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I realize that 5.18 is the Worlds patch, but could you please look into Cassie for 5.19?

Canastus··85 votes·6,295 views

http://i.imgur.com/dDrPvT3.jpg

I'm not asking for revolutionary changes since you're currently busy enough with handling the huge mess which the Juggernaut project left behind. But it's been over half a year now since you actually did anything for this champion (that includes her nerfs aswell) despite promises of resuming your work on her someday.

Now please don't tell me you're simply going to forget about that just because the guy who made this promise did abandon the rework later to do work on Fiora. Don't you see the massive breach in trust between her playerbase and those who seek to maintain it? You aren't exactly acknowledging her existence, too, you know (new Cass skin when?).

Look, I'm not asking you to revamp the rework right now (after all we still want our POISON-mage back for season 6) - all I'm asking for is a more viable Cass who actually stands a chance in this hell of a meta.

Would it be too much to ask for a revert on some of those older nerfs which affected her mana-costs and/or sustain? Or maybe consider changes ala Lee Sin more recently to create a champion who is a lot more accessible and more forgiving to play as while keeping a high skill-ceiling? I'd love to see your take on that.

Please give it a thought. Cassiopeia

110 Comments

1 800 MID LANE18 votes

The reason she's "weak" is because she's so ridiculously unforgiving. She doesn't have a huge skillcap overall, in my opinion, outside of the fact that if you accidentally miss your E and hit an un-poisoned target, you're useless. That's what makes her "hard."

A lot of why people hate playing her is that all she seems to be good for is an E key stress test. She doesn't bring much to the table that some other midlaner doesn't already, and that other one is probably better for it.

EDIT: Rework, please.

Rundus11 votes

She brings one of the highest DPS to teamfights in the game if she isn't put down early or taken down fast (I believe she's somewhere between 2nd and 5th best DPS lategame (Karthus is up there too if he plays his cards right)). The problem is that she has little she can do to keep the people who destroy her at bay other than ult, so she becomes depended on flash-ulting or other engage and peel to start teamfights or get people off her. If she can stay at the edge of a fight and just be Cass, she'll destroy your entire team. All she has to do is kill the mobile carries and have fun with the rest. The problem is that that's not easy to accomplish, and getting her to the point where she can do that is no easy feat.

1 800 MID LANE2 votes

There are a lot of "ifs" in that statement that hardly justify not bringing someone else.

Haunt13 votes

Would it be too much for the mana sustain and sustain back? Yes. Yes it would. It made her not have to think about her mana or health (Mainly mana) since she had unlimited supply of it, so long as minions were there.

You're literally asking for reverts to the nerfs that they gave her because she was too strong. Notice what happened when we reverted Elise's nerfs and made it so her E stuns for a decent amount early game. She went RIGHT back to the top of the ladder.

And before you say Elise isn't permabanned right now, it's only because of the 5 recent reworks all being too strong and filling up those ban slots and then someone else for the free ban.

She's not even close to being bad. But whatever I guess, downvote me and move on to the delusional people that agree with you because they have no idea of what strengths Cass has. Shes rewarded by good positioning and great kiting. Land your shit and you'll do damage, don't spam as much in lane before your team so you don't go oom. Learn to manage your mana and HP.

sp4415 votes

Don't change the fact that she's a boring version of Urgot.

CasterGilgamesh9 votes

riot just hates cass at least they dont hate her like Evelynn Kassadin Sona Zilean RekSai Twitch

Angelofchaos16x3 votes

Karma says Hello

Sasogwa9 votes

Cass is completely balanced. However, her kit doesn't reflect her identity well. She's not a poison mage, she's a lategame E minigun hypercarry. That's why I think she should get a rework, once again. I mean, she didn't even need a rework back then she was fine :/

I Main Swain8 votes

i like how before you click on the post it just shows a zoom in on cassiopeias boobs

Canastus4 votes

If only Riot would give us some fanservice once in a while like they always do for Ahri.

How about a new skin?

yay nibbers2 votes

Finally, someone else who thinks so. It feels like the Boards are overrun with "muh sexism" idiots. I like all the cool skins that have been coming, but it would be cool for some good old League of Boobies skins.

On a related note, Cass definitely needs a new skin

TurquoiseYoshi5 votes

Honestly, all she needs is to make her Q easier to hit. Because she's actually in a decent spot if you are able to start spamming her E.

ModAcademy Kayn27 votes

Her Q is already pretty easy to hit. As long as you have a sense of leading, it's not that hard to land.

TurquoiseYoshi3 votes

Well then there isn't that much to do for her. As long as you understand that you have to go Poison -> Twin Fang -> Twin Fang -> Twin Fang, she isn't that bad.

HadesBlades4 votes

Except her mana pool is so bad early doing that would make you waste half if not 3/4 of your mana pool. Not only that but she actually has to walk up to you to get into E range, leaving her open to ganks. Cassio was meant to be, and I wish they would make her, a DPS mage that focuses more on poison rather her E machine gun. :P My two cents.

Bouncemaster Zac1 votes

{quoted}

Honestly, all she needs is to make her Q easier to hit. Because she's actually in a decent spot if you are able to start spamming her E.

Her Q is already easy to hit considering it can spawn directly under the target and has minimal wind-up. And if she lands just one, she can 100-0 people at level 2 by just hammering her E key until it breaks. She's not weak.

TurquoiseYoshi3 votes

I agree that she isn't weak. She maybe just needs a little tweak to make it easier to start spamming that E. I always like to compare her to ADCs, as those are who she is most like. ADCs don't need much setup to start spamming AAs, so she shouldn't need as much setup to start spamming Fangs.

Bouncemaster Zac2 votes

{quoted}

I agree that she isn't weak. She maybe just needs a little tweak to make it easier to start spamming that E. I always like to compare her to ADCs, as those are who she is most like. ADCs don't need much setup to start spamming AAs, so she shouldn't need as much setup to start spamming Fangs.

Except her Es are far more impactful than an ADCs autos at every stage of the game, so yes, they should be harder to set up.

TurquoiseYoshi6 votes

The poison also wears off, and her E doesn't crit.

Your turn.

Bouncemaster Zac3 votes

{quoted}

The poison also wears off, and her E doesn't crit.

Your turn.

Scoring the poison deals damage, gives her a burst of movespeed, and gives her 3 seconds during which her e has no cooldown. At level 2, if Cass lands her Q, for the next three seconds she becomes the AP equivalent of an ADC with a Pickaxe and max attack speed. Level 2. The only thing that prevents it from being completely broken (the way it used to be) is that it will run her completely out of mana. Of course being oom doesn't mean much when she just got a free kill against any lane opponent with no defensive abilities, and if they do have defensive abilities she just forced them to back. Except Galio . She loses really hard to Galio . EDIT: Also, the poison doesn't wear off if she alternates her Q and W.

TurquoiseYoshi3 votes

At level 2, it's very easy for her lane opponent to just leave if Cassio wants to fight.

Bouncemaster Zac3 votes

{quoted}

At level 2, it's very easy for her lane opponent to just leave if Cassio wants to fight.

Except it isn't, due to that 30% speed boost. If they're as immobile as she is, and a lot of mages are, she'll catch them.

The Queen Viper4 votes

It's 20% ... and you need to hit your Q first.

Bouncemaster Zac4 votes

[{quoted}](name=Snąke on bush,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xX6YAB5X,comment-id=000200010000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2015-09-19T21:52:53.254+0000)

It's 20% ... and you need to hit your Q first.

30%. And landing the Q isn't hard. It spawns directly under the target with no cast time and a minimal visual windup before detonating. Landing Cassie's Q isn't any more difficult than landing Karthus's Q.

The Queen Viper4 votes

{quoted}

30%.

The movement speed bonus from Q is 20%.

http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Cassiopeia

{quoted}

And landing the Q isn't hard. It spawns directly under the target with no cast time and a minimal visual windup before detonating. Landing Cassie's Q isn't any more difficult than landing Karthus's Q.

Maybe, however the mid lane is short as it is ... so it's not hard to back away so that Cass can't reach you.

Bouncemaster Zac4 votes

[{quoted}](name=Snąke on bush,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xX6YAB5X,comment-id=00020001000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2015-09-19T22:02:54.353+0000)

The movement speed bonus from Q is 20%.

http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Cassiopeia

Maybe, however the mid lane is short as it is ... so it's not hard to back away so that Cass can't reach you.

So you have to vacate your lane and lose cs to prevent getting instagibbed at level 2.

TenSlashTen6 votes

WHo the fuck dies to cass level 2 anymore? her base stats were fucking gutted AND her scalings.

LOL

She could use all her amna and you'd still be above 20% assuming yuo even know how to chug a single potion.

Her early game was shit on by riot completely.

Abyssphere2 votes

{quoted}

So you have to vacate your lane and lose cs to prevent getting instagibbed at level 2.

The poison lasts 3 seconds. It's not hard to back off a bit for that long.

Bouncemaster Zac2 votes

{quoted}

The poison lasts 3 seconds. It's not hard to back off a bit for that long.

You're missing the point. She can just sit up on the wave and threaten you with her Q. If you get close to farm, she Q-EEEEEEEEEEEs you. She's one of the champs who can bully a lane just by standing in it.

Rundus12 votes

Btw, the only people really threatened by Cass early are immobile melees and stupid immobile people. Anyone with a dash (most people nowadays) are fine. Mages have so much range that if she walks close enough to get them with q she not only takes minion aggro, but is extremely susceptible to ganks and is basically giving them a free shot for any and all abilities. Xerath? eqw. Azir? She shouldn't even try it. Ziggs? eqw auto. Against them she has to play safe and try to q when she can for poke, because going in like you suggest will get her killed or severely out-traded by the immobile people. She almost fairs better early against mobile people, because if she can get her q off and one e before they dash away, she's won the trade. And don't even get me started on how she fairs level 2-3 vs early gank junglers like Shaco or Gragas if she ever tries that q-e-e-e on a backliner mage. If she moves into the middle for just a second or two she'll probably need to flash if Shaco's there, and Gragas might just kill her before she can with his body slam stun buying them a second to mong her. Her early game is nothing special.

TenSlashTen5 votes

Rework was a complete joke. Revert rework. Keep E refreshing sooner on poisoned target. problem solved.

SpecterVonBaren3 votes

Cass will be fine friend, Skarner is going to keep her company.

Canastus1 votes

Skarner was heavily buffed, though. Can't say the same about Cass.

SpecterVonBaren3 votes

His gameplay has the exact same problems Cass does. There is nothing about their kits that is inherently special or interesting and neither brings something unique to their team, the only time they're worth considering being picked is when their numbers are so high that they just melt through people.

Skarner was plenty strong before, the rework did not buffs him, it made him generic and dependent on numbers.

Snaketits3 votes

Dat thumbnail ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

Oerba No Naja3 votes

the best buff i can wish for her is to reduce her passive to 400 stack instead of 500 . nothing more or a 0.5 ratio on her q and better base dmg on her w then cassio would be perfectly fine

Electric Grandma3 votes

I honestly don't care if she's strong or not. What I cared about when they first announced this god forsaken rework was the fact that they took away her poison-mage identity and made her into a machine gun. I loved her identity as the poison mage. She was amazing at whittling down tanks late game and such. I dunno, I just hate the direction they took her. She's not a snake, she's a E-smashing machine gun :/

Frostwoman2 votes

I honestly hated Cass when she was broke a couple months back.

Canastus9 votes

A couple of months? That was over half a year ago.

Do you think it's okay for her to remain forgotten like this whereas every other immobile mage is receiving some form of help right now?

UltraSceptile3 votes

{quoted}

A couple of months? That was over half a year ago.

Do you think it's okay for her to remain forgotten like this whereas every other immobile mage is receiving some form of help right now?

They should just nerf all the broken mages, ie azir and viktor and ahri.

LVL 5 PORO2 votes

I think Cass needs few, if any, changes. She's pretty powerful. She just requires excellent positioning and the ability to survive until late game.

Oerba No Naja7 votes

ability to survive until late game ? you mean depushing wawes with her no dmgs poison ?

OperationDEEZ12 votes

Every patch the cassio mains ask them to look at cassio they never do

Canastus3 votes

Doesn't mean I won't give up trying, though. Sooner or later they'll have to listen.

Constantly occupying the frontpage might be the best way to achieve that.

Lapis x32 votes

There has got to be a reason why Riot keeps ignoring Cass, maybe they're going to do an immobile mage update soon?

I mean, there really aren't many immobile mages to update like Cass, but Syndra, Ryze and possibly Azir/Nidalee could use some help.

But if Riot just doesn't know what to do with Cass, then that's ridiculous. Reverting some of the nerfs that came along with her rework (cough Miasma Damage cough) would be a good start...

ARequestOfDeath3 votes

nidalee immobile?

General Esdeath 1 votes

Why isn't she played much? I think she's really good.

High53 votes

{quoted}

Why isn't she played much? I think she's really good.

Yeah, as a mid carry, she's really not in a bad place compared to other immobile champions. The issue is more around team comps.

I look at Cass like I look at Jinx. Late game carries that can be awesome if your team protects them and wards for them. If you expect a high damage, immobile champ to fend for themselves, then that's as much a team problem as it is a champion problem.

BigPooStorm1 votes

Yea as someone who plays top lane I'm fine with her not being played at all. If they buff her again she'll once again become an obnoxious lane bully that also hyperscales into the late game. No thanks.

Leu072 votes

she is very vulnerable to ganks if she goes top lane though. Early game junglers like Elise , RekSai and XinZhao can f*ck her over.

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