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Ekko's ultimate needs a damn mana cost

LegitBacon66··261 votes·10,010 views

Like how come an ability with insane base damages, 1.3 AP ratio, a heal, and a blink teleport, and an AOE spell have NO MANA COST? Seriously this ability of all abilities in existence needs to have a mana cost. In my opinion his ultimate should work better with mana as a risk reward. Basically the ultimate will cost you 100 mana. So you if you use it to escape, it burns 100 mana; however, if you use it on a target, depend how many targets you hit or maybe just at least 1-2 champions, you get mana refunded back you. Basically it rewards you for going in with your ultimate so it returns your mana back because you didn't escape, but if you escape just like that you burn 100 mana. It allows for strategic decisions when playing Ekko, and he will use up mana.

EDIT: thank you all for the feed back! Just one other thing I should mention. This is not a QQ thread about Ekko. I am actually perfectly fine with his kit, I an just stating my opinion he should be changed a bit to offer balance.

217 Comments

1000angrybees57 votes

Honestly? I'd be okay with almost everything else if they just slapped on a mana cost to it. There's absolutely no fucking way it's okay to have ALL that shit on one ult and be like 'lets make it cost 0 mana lmao'

People bitch about other ultimates being too much like Lux having great map range or Ahri having 3 dashes, but at least they god damn cost 100 mana for the ability to do so.

Also, I'm side-eyeing Leblanc so damn hard right now

LegitBacon6615 votes

{quoted}

Honestly? I'd be okay with almost everything else if they just slapped on a mana cost to it. There's absolutely no fucking way it's okay to have ALL that shit on one ult and be like 'lets make it cost 0 mana lmao'

People bitch about other ultimates being too much like Lux having great map range or Ahri having 3 dashes, but at least they god damn cost 100 mana for the ability to do so.

Also, I'm side-eyeing Leblanc so damn hard right now

The fact that his ultimate is AOE and has no cost is fucking incredible

Yosuke Apperu18 votes

Riven Kennen :3

Aeolian Melodies5 votes
  1. Riven is a no resource champion, she is balanced around that fact.
  2. All energy champions have free to cast ultimates, that is part of their balance as well due to how small the energy pool is, and the fact that there is no energy or energy regen items.
PlushBores6 votes

riven is the most broken champ in the game LOL she need a lot nerf

Dragko2 votes

Damn right, Ekko is fine. People are just not use to him and paying attention. He dies on hit. You try to farm around Riven Bang Bang Bang Swoosh Bang DEAD

shalexade2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Aeolian Melodies,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yoiupJBI,comment-id=0000000000000001,timestamp=2015-06-04T22:51:49.683+0000)

  1. Riven is a no resource champion, she is balanced around that fact.
  1. Ekko is a no resource on ult champion, he is balanced around that fact.
Terchio2 votes

130% ratio? I don't think there is one higher that isn't DoT, even single-target.

Wumachine8 votes

Katarina

I Main Swain18 votes

don't forget lee sin with his 200% ad scaling 600 base no cost displacing ult that can hit multiple people.

Kriegskaiser4 votes

Lee Sin is an energy champion. What do you expect? While you can easily increase mana cap and regen, with energy you can't do much.

gyzmotech4 votes

his ult is hard to land on multi targets though where ekko just needs to be near them for a few seconds. plus lee uses energy oh wait he says it in the comment below lol

Ser Garland8 votes

Ekko's Ult is super hard to land on multiple targets too. If you're not paying attention to his ghost, that's your problem.

stochastic423 votes

Yes abilties are hard to land when you are not paying attention... Very deep.

Divewing4 votes

Being real, Id be fine with it having no mana cost, my problem, is WHY DOES IT DEAL DAMAGE????!???!?!?!?! Furthermore on that point, why on earth does it deal so much? I feel if it wants no mana, it doesnt deal damage, if it does deal damage, it needs mana (i like OP's suggestion).

I feel like with some careful fine tuning Ekko could be a beautiful champion that requires immense skill and particularly finesse to master, but ultimately very worth the reward.

WarchfGinger5 votes

Yeah, why does it summoner 7 ? Even in the video, he still had the same damage carried with him. And the summoner 7 ing factor almost makes him immortal. PLEASE NERF!

luna is my mommy2 votes

actually riot cleared that up. In the video he does heal but he still feels the fatigue from the battle meaning his wounds are physically healed but he psychologically still feels them due to his brain not comprehending the time travel or something like that.

Truly Prideful17 votes

I've been trying to think of ways to justify it having no mana cost and there really isn't one. I would be fine with some kind of refund on it, but it having 0 no matter what is utter garbage. Everyone would love to have a 0 mana cost ult, but they don't because it's a really silly idea. I've had a lot of times where I think we've caught him because he has no mana, he ults, then we're just like "Oh yeah, his ult is free how stupid of us."

NotDevan15 votes

{quoted}

I've been trying to think of ways to justify it having no mana cost and there really isn't one. I would be fine with some kind of refund on it, but it having 0 no matter what is utter garbage. Everyone would love to have a 0 mana cost ult, but they don't because it's a really silly idea. I've had a lot of times where I think we've caught him because he has no mana, he ults, then we're just like "Oh yeah, his ult is free how stupid of us."

I understand the theory, being that the ultimate is intended to be an "Oh sh*t, get out of danger" mechanic. But still, someone with that much in their kit should have to plan out their resources. If they're caught to deep without mana, they should be punished.

Provengreil4 votes

I second this, especially as his entire kit is supposed to be about planning. It's like kayle's ultimate, they nerfed a ton of good stuff on her and in return took away the ultimate cost, a buff no one wanted, needed, or asked for.

59677475_DEL1 votes

I find to racist that they give the 2nd black champ an "o shit get out of danger mechanic". I am very offended.

Strawberrycocoa5 votes

Other champions don't need 4 seconds of prep time to use their ultimates offensively. Ekko's ult needs 4 seconds for the clone to catch up, or to bait unobservant enemies into it's path.

Truly Prideful9 votes

That would be fine if setting up for damage was the only function, but it's not. Don't get me wrong, I don't have that many issues with Ekko, but him having a 0 cost ultimate is puzzling. It makes no sense for LeBlanc, makes no sense for him either. Why them? It should be everyone or nobody ( Certain ults obviously have to have a cost in their current state like Maokai ). I just want them to shed some light on it having no cost so I can understand their thought process.

Aeolian Melodies4 votes

Many champions either have cast animations, channels, delayed abilities or ultimates that are trickier to use offensively and they still pay mana for it.

Fiddlesticks needs to channel uninterrupted to successfully ult Caitlyn Needs to channel AND time herself properly to avoid the shot being blocked Ezreal Has a long ass animation Galio needs to channel uninterrupted to successfully ult Gnar needs to build up his furry to turn big Gragas needs to plan his enemies' movement or bait them to correctly use his ult in an offensive manner Janna needs to either go in deep, flank, or bait enemies to use her ult offensively; needs to channel to heal allies JarvanIV needs to bait flashes and dashes our of his enemies before ulting Karthus needs to channel, OR die (still has a delay but can't be stopped at least) giving plenty of time to people to react Lucian Needs to aim and channel Lux Has a long-ass cast animation Malzahar needs to channel and effectively CCs himself MissFortune needs to channel Morgana needs to get in range and stay in range to get the 2nd dmg tick and the stun Nami swings her staff for 10 hours before actually ulting Orianna requires proper ball movement and/or teamwork to successfully ult Pantheon channels Rengar needs to build up furry Sion needs to choose the right direction to rush in Syndra needs to set up balls before ulting Tristana needs to put herself in harm's way if she wants to use it other than disengage/finishing blow Urgot needs to channel Velkoz needs to channel Zyra needs to either land snare or set herself up very well to get the knock up

guess what.

they all pay mana.

Hammerfly1 votes

The justification is that he went back in time. So it is like he never cast that spell in the first place, meaning he never used the mana to cast it.

Truly Prideful5 votes

That would be fine if his ultimate completely functioned like he reversed time for himself. The fact that it does a massive AoE nuke at the spot kills that theme though because when he was there 4 seconds ago I don't recall being nuked for 500 + 130% AP.

I would have rather seen his ult function completely like a rewind. Keep the heal, put his basic ability cooldowns back to what they were at the rewind point, and posssibly items actives though that has the potential to be broken. Just remove that nuke because it makes no sense at all.

killd0zer9 votes

Ekko's ult is the example of an ability that could have it's strength justified by having a mana cost above 100, but Riot is too busy homogenizing champions to think of that.

LegitBacon6612 votes

{quoted}

Ekko's ult is the example of an ability that could have it's strength justified by having a mana cost above 100, but Riot is too busy homogenizing champions to think of that.

Yeap because all assassin's shouldn't have their ultimates cost anything seems legit

killd0zer2 votes

{quoted}

Yeap because all assassin's shouldn't have their ultimates cost anything seems legit

did u even pretend to read my post?

it should keep it's high damage and heal, but have a mana cost like 200 or 150. Instead they give ever ult a 100 mana or less power budget cus they are literaly unabl to be creative anymore

Morsigil12 votes

He was agreeing with you and being sarcastic about Riot's decision, not what you said.

Ser Garland1 votes

I'd be cool with him having a 100 mana ult if his Q mana cost was reduced significantly.

killd0zer3 votes

I'd be cool if freelo gets nerfed.

OP champs don't get compensation freelo noob

Tatrii9 votes

Seriously most ults cost like 100 mana and an ult where he can just nope the fuck away from a gank for free that's some bullshit. Fuck Ekko

Edge of Daybreak8 votes

I have to ask this for anyone on in this thread saying it needs a mana cost. If you have played ekko how many times have you actually managed to get an ult off without the enemy willingly walking next to the clone? The reason it doesnt have a cost is because he is the most unreliable assassin and the only way for him to reliably kill you is based on the opponents choices. So much of his kit has counterplay shoved into it that you could compare the number of counterplay options to how many things the individual skills do. He's actually got the most counterplay I have seen in a long time. If you want riot to put a mana cost on it he needs a way to use it that isnt 100% reliant on his opponent choosing to be next to it.

Jasiwel7 votes

How did they think not including a mana cost was okay? Who is making these decisions or promoting them? This is not cool, especially given how obvious it should be during testing that he is seriously freaking powerful with everything he has.

In terms of balancing preexisting champions, I can understand Riot's decisions; nerfing a champion into uselessness is not the way to go because every champion should be important. That said, unreleased champions that are very powerful on paper and then translate to being powerful during testing should not be this strong. Riot should have clued in on this from past releases where champs were blatantly OP (Xin, Brand, Jinx, Kalista) and I'm absolutely dumbfounded as to how in this situation they have yet again messed up. Either they wanted this to happen or something NEEDS to be done about the reliability internal testing.

skyfall6197 votes

cmon now. all this ekko hate for wat reason. his dmg comes from his aa his q and e both have now base dmg and low ratios, only his ult his hard and aa passive.

you guys make it seem like Ekko >Leblanc . he may be just a tad bit over tuned with his passive but you guys are just over exaggerating his power by a large margin. he is an assassin after all you is meant to kill you quick, but unlike many of the other assassins that we have you can see ekko coming.

DB Gaming2 votes

So he gets Vayne's tumble, but with an added bonus. He gets Ahri's q, but with an added bonus (slow). He gets an oversized Viktor's W, but with two bonuses (shield + stunning enemies inside). He can Zone, Poke, All-In, and then escape without a scratch when it's all said and done.

So just imagine that... say ekko gets a perfect w off, tumbles in and stuns the entire enemy team... mercs one guy and walks away, but then he ults back in and chunks the rest of your team before he pops his hourglass... so his entire team could be standing back and just engage after ekko's ult / hourglass combo. Which means its already a 4v5 now, but those 4 have been chunked with 0 risk from ekko. Alternatively he could do this all by himself and just not ult back in, which means dragons and / or barons because the enemy team will be missing an adc or mid laner.

What other assassin can under any circumstances jump into 5 enemies by himself and live to tell the tale.. let alone get a kill and some serious chunking done on the entire enemy team... ekko needs some fixin'. His kit has way too much potential.

Bard I have seen in like one LCS match since he came out. And LustBoy went cloth 5 pots (on a support mind you) because bard is so weak. This ekko on the other hand will be banned or picked in nearly every game.

Rebel Xayah5 votes

So you're saying... If Ekko gets the perfect (super enhanced viktor)W off... He can maybe make it it a 4v5 and somewhat chunk the other team? You do realize that the Viktor W you're comparing this to can essentially land Viktor a pentakill right? And Viktor's ranged. And Ahri's Q? That speeds up up and the rerturn damage is True Damage. His ult only works as damage if you plan it. Any CC made in a skirmish can seriously hurt Ekko. If you want to use your ult as an escape, you need to take less than 4 seconds to accomplish your mission. His W takes a full 3 seconds to cast. Think for a moment, Ekko just needs a ton of mechanics and preplanning for much of this so called "0 risk" to occur. Even then, he's easily telegraphed. I admit, Ekko is a bit too powerful right now with the AP scalings. He doesn't get too powerful until he gets his items, but the AP scaling is pretty ridiculous. But after small tweaks, I think Ekko will be in a good spot.

Trash MammaI6 votes

I'm guessing it's the same reason Tryn gets to use his ult under any type of cc

If Tryn could be silenced/stunned etc. to prevent him from ulting it would make him a practically useless champion

I guess Riot thinks if Ekko had any type of restriction on being able to use his ult it would be the same for him, I can't really blame them either. Considering you can see where his ult will land and the path it will take I don't really think it'd be fair at all for him to have a mana cost. It's already leaking of counterplay as it is

Silent Pace3 votes

[deleted]

Fadedpf13 votes

If they nerf him to the ground I would be okay because he would be a "skirmishing assassin" Like they said in the champion spotlight. But nope hes a straight up assassin with a ton of CC, damage and an undo button. Yay...

Orders4 votes

I am very surprised it does not have a mana cost for the amount of potential it gives. I see no reason why it should cost no mana and I am curious to see what Riot has to say about his free-to-cast ult. Riot seems to have given his ult no cost "just because".

If their excuse is that his ult is what makes Ekko iconic, then almost every champ should have a no-cost ability because every champ has some iconic skill.

xl Kirito lx4 votes

Honestly, propose this after all the ekko qq'ing has died down. As it stands, there's just a general bias against Ekko. You could suggest removing the shield from the W, or the blink from his E and people would agree to it, just because it was an Ekko nerf.

Daen3 votes

The thing is, his ultimate is completely and entirely iconic within his kit. Riot has been slowly moving towards no-cost ultimates on champions that rely on them heavily (e.g. Kennen), because being unable to use what is effectively over half of your kit because you don't quite have the resource feels terrible.

I haven't played enough in the current patch to really get a feel for this, but it seems to me that Ekko's ultimate is relatively easy for opponents to avoid seeing as there's a super obvious ghost trail that shows exactly where Ekko can blink to. If you get hit by the burst you're either making a mistake or Ekko outplayed you, and I think that relationship is fine.

5512022 votes

Katarina .

jDVL20eCYs1 votes

you wrong just deal iwht it

RasCaelestis23 votes

Looking at your name, I don't sense any sort of bias at all. :|

jDVL20eCYs1 votes

my name tells you about what knowledge i have

LegitBacon666 votes

Thats pretty sad.

DJ Hatsune Miku1 votes

His ult doesn't do damage Idk where you see that.

Wait you mean if you trail 4 seconds behind him and don't threaten him enough to make him use his blink to escape it does damage? Sounds like you have bigger issues than ekko's ult costing 0.

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