As a PBE player, let me tell you in advance what's the frontpage going to look like in the Preseason

Pyro··211 votes·11,419 views

#"Riot killed Graves, he is a melee champion now"

Close, but no cigar. Graves is currently a permaban in the PBE draft. His damage is insane, you just have to be in a close range to apply it.

#"Rito please nerf Graves"

I'll give it a week before these threads start popping up and the previous ones disappear.

#"Quinn is useless when behind"

True (without the blind she has practically zero utility), but also:

#"Quinn is a monster when ahead"

Her burst is absolutely ridiculous. I'll probably frequent those threads, she's going to be quite "feast or famine", reliant on snowball.

#"WHY DID YOU BUFF VAYNE'S SILVER BOLTS?!!!"

...yeah, because nerfs to their base damage and BotRK did not happen.

#"Mages are dead now"

Expect threads complaining about:

  • removal of mana pots (that will gloss over the buffs to mana regen, Doran's Ring and Forbidden Idol)
  • cost increase of mage items (that will ignore the fact that all items cost more now due to increase of global gold influx)
  • removal of AP from Sheen (ignoring the fact that Lichbane gained free 10% CDR)
  • the feeling of overalll nerf to mages (probably just going blindly for the "offense" masteries on assassins)
  • having to choose between lategame power in the Ferocity tree and the early game burst in the Cunning tree

#"Tanks are useless"

Expect threads complaining about:

  • Tank junglers being weak (because Hunter's Talisman is just the old machete without any changes to benefit tanks)
  • Last Whisper buffs (even though the item was actually heavily nerfed and armor stacking is better than ever)
  • Tank item nerfs (again ignoring how all items are more expensive now, and that slot efficiency of some tank items went up)
  • Giant Slayer (overlooking the BotRK and LW nerfs)
  • Executioner's Calling (...okay, fuck this one in particular)

#"How could the PBE players allow Executioner's Calling to get to Live? Is PBE just for testing skins?"

We spam the PBE boards about it every day. Not our fault.

There are some premises that justify its existence (vastly increased healing in masteries, Grievous Wounds lowered from 50% to 40% reduction, GW don't reduce healing from allies, lifesteal items are stronger), but having it apply to every kind of physical damage without any prerequisition like the one Morellonomicon has seems just silly. Swain, Vladimir and Mundo are going to have a bad time.

#"Yasuo and Tryndamere, WTF?"

More crit in items, the OP Warlord's Bloodlust keystone - I'd expect at least one of these two to become a permaban.

#"It's just the ADC meta, give us our turn"

We say it's "tank meta" when the Cinderhulk junglers are actually viable picks in solo queue. We say it's "assassin meta" when you can pick a midlane or jungle assassin and make an impact on the side lanes. We say it's "juggernaut meta" when toplane is not full of the likes of Lulu, Lissandra and Ryze.

Meanwhile, "ADC meta" means that ADCs will be picked not just in the bot lane, but also mid, top and jungle. The true ADC meta has been dominating for the last four years. I'll say it's over when you're able to play something else than a marksman in the 2v2 lane (that's not a CertainlyT abomination of a rework).

#"Assassins are OP! Nerf pls!"

If you've picked Vayne top, Kindred jungle, Quinn mid, Jinx bot and Ashe support - of course Akali is getting resets. She's still garbage against teams with a brain.

(what's worrying me is that with Corki ADC instead this would be a somewhat viable full AD comp...)

#"New Ranked Looks Awesome"

Boy is that thing shiny. Other than the fact that you have to click "Lock in" (why?) it's pretty great.

#"New Ranked Is No Longer Solo Queue"

I don't mind, I've been playing this game for 5 years now and this looks like a good excuse to stop. I won't get higher than Diamond, and the value of this achievement is probably going to diminish a bit with the addition of multi-man parties. Two things that could save this change are some sort of benefits for flying solo (right now I kinda feel punished for playing solo, as the organized groups have all the bonus IP and stuff) and voice chat (this would heavily improve responsibility, accountability and would maybe actually convince me to group up with some players I like hanging out with).

#"It's been X months since Mordekaiser's rework..."

The Cassiopeia mains have given up and switched to other champions or other games (Stashu has even returned from his exile from the Boards), but Malicious Metal stays unrelenting. Expect those threads on the frontpage, until our most dedicated Morde fan loses faith in Riot and lays down his weapons.

#Bug reports

The usual. I wouldn't expect less than 2-3 champions to be disabled for a while due to gamebreaking bugs that the PBE failed to spot.


So this is how the next month is going to look like here. Have fun.

238 Comments

Malicious Metal117 votes

The Cassiopeia mains have given up and switched to other champions or other games (Stashu has even returned from his exile from the Boards), but Malicious Metal stays unrelenting. Expect those threads on the frontpage, until our most dedicated Morde fan loses faith in Riot and lays down his weapons.

To be honest, the day I lay down my Mace is the day the world ends :9

Mecha MaIphite78 votes

You gotta pick it back up and lay it down two more times before the world really ends.

Markofer20 votes

And on that day The Shadow Isles will drift out to sea, dark meteors will reign, and Teemo enters the realm with a CertainlyT rework to rule the Rift.

3TWarrior9 votes

joke: teemo's new ultimate: can now plant a mushroom onto a minion where said minion will leave mushroom patches as it works its way across the map

ltmetal4 votes

Mordekaiser He's the hero we need, but don't deserve. Mordekaiser

HighH110 votes

[{quoted}](name=Malicious Metal,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xPiEpbLz,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2015-11-09T21:21:56.210+0000)

To be honest, the day I lay down my Mace is the day the world ends :9

Never lay down your mace,you're every Morde main's last hope

JediSenpaiNP6 votes

I BELIEVE IN THE METAL

Raid Boss Morde6 votes

Is there an M.M fan club yet?

Malicious Metal4 votes

There could be :^)

Toa of Death9 votes

I look up to and respect you even though I don't play Morde. I'm a dedicated Cho main and if the day ever comes where they do to Cho what they've done to Morde, I can only hope to be as stalwart and unrelenting as you.

Cubism6 votes

You're like the Big Boss of Mordekaiser players. An inspiration to your friends, and a menacing foe to enemies. Keep fighting the good fight M.M.

Raid Boss Morde3 votes

You wot?

Pale Pirate4 votes

CertainlyT now reworks the world and makes it end. [slayer-pantheon-rainbows]

The Yetii Rider41 votes

"Close but no cigar"

I cri every time.

AquariusGine38 votes

I WILL NEVER GIVE UP ON Cassiopeia

frigginmurlocs14 votes

I for one welcome the return of Rammus to the meta

MetalGearTeemu31 votes

I for one also look forward to laying my sides to rest when I flash taunt a Kog Maw with barrage up.

they will die for a glorious cause. Rammus

DorkunedAuras13 votes

KogMaw BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH explodes

DynamiteGazelle14 votes

removal of mana pots (that will gloss over the buffs to mana regen, Doran's Ring and Forbidden Idol)

Not all mana users are AP, and not all mana users got regen buffs

As a Yorrick player, I'm prolly gunna be backing after wave 3 now haha..

DorkunedAuras5 votes

and no one cried. I'm sorry, but even you know how unfun yorick is to lane against.

DynamiteGazelle16 votes

Well Yorick is just a personal example, but there are other champs similarly affected.

Also, I'd fight a Yorick over a Yasuo any day..

DorkunedAuras3 votes

Yasuo can be really annoying, true. It might be because I main top lane, with the proper selection of champs there within, but I never have any trouble with yasuo. They always play super cocky and end up dying. I main Rek'Sai top, and every time he comes near to do yasuo things, I just destroy him.

At the same time, My Rek'Sai also has little trouble with Yorick. She can clear the ghouls ok, and has enough built in sustain to handle him until his mana runs out, while still trading and poking.

SpecterVonBaren2 votes

I used to play Rek'Sai top before she got nerfed hard, how do you build her and do you have any tips for me? Maybe I should try it again.

DorkunedAuras3 votes

Start lane with either item 1036 or item 1029, depending on the matchup. NO OTHER START IS GOOD. my first item is almost always item 3074, unless things are going to hell. It synergizes great with her and gives surprising burst.

Her strength lies in her laning phase. You will be pushing constantly as you'll be using your fury to heal or boost damage on your Furious Bite (E). You can get around being always at your opponent's turret by placing a set of tunnels across the top bushes for free escapes from all ganks. Always be harrassing. Shoot prey seekers (burrowed Q) at your enemy champ on CD. Whenever the Opportunity presents itself, get under your opponent and knock them up into an AA-Q-Q-Q-E combo for huge damage that most top laners don't expect. At lvl 6, you can back freely, as you have both Ult and TP to get back to lane.

I find that between the fact that no one knows her power, and the fact that she is legit strong as a top laner has given me a lane win rate of about 85%. I've beaten a Diamond V Renekton no ganks with Rek'Sai. I've stomped rivens and dariuses. Every matchup is winnable, you just have to play well. Remember, the best defense is a good offense.

TurquoiseYoshi10 votes

Note: You have to click "Lock In" because it makes pick/ban quicker. Let's put it this way: If you can just let time run out (like on live), would you ever lock in? No, you probably wouldn't. However, when you know you have to lock in at some point, it makes you want to lock in quicker. It's even faster with the addition of preselecting champions, so you don't have to wait a moment for your team to see what you picked.

disregardable1 votes

So you can just let it sit for infinity?

TurquoiseYoshi10 votes

On live, you can just let it sit there and it will autolock at 0 seconds. On PBE, you have to lock in, or, when it hits 0, the lobby gets disbanded.

The Patriachy9 votes

How is armor stacking going to be strong?

Last whisper was changed from 35% total penetration to 40% bonus penetration. The 6% pen from masteries went up to 9%. They can also pick up a last whisper as soon as they see any armor being built unlike live.

I think chainmail vest also went up to 800g. It would seem to be really inefficient to stack armor. You would think health stackers with high base armor would be king.

If we start seeing adc top and jungle, I'm not playing this game until it is fixed.

UrPalAl4 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Patriachy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xPiEpbLz,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2015-11-09T21:13:48.197+0000)

How is armor stacking going to be strong?

Last whisper was changed from 35% total penetration to 40% bonus penetration. The 6% pen from masteries went up to 9%. They can also pick up a last whisper as soon as they see any armor being built unlike live.

I think chainmail vest also went up to 800g. It would seem to be really inefficient to stack armor. You would think health stackers with high base armor would be king.

If we start seeing adc top and jungle, I'm not playing this game until it is fixed.

What's wrong with ADC's somewhere besides bot? As long as they aren't OP it's fine. Jayce is pretty much just a tanky ADC, and he's perfectly balanced top lane, some may even argue he's a little weak atm. There's nothing wrong with meta change. Back in the old days, we had ADC's going mid, or we had full bruiser teams, and it was all fine and dandy.

Abyssphere9 votes

{quoted}

What's wrong with ADC's somewhere besides bot? As long as they aren't OP it's fine. Jayce is pretty much just a tanky ADC, and he's perfectly balanced top lane, some may even argue he's a little weak atm. There's nothing wrong with meta change. Back in the old days, we had ADC's going mid, or we had full bruiser teams, and it was all fine and dandy.

Why should a role that is guaranteed to be in a lane in every single game also be viable elsewhere? The only thing that comes close to balancing ADCs being a constant presence bot is their general lack of presence in other lanes. If they're mandatory bot and they're consistently popping up in other lanes, they are a definitive tier above every other class in the game. That's not fine.

Pyro18 votes

You have to stack bonus armor that will exceed your base armor 7 times. Most tanks have 80-100 base armor at level 18.

Not only will ADCs penetrate less of your armor - their Last Whisper upgrade will not work against your unarmored teammates.

LadyRenly9 votes

"removal of AP from Sheen (ignoring the fact that Lichbane gained free 10% CDR)"

nobody ever bought sheen for CDR. you bought it for empowered autos, mana and AP

Pyro10 votes

And? It will still reduce the downtime on Destiny, Playful/Trickster, and tons of other key abilities.

IcyPepper10 votes

nobody ever bought sheen for CDR. you bought it for empowered autos, mana and AP

But nobody can buy it yet, it's still PBE.

Unless you're talking about PBE, but then nobody is buying it for the AP because it doesn't have AP.

I'm confused.

Dominick Destine7 votes

But Riot DID buff Silver bolts....

Vayne is an ADC that straight up needed nerfs, not buffs.

ProfDrDeath7 votes

And nerfed her base AD disproportionally. And removed the flat component of Silver Bolts. And BotRK got more expensive and gives less current HP damage.

A small compensation buff will not change the fact that these are overall nerfs to Vayne.

Dominick Destine1 votes

{quoted} And nerfed her base AD disproportionally.

Want to provide some evidence? I have not seen anything that indicates her "base AD was nerfed disproportionately" (compared to what?)

And removed the flat component of Silver Bolts. But they buffed the % damage AND added a minimum damage component. This is what we call over-compensation buffs. She got more buffed than nerfed by a significant margin.

And BotRK got more expensive and gives less current HP damage. That's a nerf to an item, not to Vayne directly. Many champions used BotRK and they all got nerfed. Rather than hit everyone, they should have hit Vayne.

A small compensation buff will not change the fact that these are overall nerfs to Vayne. You have it reversed. A small nerf will not change the fact that these are massive overall buffs to Vayne.

The only thing that might keep her in check is that the other ADCs got reworked, potentially being strong enough to overwhelm her in raw power (Corki/MF/Kog/etc.)... even then, my points stand firm.

SoMNia16 votes

No, they shifted its damage into late game. She does LESS damage until 1500 health, and BoRK does less damage, period. She DID get nerfed, especially in her laning power and first item power spike.

daniellizard1 votes

[deleted]

SoMNia3 votes

What? At rank 5, it lost the 60 flat true damage, and gained 4% max health true damage. With 60 being 4% of 1500, that's the break-even point. Unless they changed it again?

Kitty von Tuna1 votes

And in the lategame (which was her problem from the beginning) she's even more strong.

SoMNia3 votes

Problem? She's supposed to be a late-game hypercarry. The problem was her getting to late game too reliably by out-statting her lane opponents and being too strong against squishies. And she can still get blown up if she's caught, just like any ADC.

Auz the Ripper3 votes

also Caitlyn and alot of her other counters are being buffed as well, so overall she should be less of a consistent problem

Auz the Ripper6 votes

I don't believe anyone who ever said new grave will be weak actually ever looked at his new kit

Pyro5 votes

Range nerfs have always been the harshest. Look at Lucian.

I'm basing it mostly on the reactions of the Graves players on the PBE. First few days - "Graves is dead", "what did they do to my champion". After they got used to it - welp, permaban in the new ranked betatest.

ProfDrDeath4 votes

Range changes and MS changes are the most deceptively powerful.

I think that a lot of the obnoxiousness of the new Graves comes from his 345 base MS. No other ranged champion, even the ones with comparable range to him AND less tankiness, has that kind of speed.

DorkunedAuras1 votes

at the same time, no other champion has AAs that can be blocked by minions.

My Waifu Vanilla2 votes

Or knocks them back because.....reasons?

toxıc sIut3 votes

you get shot by a shotgun from ~3 meters away and tell me if you get blown back.

kile14715 votes

Probably not... If pulling the trigger doesn't knock you off your feet then the buckshot won't knock the target off their feet either. http://beforeitsnews.com/mediadrop/uploads/2015/27/70a052bc6dd9618fb4c88c302e5e58bb13cd8683.gif 3rd Law ftw

(the bleeding out part is far more likely to down you)

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