What Shaco taught me about Sight & Stealth

DrugsForRobots··2 votes·827 views
http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/leagueoflegends/images/1/1b/LivesByProxy_VisionInterplayLoop.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/1000?cb=20160709033250

Shaco's clone, by it's nature, counteracts detection effects such as RekSai and item 3341 item 3364s.

Some examples where detection effects come in handy:

  • When you're fleeing from an enemy and you cut the corner around terrain to break LoS and deny vision to enemies,

  • When you run through brush, which effectively makes you invisible,

  • A timely allied ability Nearsights your enemies, Nearsight being a beautiful form of vision-denial,

In all of these cases, the clone still allows for confusing and misleading your prey. I imagine that even more interesting and tense situations and scenarios (gameplay) would be enabled if the forms of sight available were less powerful. It's the difference between ward-like constructs such as Yellow Trinket and Pink Ward and effects like FQC and Scrying Orb. Ward-like constructs have been, and still primarily are, circular AoEs of sight. Yet we've seen Riot express sight in different ways before, most notably Kali's Sentinels. More of this kind of design is needed!


Sight is countered by stealth and nearsight, but is more powerful than detection.

If sight where more scarce, if sight where more varied in form, if sight-denial effects like Invisibility and Nearsight where more commonplace, detection effects would be far more useful, and in greater demand. They would be another way to counter stealth, without being as crippling to stealth as item 2043, while not being as powerful as sight - detection does not grant targetibility! Equally important, detection effects would be desirable in their own right if they could give you information on par with any sight options. What is more valueable, a ward that grants sight in a 750 radius range, or a ward that grants no sight but periodically pings out enemies within a 2000 unit radius range?

By detection effects I mean how Warwick's Blood Scent could be represented by a visible 'scent trail' (I imagine and orange-red version of Singed's Poison Trail) or things like Echolocation (imagine a pulse / screech that radiates outward in the form of a few white lines, extending far out into the Fog of War and outlining the silhouettes of enemy champions it passes over) or Aura Awareness (like a semi-blurred blue silhouette but one that doesn't distinguish between champion models - you don't know who's in that bush, only that someone is). Have you ever considered that Rengar's Ulti could be a special form of detection ('thermal vision') that just happens to grant targetibility?

Is it also inconceivable that the each form of invisibility would have its own tell-tale signs and audio clues? 20thCenturyFaux expresses some disdain for Shaco's puff of smoke, but it's an incredible way of telegraphing his stealth (updated particle FX wouldn't hurt either). If he had a audio clue - a laugh maybe - then more power to him and his enemies. A chance is all anyone can ask for, right? I imagine if summoner 6 granted invisibility, the bluish ghostly silhouette (that is already a feature) would be like Red Trinket's silhouette in function, something that indicated the champion's presence but only updated every .X seconds.

Have you ever noticed that Rengar is the only stealth champion with a unique SFX for his prey to hear? Why? Sound is important for communicating info, but it also emphasizes a champions theme and flavor, which in turn communicates function!


TL:DR;

Guinsoo was ahead of his time. So was Shaco it seems... I find it amazing that Shaco has 3 ways of playing with vision: his Q stealth, his Boxes which have a huge sight radius, and his clone, which at the very least is nothing more than a mobile FoS you can scan areas with, and, incredibly, serendipitously, hilariously, counteracts the detection effects that would counter him BUT are largely absent from the game!

Riot gives me some hope though. They hint at changes to stealth here and there. I can only pray the Joke isn't on us. Shaco

7 Comments

TequilaZombie2 votes

It's a fine line to walk through. Too much control over stealth with detection and you gut all stealth champions, too little and they are a big ass problem.

I really wanna see what Riot will come up with.

DrugsForRobots1 votes

True. My hope is that they do move towards individualized solutions (which they've hinted at) instead of a standardized stealth like the 'predator shimmer' of HotS which 20thCenturyFaux mentions (with disdain, thank goodness.)

TequilaZombie1 votes

I'd rather have more ways to counter stealth than have stealth counter itself via a new mechanic added to it.

Maybe an item that grants a line of detection over a certain path or something along those lines in a low CD (20 or 30 seconds). Possibly even having it on a starting item that builds into something useful later on (although I'd put it in a support item, we don't need a snowballing ADC denying assassins even harder, it should be a trade off)

DeathBurst1 votes

It's strange you agree with him on the predator shimmer but not on Shaco's puff of smoke, 'cause his argument is exactly the same in both cases: you have to directly look on the map --not the mini-map-- for a hard-to-see VFX, so basically you need to know already he's here/will come soon to be on your guard, and it's very tedious/aggravating.

DrugsForRobots1 votes

The puff of smoke is unique to Shaco, and communicates his theme, thus my admiration. It could stand to be larger and more vibrant and perhaps not dissipate as quickly, and elsewhere I've expressed a desire for Shaco having an audible laugh that can be heard within a huge range (like 2K units) when he Qs - part of the audio clues I mentioned in the post. It allows for mind-games, while also not requiring a specific counter item or champion to 'deal with' the stealth. All of this is part of the 'salesmanship' on Riot's end. Telegraphing via updated / better particle effects is one thing that the stealth champions as a whole group could use.

I've gotten some criticism that this turns stealth into a game of 'who has the best headset' but that kind of logic could be applied to other aspects of the game - who has a better ISP, for example. It would put those of us who are live streaming, listening to music, or voice chatting at a disadvantage, but one that we choose to handicap ourselves with.

The 'predator shimmer' would be neat as a single instance of stealth (Kha'Zix gets my vote), but as THE expression for each instance of stealth, I would be disappointed. Shaco's stealth in particular would be one of the more powerful instances of stealth, since it would not have a tell-tale sign while stealthed, only his tells that telegraph when / if he has gone into stealth. IDK just thoughts.

DeathBurst1 votes

Ok, the detailed post is much more convincing than the short version. Thanks for replying.

I agree with your analysis, and I disagree about the "best headset" line.

rtbf221479702 votes

Frost queen claim was a step in the right direction as well with the ghosts that slow. Visibility utility is a powerful under implemented design that Rito needs to include more.

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