Ziggs, unlike a lot of ADCs, can't kill tanks late game. This gets especially difficult with champions like Juggernauts who have a lot of sustain. If you want to play Ziggs bot then someone else needs to play a champ that can shred tanks or you're going to be hurting if they pick a tanky team comp.
Rock MD1 votesZiggs drops off a bit mid-game but once he gets a Rabadon's, Morello's, and Void he has absolutely no issue shredding a tank unless you use his spells suboptimally.
Joseph Gladstone1 voteswhy are you playing ziggs bot lane in the first place
Randomonium1 votesIts a new thing, I've seen it in like 3 games recently and a lot of people are talking about it on the boards. I don't play ziggs.
GeminiRune1 votesYou write that as though none of the other 4 champions in game can make up for any flak that a DPS marksman would normally have in the late game. What most seem to not understand is that your bot lane champion is not always required to be, or play as, a tank shredder.
ZephyrDrake1 votesYou write that as though none of the other 4 champions in game can make up for any flak that a DPS marksman would normally have in the late game. What most seem to not understand is that your bot lane champion is not always required to be, or play as, a tank shredder.
well considering that support isn't going to do any tank shredding at all unless it's Brand. Top right now is usually a tanky top laner of some sort... they don't shred tanks in the slightest. Junglers are either early game champions or assassins, they do nothing to tanks the later the game goes. That leaves mid lane in which it's also either an assassin or some sort of burst/waveclear champion who do poorly against tanks in terms of actually being able to kill them. So just picking Ziggs and having the game go towards the later stages of the game will cause trouble in most situations
GeminiRune1 votesIn a situation where this pick is becoming rather meta in higher elo, players are aware of what they can do and how to work with and around it; from the champs you play, to the priority order of the team all together. What Ziggs brings regardless of where he's played is siege impact over control. As for vulnerability, again it's Ziggs. Stating that the mid lane does poorly against tanks is the general mindset that most players walk into. There are countless instances where a mage bursts out a tank enough to cause hesitation for being a front line. Mage vs Marksmen: they are both squishy and both have ways of cutting through a tank. But they do not have to be the sole responsibility to engage in that task.
ZephyrDrake1 votesIn a situation where this pick is becoming rather meta in higher elo, players are aware of what they can do and how to work with and around it; from the champs you play, to the priority order of the team all together. What Ziggs brings regardless of where he's played is siege impact over control. As for vulnerability, again it's Ziggs. Stating that the mid lane does poorly against tanks is the general mindset that most players walk into. There are countless instances where a mage bursts out a tank enough to cause hesitation for being a front line. Mage vs Marksmen: they are both squishy and both have ways of cutting through a tank. But they do not have to be the sole responsibility to engage in that task.
Ziggs by himself is not going to cause anyone to just switch their picks, mid laners are not good against tanks, not in the current meta. What are the mid laners we are seeing right now? assassins, burst mages and waveclear mages. 2/3 of them has little to no impact on tanks, while the other only has an impact if the tank is building poorly or a combination of him being behind and the mid laner being ahead. A single pick isn't going to do much in the way the meta changes unless it's so stupidly powerful in which case it'll just get nerfed.
It is the job of everyone to deal with tanks yes, but when you just fill your entire team with champions who have a hard time dealing with tanks that just means that the tanks will run circles around you the instant they get the slightest of leads. The reason why tanks get cautions after being chunked by a burst mid laner is because if they go in the, ADC is just going to finish melting them. If there is no champion left to melt the tank they will just go in on you and if you use everything on the tank... i shouldn't need to say what a terrible idea that is.
Randomonium1 votesThat's exactly the point of the post. If someone picks Ziggs bot lane then someone else on the team needs to play a tank shredder. I'm not saying I'm against Ziggs bot lane, I'm just saying that you need to have a balanced comp if you're going to run something off meta. This is an informational post since it seems like a lot of people don't know how to play with a Ziggs bot lane.
GeminiRune1 votesIt's a case that came left field, I can definitely say that. The mentality seems to be that people have absorbed the "AD Marksman is relegated to the bot lane" statement and thus get absurdly thrown for a loop when something out of the norm works. Happens all the time. And I'm just one person who aims to see the value in anything that works outside the norm and seek a counter if it persists.
I for one like flexibility in champion role diversity. The issue isn't that it's a tank shredding problem. The issue is that players will still call it a "troll" pick because it's not what they are accustomed to seeing, and will shift their mindset to tune against the off meta pick the moment it doesn't go in their favor: in this case, AD DPS (countered by enough armor) vs AP burst (countered by MR).
Meep Man1 votesBasically, all you need is:
somewhere else on your team. Probably some others too.