Why are you nerfing karthus?

Keitron·Dec 8, 2015·7 votes·630 views

Low pickrate and a 51% winrate, why the nerf?

Hes the 121 champion to be picked.... 1.83% chance of being picked

24 Comments

NekusenDec 9, 20154 votes

Because Yasuo has 53% ban rate and is seen in practically every friking match

So they decided to nerf Karthus

Dominick DestineDec 9, 20154 votes

{quoted}

Because has 53% ban rate and is seen in practically every friking match

So they decided to nerf

Karthus cannot be stopped by Windwall.

THEREFORE NERF KARTHS.

JefftiffyDec 9, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dominick Destine,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wYhq8FXi,comment-id=00060000,timestamp=2015-12-09T22:16:32.528+0000)

Karthus cannot be stopped by Windwall.

THEREFORE NERF KARTHS.

^Agreed. I loved playing Karthus against Mr. Weeboo Tryhard the 3rd. He cryed every time because I would zone him with Q and if he went in he was faced with a wall and a buttload of Q and E damage. I'm sorry that my champs counters close range. Maybe you pick someone like Xerath, Nidalee, or any other champ know for range.

VesarixxDec 9, 20152 votes

If I had to guess, maybe the upcoming changes to AP(low mobility caster rebalancing and new items) are expected to make him extremely powerful, they did the same thing with Amumu and Shyvana in the past when they were changing the jungle.

KeitronDec 9, 20151 votes

So they nerf him 12 months before season 7???

VesarixxDec 9, 20151 votes

Are we still talking about Karthus here? the Amumu changes were because of a past season change not season 6, it was when cinderhulk was being released to replace juggernaut, and the Shyvanna ones were around the time devourer was reworked.

LadyRenlyDec 9, 20152 votes

Because fuck you play Yasuo

Indominus BladeDec 9, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Because fuck you play Yasuo

yasuo sucks rofl

AtheosisXDec 9, 20152 votes

Because Riot's balance team is clueless. Do people still not get this by now?

KeitronDec 9, 20152 votes

A rioter must have gotten destroyed by a karthus main cried and nerfed him. I dont think it was even on the PBE it was a silent nerf so people might not notice.

IcyPepperDec 9, 20152 votes

They consider more factors than pick and win rate, you know. Don't assume that, that's how you lose credibility :V

Otherwise, I got nothing.

edit: AM I WRONG?

KeitronDec 9, 20151 votes

121 champions are picked more then him meaning even the mains can keep up being positive in winrate, you dont see brand mains having a low popularity do you?

IcyPepperDec 9, 20152 votes

I don't really get your point there.

I'm saying there's more than two variables here, not denying that the two variables you're presenting are factual.

KeitronDec 9, 20151 votes

Oh and what other equally important variables are there ?

IcyPepperDec 9, 20151 votes

That's stuff you should probably look up on your own, rather than rely on an user as a source.

Some tidbits I've picked up from Reds and players alike include that 50% winrates aren't always balanced, examining win rate graphed with number of games played, high skillcaps meaning lower winrates (such as Azir), low skillfloors that boost the winrates of champions in lower elos, not buffing champions because the current meta doesn't favor them because they would be overpowered if it shifted in their favor again, and so on.

Now, let's look at Karthus's stats. Now, by no means am I advocating nerfs on him, jesus no. I'm just trying to look at this unbiased.

His core build is pretty solid and defined, but doesn't seem like an outlier in any case.

Comparing his most popular and most successful masteries, it seems like he experiences (on average) a 6.00% winrate increase just by changing a single tier 2 mastery. That's... odd, but I can see why 2% extra damage on his kit is more useful than feast.

He also experiences a decent ~5% winrate boost with a change in runes, needing only scaling health seals to do the job. Decent increase if he takes exhaust over ~~revive~~ teleport (come on guys, with his ult he doesn't need the global mobility...) Gonna just go out and say here, it's pretty common for all these scenarios. After all, the most popular path doesn't necessarily guarantee the most success, otherwise we wouldn't have philosophy majors and Bronze Lee Sin mains.

One thing I see is that this guy counters Yasuo and Leblanc hard, but what worries me more is that this guy is countered by Brand even harder. Much harder. As in "holy shit nerf Brand or give Karthus something" harder.

Anyway, you see where I'm getting at? I don't have a problem with your opinion, I'm just trying to push you into broadening your position to have more credibility and spark better conversations. Win rate and pick rate, when you get down to it, are just numbers. You need to understand the why as well as the what.

That aside, I don't see why Karthus is getting nerfed. Seems silly to me.

KeitronDec 9, 20151 votes

LOL of course there is going to be massive differentiates in winrates of runes and masteries when hes 1.83% picked i mean you dont see this for lee, vayne tahm do you?

IcyPepperDec 9, 20151 votes

Actually yes I do see it for Lee Sin.

Granted, the winrate changes a bit smaller... usually. If we look at Lee Sin's masteries, there's a difference of ~11% winrate boost from the most popular masteries to the most effective masteries.

Go ahead and look, I'm not shitting you.

edit: And I would appreciate a response if possible :V Someone's already salty about my post, and I really hope it's not you. Thought we had some good discussion.

3TWarriorDec 10, 20151 votes

the issue seems to be karthus's synergy with, was it called Ferver of Battle?

of course, he probably works well with any of the new enhancements, but who knows and the reason makes no sense given that his Q is a multi-target effect, as are all of his others

and even then, his damage was negligible unless the opponents could force you to play within his zone of death

IcyPepperDec 10, 20151 votes

Huh, that makes sense I guess?

3TWarriorDec 10, 20151 votes

and according to another thread, it is his synergy with deathfire touch and his E, which previous to DFT's nerfs, made much more sense, but with the minimal amount of damage damage over time spells do now with it...I don't see why they saw fit to nerf him

Lord MalpercioDec 9, 20152 votes

What in the literal fuck, Karthus nerfs? Like really? Karthus is probably one of the least seen nor overbearing champions. Fuck, half the time he has to DIE to even position himself properly.

M0b1usDec 9, 20151 votes

Because Riot wants this to be a crit and snowball meta. Karthus can wave clear and slow teams down, so it messes with the meta and Riot doesn't want anyone who can do that.

Stevev45Dec 9, 20151 votes

I think Riot wants Marksman to be able to duel mages. Instead of mages countering Marksman. Seems like Riot's changes over the past few years have been in that direction.