AD assassins arent even suffering

i think you underestimate the power of the old last whisper. Even if the target had 80 armor the old last whisper would remove 24 armor from the target. Then the flat pen would be calculated in. The old last whisper was removed BECAUSE it was good against squishy targets AND tanky targets. Thus thats why the new LW only effects bonus rendering it useless against squishy targets.

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xXHY2Imt,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2015-12-20T21:03:53.408+0000)

flat armor pen is the better stat to fight squishies.

youre not trying to assassinate tanks and fighters who stack a lot of armor. at least you shouldnt be. your job is like you said to take out that lucian. and flat pen helps more with that than % pen.

Late game? It doesn't. Let's make it simple. Pre patch 5.22. Lvl 18 lucian has 75 base armor and to that add 27 from runes. that is 102 armor. With last whisper and youmu's ghostblade and 19 armor pen in runes, you had 39 flat pen and 39% total armor pen. So, his effective armor was 23 for a 20% damage reduction. Now, after patch 5.22 with the same rune settup and youmus and 5 points in precision you have 53 flat armor pen at level 18 and if you have a black cleaver you also have a 30% armor shred after you hit them 6 times. So, in all cases now, on your first attack, his effective armor will be 53 for a 35% damage reduction and if he has a phantom dancer and manages to AA you before you do damage, the total damage reduction is 43%. So, if you have no black cleaver and instead go for raw AD, you will have 43% damage reduction all the time and you have to deal with a very mobile target that can crit you to death in a matter of seconds. Now, say you also have the black cleaver, for your first attack your target will have So, if you can't burst them fast enough it's over, you die. So, if you have black cleaver his effective armor on your first attack will be again 53. on the 2nd attack it will be 47.7 and so on until your 6th attack when his armor will be 18.4, that's 5 less than with the old last whisper but that's after 6 hits. Not very hard to do, at least not on paper but in actual gameplay against a lucian that know what he is doing, it's not that easy. So, during the time you need to land three attacks/spells, all he needs to do is E->Passive->Q->Passive and you are dead. Simple as that. With 70% crit chance and the AD he can get from the items and the extra crit damage from the IE, he will kill you just like that. If he is lucky enough and get crits in both of his passive shots, he may not need to use the second passive. Also, consider the decree's damage. Back in the day, you could go in, do damage and get out because you already had enough armor pen and AD to deal with him quickly, now you simply cannot. If they also take a GA things get even tougher.

Late game and assassins are not meant to coexist in the game anymore. I never said anything about going on the tanks as an assassin.

[{quoted}](name=UselessAsF ck,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xXHY2Imt,comment-id=00010001,timestamp=2015-12-20T21:54:35.977+0000)

Assassins (not just AD) are meant to fall off late game. Their strength is mid-game, and they need to use it. They have essentially "you die now, and i go out" combo between 15 and 35 minute of the game. If the other team survive that they deserve to get a reward - one falling off champion in the enemy team. Snowball-heavy mid-game champion/class with an extreme late-game potential does not sound fair

The point is, assassins are meant to fall off late game but against beefy opponents like fighters and bruisers. Tanks are supposed to soak up damage and peel, do some AoE and soften up opponents, Bruisers are supposed to have moderate damage and some considerable defences, essentialy they should replace fighters, their goal is to do damage and start the fight, they won't burst you but they will kill you if you stick around too long, Mages are about AoE damage and crowd control, Assassins are supposed to do what their name suggests, Blow up squishy targets and get out in 1v1 or do a lot of damage and even kill and maybe pay for it with their own life in the process when they attack groups, ADCs are about high dps from range, essentialy assisting bruisers and killing what the tank has softened and supports are beefy targets focused on utility and crowd control. That is what each class should be. Does it seem like it in game??? Is being a tank and do enormous amounts of damage healthy? Does it look normal to you for an assassin to not be able to assassinate in a 1v1 scenario?

An assassin should be able to blow up squishies, if played properly, at all stages of the game, that's what an assassin is. Light to no armor individual, specialized in killing quickly weak targets and if necessary even beefy dudes. In game, that would be broken so assassins should be limited to blowing up only weak targets, and by weak, i mean fragile. What looks more fragile? 2k hp or 5k hp? what should blow up vs an assassin? The advantage of an adc late game is the grouped fights when their range advantage and high dps will do the job. An assassin that closes the gap should be able to do his job, assassinate.