i dont see problem when a support need to build ap to work, the problem is that right now tank supports are way more usefull than traditional ones. Also the tanky itemization for supports are way better than the ap sup itemization.
I dont understand at all why the gold generated by 
inferior to 
and
, you need to risk yourself to get the gold and doesnt make sence it give less gold.
Partholonian2 votesI think when Riot reworked the AP ratios for supports a season or two ago, they significantly overestimated how much AP would actually be available to a support, on a support budget. 200 is a lot for a support. Most items actually aimed at supports have 50 or less, and you can't get any at all from SS or boots. So you're looking at at least one big-ticket mage item and part of another to reach that point -- in other words, 30 minutes if you're lucky. (It gets worse if you want to not explode instantly, of course.)
Rufus Crabmiser1 votesyou do know you dont have to go ap
jjookkeerr1 votesif you want her skills to make a difference (besides her ult) you need ap.
Her Q is the only support skill on this game that the only purpose is do damage, without ap the damage is negligible even if 5 teammates get the buff.
W has a poor shield and poor heal, riot nerfed the heal increase per missing hpand now evne more if you want this to have impact you need ap
Her E is "good", bu with ap you can make this buff 3 times better( and i'm not exaggerating)
Rufus Crabmiser1 votesu guys compare it to people like her skills can affect 5 people. wow lulu makes one person go faster than sona can make her whole team go, gg sona bad wow lulu can shield one person for more than sona can shield her whole team for, gg sona bad wow lulu gets added damage on her autos, but sona only gets large damage, an exhaust, or a slow, gg sona bad
Leaf of the lake1 votes[{quoted}](name=Bitter Biscuits,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yhf8N8d7,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2015-08-14T23:59:06.802+0000)
u guys compare it to people like her skills can affect 5 people. wow lulu makes one person go faster than sona can make her whole team go, gg sona bad wow lulu can shield one person for more than sona can shield her whole team for, gg sona bad wow lulu gets added damage on her autos, but sona only gets large damage, an exhaust, or a slow, gg sona bad
Karma shields her whole team and makes them run really fast and has better poke in lane, gg sona bad
Rufus Crabmiser1 voteskarma doesnt sacrifice anything for the shields tho rite (^:
Leaf of the lake2 votes[{quoted}](name=Bitter Biscuits,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yhf8N8d7,comment-id=00000000000000000000,timestamp=2015-08-15T00:13:22.286+0000)
karma doesnt sacrifice anything for the shields tho rite (^:
Not really, no, considering she's using the ability primarily for the teamwide speed boost anyway, and it just conveniently also has massive shields to go with it
Rufus Crabmiser1 votesThat's like saying rengar sacrifices nothing for his heal.
Leaf of the lake1 votesExcept rengar typically uses his empowered ability on Q or E for the damage/snare. Karma wants to engage with E anyway.
MudintheWater1 votesI think her issue is that she isn't really the best at any one thing. She tries to be a jack of all trades and wnds up being "meh"
Her harrass is outclassed by karma. He heals are outclassed by soraka. Her movement buff and slows are outclassed by lulu, her cc ult is outclassed by braum, morgana, leona, nautilus...
She has a very nice kit that has a lot of neat things, it just isn't the greatest at any one thing right now imo
Duke Anax2 votesThing is Thresh is also a jack of all trades but he does it way better. Really popular and decent win rate.
jjookkeerr1 votesup