LCS teams are quitting Dynamic Queue for in-house Solo Queue on Tournament Realm

Pyro·Jun 3, 2016·297 votes·17,458 views

https://twitter.com/LemonNation/status/738598523113902082

LCS teams are so fed up with dynamic Q they starting in-house solo q on tourney realm

https://twitter.com/HistoryTeachLoL/status/738602198901260289

@Woodbuck @dscarra @LemonNation I got an email about it last split. It's allowed but absolutely no streaming. Not sure if it carries over

https://twitter.com/TSMDoublelift/status/738632413681569792

can confirm playing inhouses on NATR is great so far sad we can't stream them though

It seems like, since you are forbidden to stream from TR, all the pro players are going to sacrifice their streaming time just to get a competitive environment - and without the pros, the highest elo DynQ will only spiral further out of control.

https://media.giphy.com/media/Yl5aO3gdVfsQ0/giphy.gif

124 Comments

YJRBqwXJcSJun 3, 2016116 votes

After reading this there is no way in hell you can approve of dynamic queue. The very people who make a living off this game, and have CONTINUED to master this game. Are basically ditching the live servers and are essentially making a private server just to avoid the bullshit that is dynamic queue.

These aren't fake accounts either, this is REAL DEAL verified twitter accounts from the pros themself confirming that dynamic queue is shit.

PyroJun 3, 201632 votes

These aren't fake accounts either, this is REAL DEAL verified twitter accounts from the pros themself confirming that dynamic queue is shit.

It's no big news that pros hate dynamic queue, as anyone in high elo does. It's a sum of two problems: the idea of DynQ being cancerous (getting queued up against bigger premades who are already on voice chat) and the new champion select imposing ridiculous queue times.

What some people need to understand is that dynamic queue wasn't just a standalone ideal for Riot to pursue - it's also a way for them to fill up the queue with more people to help the queue times, which are bound to be long as fuck for anyone not queueing as support. The support problem is actually the key to this blunder, as many people would queue as mid/support if that didn't mean they'd get support 90% of the time (at start it was 70%, but the more people got displeased with it and went mid-top, the more the % went up, throwing away even more people).

So the big news here is that pros aren't just complaining, they are actually doing something about it.

YJRBqwXJcSJun 3, 201621 votes

{quoted}

It's no big news that pros hate dynamic queue, as anyone in high elo does. It's a sum of two problems: the idea of DynQ being cancerous (getting queued up against bigger premades who are already on voice chat) and the new champion select imposing ridiculous queue times.

What some people need to understand is that dynamic queue wasn't just a standalone ideal for Riot to pursue - it's also a way for them to fill up the queue with more people to help the queue times, which are bound to be long as fuck for anyone not queueing as support. The support problem is actually the key to this blunder, as many people would queue as mid/support if that didn't mean they'd get support 90% of the time (at start it was 70%, but the more people got displeased with it and went mid-top, the more the % went up, throwing away even more people).

So the big news here is that pros aren't just complaining, they are actually doing something about it.

precisely, they are willing to stop making twitch money to continue being good at this game thats clearly still fucking them over.

AdonnaJun 3, 20163 votes

I thought the exact same thing: I'm sure these pro players make bank on Twitch subs and donations and then throw in advertising their sponsors through ads on stream - they are giving up this because it's so bad. On the flip side of this, if more pros stop streaming it gives the smaller challenger streamers a chance to get more viewers however at the cost of improving their play BECAUSE they aren't practicing against the pros.

The Yetii RiderJun 3, 20164 votes

{quoted}

After reading this there is no way in hell you can approve of dynamic queue. The very people who make a living off this game, and have CONTINUED to master this game. Are basically ditching the live servers and are essentially making a private server just to avoid the bullshit that is dynamic queue.

These aren't fake accounts either, this is REAL DEAL verified twitter accounts from the pros themself confirming that dynamic queue is shit.

It's not because it's disagreeable, they just CAN'T play as 5s in Dynamic Queue at their elo, because 5s getting matched against solos happens so often up there.

RoodToobJun 3, 20164 votes

Ive been fine with DQ, but as a Plat player. As much as i support the mode, its always seemed obvious it isn't the competitive answer for people in extremely high elo. Unfortunately, thats the top 1% of players that are extremely negatively affected.

The bottom 99% is not perfect, but is better than the old Solo/Duo ONCE RIOT FIXES THE SYSTEM THEY MADE. Until then, DQ is not ideal, not by a long shot.

Theres also the issue with having 5 mans on the same ladder as solos, but i don't know how to fix that problem without causing real issues either. ~~We can remove DQ, which would cause all of the more casual players to be as outraged as hardcore players are for the removal of solo queue,~~ EDIT: i just realized a bunch of casuals are well, casuals, and are probably fine with normals, so they might not care as much as i initially said

OR we can create 2 ranked systems, which splits the player base in two and causes massive queue times for anyone that isn't support. That would be much worse in times than what we have now.

I would say return to solo duo with the new champ select to be the best option, (and it probably is) BUT it could still cause issues with those who have had fun with 3/4 friends in ranked (you know, those premeds that are dicks and are nice people)

Either way theres an issue with a portion of the player base

The WhamboozlerJun 3, 20163 votes

PURE solo queue and ranked 5's team mode. TADA.

I think there are enough ranked teams that queue times won't be TOO long, and people can play solo again. High Elos might have trouble finding 5 man teams to match themselves against... but they're having trouble getting into queue NOW too, so not much would change. They could at least go solo and get into games.

AhristocatsJun 3, 201658 votes

"not allowed to stream"

pretty much means "don't show our failed work to the word"

good job riot, you ruined esport and your competitive game is no longer competitive.

Best princess EUJun 3, 201621 votes

i think riot is like "if you leave you lose your stream" kind of a blackmail so they stay and play dynamic queue

NilokJun 3, 20168 votes

Sounds like they are calling their threat. The lack is streaming in their view is the lesser of two evils than having to endure Dynamic Queue.

I wonder if big meta shifts and reactive nerfs, like what happened to Azir from his profession play, will still happen if the rest of the community can never see it save for a live tournament.

Mai Waifu IreliaJun 3, 20165 votes

What? They've never been allowed to stream the tournament realm I don't think? Based on what the tweets said. Its like a private ladder for competitive play/teams, probably what they use to scrim(?) It's not riot blackmailing them lmao jesus I'm all for calling out riots mistakes but baseless conspiracy-tier stuff like that belongs somewhere else.

Best princess EUJun 3, 20164 votes

, why can't they stream then? in competition it's normal, but here there are no tournaments.

EfficientDynamoJun 3, 20163 votes

Most likely because they signed an agreement when they got their tournament accounts (which allow them to do this at all) barring them from streaming games from that server. Riot wants to be able to control the display of tournaments. Otherwise anyone in the LCS could stream their LCS games and circumvent Riot's publishing deals.

KONO RUBICK DAJun 3, 20165 votes

you forgot one thing

there is NO LCS right now.

EfficientDynamoJun 3, 20165 votes

You are missing the point. The contract would be tied to the use of the tournament server, period, and not to any specific event. They can't stream any games off the server because Riot would want to include a clause that makes sure they can control the publication of pro games like the LCS, which occur only on this server.

It isn't really relevant that these games aren't tournament/Riot-sponsored, since the contract would be tied to the specific login the players would need to access this server.

WadeWilson1337Jun 3, 20162 votes

Na, its not that. They dont allow them to stream because they want them to play on the main ladder to promote the game and such. It is basically blackmail. But dont be shocked if Riot just does yet another band-aid fix and just tells pros "Stahp it." with no further reasoning.

Johr DinhJun 3, 201616 votes

This is gonna hurt the game overall. It will probably make high elo dynamic a mess, the attraction of ranking up to play against pros will be gone, pros wont stream as much if at all which I would assume would hurt the presence of the game on Twitch. This is a mess:(

YJRBqwXJcSJun 3, 201622 votes

[{quoted}](name=Johr Dinh,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=8WQgMLR4,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2016-06-03T10:32:13.527+0000)

This is gonna hurt the game overall. It will probably make high elo dynamic a mess, the attraction of ranking up to play against pros will be gone, pros wont stream as much if at all which I would assume would hurt the presence of the game on Twitch. This is a mess:(

good, either riot gets their shit together. Or they burn in hell.

StraleyJun 3, 20165 votes

I guess they are gonna burn in hell lol.

YordlelayhehooJun 3, 201614 votes

"you like DQ because we said so." Riot 2016

ShinkoMinoriJun 3, 201612 votes

WHAT ARE THE RIOT FANBOYS GOING TO SAY NOW?! ARE THE BRONZE/SILVER SCRUBS COMPLAINING? ARE THE MINORITY? FOR REAL?!!? MOST PEOPLE LOVE DYNAMIC QUEUE?!!? IS THE BEST THING THAT HAPPENED TO LEAGUE?!!

Meep ManJun 3, 20164 votes

I have always said Dynamic Queue itself was a good addition. HOWEVER, the removal of Solo Queue is the worst decision I have ever heard. My standing has been to keep Dynamic Queue and add Solo Queue for those that want it since so many want it. Riot's decision to never add back Solo Queue is terrible and absolutely devastating to the game. I was patient, even after all the delays of them saying Solo Queue would come back eventually. However, now that they have announced that Solo Queue is never returning, I must say that it was an extremely idiotic decision. Dynamic Queue is good, but having it only is terrible. Riot's steps to make Dynamic Queue better are actually really bad as well. They took away Team Builder since the new Champion Select has made it to where you have 2 roles you will always get, which is basically as close to Ranked Team Builder as you can get. However, now with Auto Fill coming in, there is absolutely no reason for them to have removed Team Builder. Guess there wasn't enough assets to maintain Team Builder. The biggest screw up is the removal of 5-mans in Diamond 5+ for majority of the day. That is just... terrible. How can Riot even say that they are advertising this game as a sport anymore? They have almost completely removed the ability for 5-man teams to train in a competitive environment. That in and of itself is, to sound a little childish, stupid. I mean, sure, long queue times stink, but completely removing 5-mans for the majority of the day? That's the worse possible step toward making the situation better, especially since a lot of Diamond+ players are, guess what, teams.

ACENOXJun 3, 201611 votes

What is an in-house solo queue? why can't they stream?

YJRBqwXJcSJun 3, 20162 votes

{quoted}

What is an in-house solo queue? why can't they stream?

they basically made a private server of league. That means regular everyday people (which i wouldn't be surprised because the coding for this game is OLD AS FUCK) Made their own version of league without dynamic queue

KONO RUBICK DAJun 3, 20164 votes

WAIT, IS THERE ANY VERSION FOR EUW?

YJRBqwXJcSJun 3, 20163 votes

{quoted}

WAIT, IS THERE ANY VERSION FOR EUW?

i think only pros have it atm.

KONO RUBICK DAJun 3, 20162 votes

So, only those who play in LCS? which means this isn't soloQ since they are like 20 people

SohleksJun 3, 20165 votes

Basically. You need a Riot specifically made account. They're for LCS/challenger scene players and maybe other people involved in that stuff

KONO RUBICK DAJun 3, 20161 votes

i see, well too bad. why aren't they playing custom games then? they can stream it.

DorkunedAurasJun 3, 20162 votes

they are specifically banned from streaming it.

DarkRitualJun 3, 20166 votes

He's asking about customs from normal servers.

ku ni chi waJun 3, 20163 votes

how can they Play with each other? i mean with which Playerbase?

NilokJun 3, 201649 votes

I think they may be referring to Riot's tournament realm that they used to run major tournaments, which is separate from the public realms, but have access to since they have specially made accounts from Riot.

Regardless, having professional players abandon the live server should be making the people at Riot panic, as these are the people that turn the most heads and bring in the most views, and in turn, players and revenue.

SohleksJun 3, 20162 votes

I think the tourney realm is where challenger level teams go and compete. Stuff like that. It may be on an earlier dated patch at times.

2 points: riot does have the plug on that still; nobody 3rd party made it lol. Also it's still dynamic queue I believe; but it's basically a big giant empty ladder with nothing but like minded professional players compete'ing for hehe, all the silver and bronze they can eat. Gonna be the hardest silver in the whole world :-)

SohleksJun 3, 20169 votes

Priceless gif here

manbearswineJun 3, 20164 votes

This isn't really about dynamic que, this is about 5v5 ranked being gone and now no option for it in regular ranked, they could just reintroduce old ranked 5v5 and it would solve this problem.

Anyway, I'm fairly sure they've expected this, and actually prefer this to teams not practicing.

Steven McburnJun 3, 20166 votes

What? The TR has 5v5 and solo queue. They don't care about 5 man queuing on DQ NA, they care about the quality of matches they're getting which are currently piss poor.

This has nothing to do with scrims, which are preplanned and set up in advance, this has to do with what the players are doing on an individual basis after the 5's practices.

NoblewindJun 3, 20164 votes

I think it's more a matter of getting the highest possible competition/no queue wait times for training purposes rather than them being fed up. Way to spin the story in your favour lol

If youre talking about NA, remember these are pros who go to Korea to train their hardest, NA ranked isn't exactly the best place to become world class, especially with the queue times

Voluug13Jun 3, 20168 votes

Yes, because it always happened before in every single season, and specially under SoloQ.

If they feel that DQ no longers gives them what SoloQ gave them for literal years, its because of something being wrong.

Dont try to be a Rito apologist, at this point of the mess, there is no point other that being a petty contrarian.

Ereiser00Jun 3, 20163 votes

DL litterally said he won't play ranked till DQ is somehow fixed.

MasochistJun 3, 20162 votes

Lol, these people are an extreme, extreme minority. If you were a business, who would you cater towards?

Dextix LTJun 3, 20162 votes

Just like they were the extreme minority in Runescape and WOW.

Oh wait...........

MasochistJun 4, 20161 votes

And WoW "catering" to the lowest common denominator isn't the reason the game started sucking.

People have slowly been getting tired of the genre completely - and guess what, Runescape and WoW are still immensely popular.

Dextix LTJun 4, 20164 votes

No, that is the reason. Because despite being tired of the genre people were not getting tired of WOW.

Targeting the lowest common denominator (LCD for short) makes games fall.

The hardcore playebase, the veterans are the most important part of the game. They are the most dedicated. Once you srart losing them and cater to the LCD the game starts falling, because LCD are more volatile. They are not as loyal, as dedicated, and they will leave a lot sooner from a game.

And if you lose your dedicated playerbase, the game starts dying.

And again, people themselves said why they didnt like both of those games anymore. IT was the changes., not exaustion from the genre. Since the changes in cataclysm, WOW players said that this is bad direction for the game. The casualisation of it. THey said that this ruins game difficulty and experience. Even the presented stories took a dip in quality.

And when runescape introduced its "evolved" version the same happened. Just like now in LOL, people started arguing against it, saying that its bad for the game and asking for the old school experience or the changes being reverted. Until Jagex introduced old school servers, the game lost millions of players, just like that.

And now its LOL turn. Becquse people arent getting tired of the genre, they are angered by nonsensical changes.

ShonjlJun 4, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Lol, these people are an extreme, extreme minority. If you were a business, who would you cater towards?

The pros. Yes Casuals are where the money comes from, but where do the Casuals come from? The pro scene. No pro scene, no noticable influx of new players.

Also the pros aren't exactly costing Riot, they bring in a ton of money for Riot as well.

Zone of EndlessJun 4, 20161 votes

{quoted}

The pros. Yes Casuals are where the money comes from, but where do the Casuals come from? The pro scene. No pro scene, no noticable influx of new players.

Also the pros aren't exactly costing Riot, they bring in a ton of money for Riot as well.

Casuals come from people who enjoy the game. A game don't need a professional scene to be enjoyable. The pro scene come from casuals because if no one plays your game then no one is gonna watch your game.

ShonjlJun 6, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Casuals come from people who enjoy the game. A game don't need a professional scene to be enjoyable. The pro scene come from casuals because if no one plays your game then no one is gonna watch your game.

You are pretty misguided if you think that. Why you think they push the LCS on everyone so hard? That is 95% of their advertisement. Without that, League wouldn't even be heard of by anything other than people that currently play it now.

No advertisement means no casuals, since all casuals want is some flashy lights to draw them in like the sheep they mostly are, until something else flashy or shiny gets their attention and they move on. Not intentionally rude but its pretty accurate. If the pros are starting to go against Riot, that means Riot is in a very bad spot right now, and if they ignore the pros too, that actually WILL kill the game, unlike what most doomsayers say.

BTW the pros get paid for streaming, they are willingly forgoing money they can make to actually deny Riot their Dynamic Que.

Zone of EndlessJun 6, 20161 votes

{quoted}

You are pretty misguided if you think that. Why you think they push the LCS on everyone so hard? That is 95% of their advertisement. Without that, League wouldn't even be heard of by anything other than people that currently play it now.

No advertisement means no casuals, since all casuals want is some flashy lights to draw them in like the sheep they mostly are, until something else flashy or shiny gets their attention and they move on. Not intentionally rude but its pretty accurate. If the pros are starting to go against Riot, that means Riot is in a very bad spot right now, and if they ignore the pros too, that actually WILL kill the game, unlike what most doomsayers say.

BTW the pros get paid for streaming, they are willingly forgoing money they can make to actually deny Riot their Dynamic Que.

And how do you think LCS even started? It wasn't because Riot really pushed for it in season 1 or 2 or anything. They saw their game grew big. They saw what potential it brings when they saw how big their playerbase gotten and went with it.

SC2 is a prime example of needing casuals to make a competitive scene. Why did you think SC2 died? Because it's harder to get into it than League so there's less casual to watch competitive SC2.

edit: where did you even think riot got the money to create LCS and advertise it in the first place? From pros in season 1? I don't think so. It's no surprise at this point that pretty much all the pros hate dynamic Q.