Why was Graves designed the way he was???

Mannny·Mar 20, 2017·1 votes·721 views

Everything with graves is AOE, even his auto attacks. He has good mobility and great damage(as an marksman should have) but what confuses me is did they really thing this guy WOULDNT be op in he jungle? He outclasses literally ever jungler, even , who was DESIGNED TO BE IN THE JUNGLE! Giving him so much AOE damage and expecting him not to slowly pop up in other roles is just insane. Graves is the result of a horribly reworked ADC. Nerfing him won't stop his crazy clear, you either gut him out of existence or give him another rework to fix this madness that has never ended since he was reworked last time.

15 Comments

TheHappyReaperzMar 20, 20171 votes

Because shotguns.

Handy Sandy Mar 20, 20171 votes

He has good mobility

A Vel Koz MainMar 20, 20171 votes

Why was this game designed the way it was?

LordGeovanniMar 20, 20171 votes

Marksmen shouldnt have good mobility they sit in the safest spot in lane and every fight they shouldnt have extra mobility while mobility is inherent in their build item 3086

HarrowRDec 6, 20171 votes

I know its a 9 month old thread that i accidently stumbled across,but i just cant help but ask why in the hell do you think ADCs dont need mobility,just cause they are in the "safest" spot in the teamfight doesn't mean they're actually safe from gap closers like Jarvan QER,Malphite ult,or long rage spells like Ziggs ult,Xerath skillshots,Rengar,Wukog,Jax,Yasuo Knockup + Ult etc etc etc,and they shouldn't be only Viable in a 5v5 scenario,sometimes you have to fight 2v2,1v1,3v3,and dont always have someone to peel for you,so having the extra mobility is crucial,it would also make the ADC class very boring and generic if you didnt give any marksmen Mobility,hell,why bother with the class at all,just delete all of adcs and leave Ashe there,but rework her ult so it doesnt stun and remove slow on her passive,also limit her Max hp to 10,would you be happy then? Marksmen had mobility since the earliest of them,Tristana,Vayne,Graves,Sivir etc. so there's no reason to say they shouldn't have mobility,its like saying no mage should have Stuns,even though most mages already do and always had,arent they also ranged? cant they also be at the safest spot in the fight,even more so cause they can just spam abilities and then retreat,and repeat,they dont even need to stand there and AA like Adcs do/

LordGeovanniDec 6, 20171 votes

Because those champions have to trade long cooldowns and lots of saftey to do that (not yasou) but because marksmen have tons of either mobility or cc the champions you listed can't ever do the one thing they are effective at and its not just marksmen its also mages and usually changing Mobility for shields but they still get to build mobility item 3113 . The problem isnt the mobility in itself but that their mobility doesnt cost them lots of mana and long cooldowns. Yes marksmen did have mobility from early but Tristanna was a mage with hybrid scaling and mana gating her. Vayne only had mobility toward her enemies i dont think it was quite as large as it is now or up quite as often and marksmen didnt build item 3086 much none the less 2 zeal items that was for fighters. graves has long cooldown e with mana trade offs all of those things are gone. Sivir had conditional mobility through movement speed only when she hit and killed stuff or long cooldown ult and high mana cost hit her e would cost her mana not give her mana.

HarrowRDec 6, 20171 votes

Well Tanks shouldn't be in the safety of the backline,they're the frontline,of course they're trading their safety,they're trading it for the safety of the Damage Dealers. Im not really sure what's your general problem with mobility,do you think only melee should be mobile,or what,also Zeal items give almost no mobility compared to champions that have gap closing abilities,what good is +20 MS if Rengar jumps and one shots you? Or Zed uses W+R to get you half a lane away,also im not sure when you started playing,but even since season 1 ADCs would build 2 Phantom Dancers and they would both give +7% MS each i think,maybe even higher. Also you seem to not realize that champions trade certain aspects for others,For example,Vayne and Lucian are mobile but are low range,on the other hand some champs like Jhin arent that mobile but have more range and CC.

Also in a game where every new champ has some mobility spell i think its ludacris to say a whole class of champions,that doesn't have any CC,doesn't even have burst,and of course is the squishiest class of all,should also lose their mobility (which not every champ even has) I mean,i get that you hate ADCs or something,but try to not be so biased,its like me saying Tanks shouldnt have CC

LordGeovanniDec 6, 20171 votes

You are ignoring what i am saying Its not that Adcs cant have Mobility but on a class like that Mobility and CC should be niche cases and they should be super gated so that you cant excape with the same spell 2-3 times in the same fight none the less use it for damage and excapes like some adcs do

HarrowRDec 6, 20171 votes

Why not man,i just dont understand your reasoning,you have so many Divers/Fighters with much more mobility and cc than an ADC,Not to mention Assassins,how in the hell are you going to get away from an Akali? or Kassadin with 2second cd on his ult,hell,in a team fight he could go around the lane in 5 seconds and get to the backline,oneshot an ADC and go back,Jarvan has QE,if you escape that he has a range on his ULT,Sejuani has a HUGE aoe ranged stun,thats hard to dodge etc etc. For every mobility spell that an ADC gets other classes get 2 more,like i said,you obviously want ADCs to be reduced to Ashe,an overly team dependent champ that still can be dived and killed rather easy,at least Vayne has a chance to survive Zed,outplay him even maybe,this game should require skill,not just stat check and which class should kill which,its not rock paper scissors

HarrowRDec 6, 20171 votes

Also im not sure why youre even here discussing this,from your match history and your profile i see you are,and were bronze since season 4,your games are usually negative KDA with some very random build paths,it looks like youre playing the game just to have fun,so then just play to have fun,don't spend too much time discussing things. If you want,try playing Vayne or Twitch or any other "OP" adc for 10 games and see how many times you've managed to actually escape or outplay the enemy with your mobility,im guessing it wont be much

LordGeovanniDec 7, 20171 votes

Contriary to what you think my best winrates were when i mained the adc class when i was going through to main every class. I dont like how adcs play but they are very strong and i rather dont have to escape anything because everything melts under my auto attacks. I build what i like for my playstyle not what is meta.

HammermancerMar 20, 20171 votes

you're right, nerfing his cigar wasnt far enough, I demand a shave too!

MannnyMar 20, 20171 votes

I cant see the sense in this comment lol

HammermancerMar 20, 20171 votes

item 3143 item 3123 item 3075 item 3022 item 3025 item 3047 item 3046 item 3116 item 3165 item 3152 all do great things for a graves problem... it's almost like there's a viable and reasonable counter build choice for every single type of champion

RagingRocketMar 20, 20171 votes

Yeah because pre-rework Graves wasn't consider to be one of the best adcs out there with lane bullying potential or a crazy good late game.Just imagine pre-rework Graves building lethality,in my opinion it sounds disgusting to me.So don't complain about him now since he was always a good pick.