams to get 3-0 in the semis was a miserable showing. We know Koo can't beat SKT, so worlds is over. Again, moderately entertaining start and a very miserable end.

CroaninOct 25, 20154 votes

Also for this entire season I'm kind of on the fence with how Baron and Dragon work as opposed to previous seasons. Now Dragon is no longer important as it was early on since it gives no gold. Before it could snowball you if you kept on taking Dragon but I've seen teams come back against a team with massive Dragon leads. Also Dragon became damn near irrelevent as the game went on. Now with Dragon stacking it's a bit different. You get to four dragons and you can literally jerk the enemy team around the map. If you let them have dragon 5 it's GG, but if you let them just take Baron instead of 5th dragon or an inhib it's almost GG.

Also the Baron buff urks me a bit also. It's amazing if a team gets it when they're behind and regain a foothold on the game. But when a team is winning then take Baron it's just a nail on the coffin. You can't turtle in base against Baroned up minions (especially Baroned up Supers), especially if the enemy has additional structure damage from Dragon. Before Baron would push your lanes out and give you extra stats and regen to simply make your siege stronger, not damn near impossible to deal with.

DeusVultOct 26, 20154 votes

I for one actually was really enjoying worlds up until C9 tilted and lost 4 in a row, and were knocked out of contention from quarterfinals. Since then, the matches have all been really 1 sided

and SKT is going to win virtually unopposed

Ace of BronzeOct 26, 20154 votes

As an SKT fan since S3, no im not dissapointed, nothing makes me more happy than seeing Skt roll over teams.

LeeDarkOct 25, 20153 votes

Yeah, I am thoroughly unimpressed by this season overall.

MyrddinOct 26, 20153 votes

Not really, mind you i'm only watching the skt matches.

I fail to see how this is any different than previous seasons with twisted fate, kassadin, elise, et all being permabanned, there are always 3-4 champs that are heavily contested and banned a lot. Just the nature of the game, always has been. If you nerfed tahm, morde, gp, fiora, darius ect ect it would just be whoever is strongest after them taking over the bans.

Kind of the point of bans to get rid of the strongest thing at the time.