I wish Katarina was an AD champ

ModKnightsKemplar··3 votes·676 views

Here's the deal. Katarina throws knives for Q and R, slashes with knives for W, and jumps onto someone with E. Why is she an AP champ?

Even though this is a huge change, as I mentioned above, hitting people with knives shouldn't be magic damage, in my opinion. Thematically, it makes more sense for her to do physical. How can we make this work in the game? My idea was to do something a little bit different with her damage scalings. What if she just did physical damage, but it scaled with AP? It's weird, I know, but there isn't any particular reason this couldn't work. Yes, the scaling numbers would absolutely have to be tweaked substantially, but I think it would leave us with a very cool champ, that still feels somewhat like her old self (able to build Z's Hourglass, deathcap, etc.). It terms of theme, this also makes sense to me. As Katarina becomes better at wielding whatever knife-guiding magic she's using, she's able to inflict more damage with those knives. Still physical damage.

In a recent patch preview, Riot mentioned that they've become very open to champs doing some really bonkers stuff (Azir summoning a turret, anyone?). This is an idea I've been considered posting since then, since this would make one of the older champs in league feel fresh and unique, but without actually changing her play pattern at all. Aside from thinking about whether this would work with Kat, what do you think about this "backward scaling" idea, in general? Even if you hate it with Kat, do you think it could work on a new champ, or a different old champ? Perhaps a champ that builds AD, but does mostly magic damage? Discuss.

14 Comments

Rebonack2 votes

Throwing knives and headbutting people?

Totally magic damage.

Blasting people with lightning balls?

Totally physical damage.

The damage types in League have never made any sense what so ever.

ModKnightsKemplar1 votes

Of course not. This is not a QQ thread about league damage types, though. I just thought this was a neat idea. If they don't do this (and I highly doubt they will), my feelings won't be hurt. I still really like it as a concept, though. You don't?

Lord Dusteon2 votes

Because that'd make any penetration that came with actual scalings useless (Well I could get Sorcerer's Shoes except I don't do any magic damage), and since all her scalings are AP but her damage is AD she HAS to get a last whisper and have the troubles AD Assassins have (needing to supplement their combo with autoattacks) without any of the benefits (having actual useful autoattacks, pushing power, and easier last hitting).

If you have an AP doing AD damage, they have crappy penetration items (LW, black cleaver could work but you don't really want AD, ghostblade could work but you don't really want crit or more attackspeed).

If you have an AD doing AP damage, they have better everything (get sorcerer's shoes + void staff for penetration, but keep turret pushing power and have useful autoattacks), but if they are actually strong they become painful to fight (Jax relies on autoattacks but still does some great mixed damage, making countering him hard)

ModKnightsKemplar1 votes

Good point. Pen is a hang-up, for sure. Maybe they could use her passive to do something about that?

Serenity Now2 votes

A few seasons ago, when she was more hybrid and the ratios kept shifting around, there was a time when stacking Bloodthirsters was the optimal build.

She'd come out of fights at full health, which is a problem we still see with Akali.

Rebonack1 votes

Not particularly.

Making Kat a physical damage champion would mean she could pick up TriPen and destroy Tanks along with Squishies while having good sustained damage on top of her swarm of resets. That's not a good combination of traits.

ModKnightsKemplar1 votes

sigh well then change them. I'm not interested in your predictions about what will make Kata OP. Those things can, and in this case, SHOULD, be changed. I think her resets would look a lot different if this change was made. And I don't see why you think triforce is a good idea... if all her scalings are still AP, I don't think triforce would be good at all. Perhaps you are misreading my intent, here.

The idea is for her to still build AP items, but her damage is physical. She scales best with AP, still, with this change. She's not building AD. The only thing that would help is her autos, which would be stupid to focus on if all her other scalings are AP.

Sightless661 votes

For giving her physical damage that scales with AP; it could be done, but what would it actually accomplish in-game? The effect this would have on gameplay is limiting her itemization options due to the lack of ability to buy penetration items. She couldn't buy a void staff, so she'd have to make do with Cleaver or Last Whisper, neither of which work with her AP scalings.

I don't think this would really make her feel unique. The main effect it has is to say "you can't build these items" without giving me anything powerful in return. It's more of a limitation than anything cool or unique to me. It might be cool to other people, but it's not something I personally find interesting.

This backwards scaling idea does have some presence in League already, but it's almost always on tanks and bruisers and the like. Champions who aren't built around doing large enough scaling damage that they'd need penetration items to begin with. It hasn't been a main factor on a kit so far, but the generally small interest there is whenever it does appear on a kit doesn't make me think that it is well suited to being a major gimmick of a kit.

As for building AD and doing magic damage, the problem there is that you're also giving them a huge source of physical damage in their autoattacks, allowing them a lot of damage that the enemy can't build against. It can kind of work on tanks, but it wouldn't work well on a major damage champion. That paradigm would work better for an AP champ doing physical damage.

ModKnightsKemplar1 votes

Yeah, I think the pen issue is the biggest one. That would be difficult to get around.

Sire Hippington1 votes

she orginally was more an ad champ, then more of a hybrid, and since the rework went full to ap(still got some ad-ratio on W and R though) I wouldn't mind a shift back to hybrid, giving Q also a ad-ratio(she'S throwing her damn knive!) and maybe slightly lowering her ap-ratios, but her full ad days were pretty insane(well, stacking 5 bloodthirsters for 500ad and 125%lifesteal won't work anymore anyway i guess^^)

ap-scaling physical damage doesn't really work, you would need a LW/BC for pen without any scalings for the ad. Either hybrid scalings, so you still can profit from the ad, or magical damage scaling with ad, as building ad always means your AAs hurt, so you atleast deal hybrid damage if you can't get penetration.

ModKnightsKemplar1 votes

You know, I feel like hybrids have been phased out. I wouldn't mind that either. Just kinda hard to get it to work, numbers wise.

Der Lindwurm1 votes

I bet in LoL2 she'll be AD (or the rough equivalent thereof) again.

TheFrozenIsles1 votes

I all was what her AD as well but I think Riot will think she to much like Talon.

Bresn1 votes

Only logic was Katarina = Sercet mage

The ult is impossible IRL.

More from Gameplay

More by KnightsKemplar