Who is working on which of the "Big 6"-Mage Champions?

Shaian·Feb 6, 2016·44 votes·23,064 views

Just too curious :O

188 Comments

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 201639 votes

I have design ownership on Malzahar and Cassiopeia for their upcoming changes.

CaythelesFeb 7, 201618 votes

Plz let Malz Dance while he ults.

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 201631 votes

How do you know he'll have the same ult?

DecritFeb 7, 20164 votes

not sure if trolly or teaser :D

( if he changes ult, i bet it will become something more aligned to summon )

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 201614 votes

At least one, maybe both :D

RalanrFeb 7, 20164 votes

Two champions? Are you a machine?

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 201621 votes

This is pretty common, since with these group updates we tend to only heavily change one or two skills per champion. I'm also working on Taric, and although he's only one champion, due to its scope, he'll likely require more design work than both Malz and Cass.

Awkward CouchFeb 7, 20161 votes

I've heard the new Taric was gameplay tested a couple months back, is he almost ready? (Soon™)

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 201622 votes

He was gameplay tested over a year ago. He had to wait for the production team to be able to get to him. We've had quite a few people on site to test him now, ranging from random Taric mains to pro players in the off season, and it seems like people generally had a good time with him.

As to whether he's almost ready, he gets closer every working day.

MrBuffingtonFeb 7, 201617 votes

{quoted}

We've had quite a few people on site to test him now, ranging from random Taric mains to pro players in the off season, and it seems like people generally had a good time with him.

Time to main some obscure champion who's badly in need of a relaunch so I can get invited to Riot

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 201628 votes

It may just be crazy enough to work...

Raid Boss MordeFeb 7, 20164 votes

Is there a reason Mordekaiser mains weren't invited to test him during his rework? He did have the largest changes of the juggernauts :(

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 201626 votes

We didn't do user testing for Juggernauts due to a short timeline and the expectation that they wouldn't be large in scope. We were wrong, and that ended up being a poor choice.

Raid Boss MordeFeb 7, 20164 votes

I see.... well, if he ever gets a serious rework in the future, I live close by the Riot HQ in LA... so.... I'm here if you ever need help! ;)

RalanrFeb 7, 20163 votes

It's actually Taric's rework that led to this question. I'm guessing that because he's mostly done you have more time to work on other projects?

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 20169 votes

Pretty much, yeah. Most of my work on Taric at this point is reacting to the playtest teams' balance analyses, hooking up effects and animations for the team's artists, or just helping to keep the team moving forward toward hitting deadlines.

Aside from the occasional meeting and number change here and there, there isn't a bunch of difficult design work to do at this point.

Solidair3Feb 7, 20162 votes

How do you come up with numbers for new/reworked champs, anyway?

I am prepared for a boring answer if that is what it takes.

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 20166 votes

By numbers, do you mean...

"How do you decide how many champions to do in these group updates?" or... "How do you decide on the numbers so that a new/reworked champion is balanced on release?"

Solidair3Feb 7, 20163 votes

Balance numbers!

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 20165 votes

Nowadays, I let our playtest team inform me when they think the numbers are out of line, and we try to nudge the champion in the direction of balance in a way that doesn't compromise their strength/weakness profile.

Jeddy017Feb 7, 20162 votes

Well,he did do 2 for the marksman update ( KogMaw & Quinn .And 2 for the Juggernaut ( Garen & Skarner ). I think the champ UP team is going with 2 champ per designer for these roster updates.

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 20169 votes

A few things have changed on the team, with people swapping around teams with the new year, but I stayed put to continue doing roster updates for the time being. We currently have 4 designers working on the 6 large updates, so we won't all end up doing 2.

CaythelesFeb 7, 201620 votes

That has nothing to do with what i mean my lord!!!! , i was just hoping....that when he ults whatever the ult may be, let him bust out his sweet moves and bring all the voidrippers to the yard!

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 201638 votes

Who leaked the voidripper ultimate concept? I didn't think we had talked about that yet publicly.

CaythelesFeb 7, 201619 votes

See you would think that, however you keep forgetting i am just you Replying to my own replies to yourself on a normal account.

Tempo Ekko leaked.

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 201634 votes

Weird. It's like the leaks leak themselves.

DevilishMetalFeb 7, 201613 votes

did u just

Kuroi86Feb 7, 20167 votes

Riotception...

CaythelesFeb 7, 20163 votes

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/skin-champion-concepts/JgGA7fMA-tempo-ekko

Remember when we were talking to eachother through the mirror? "You look great in a sunday dress by the way" and we were rehersing on how we would ask KateyKhaos on a date? and bring this up to her?

good times.

HellioningFeb 7, 20164 votes

Please do better then the Quinn remake in regards to communicating. If you're going to remove something from Cass and/or Malz, at least tell us why.

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 201620 votes

I'll continue to try my best. I do feel like in Quinn's case, I was pretty open and honest about what was going on, but for certain design decisions, there were players that just disagreed.

HellioningFeb 7, 20166 votes

"I know there are some people that liked fighting as Valor, but that's not gonna happen. I'm sorry if this is a dealbreaker for you and I hope you can enjoy other champions!" "Okay, but why are you making Valor unable to fight?" "I'm sorry if this is a dealbreaker for you, and I hope you can enjoy other champions!"

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 201623 votes

Yeah, that was me being honest about what was going on.

HellioningFeb 7, 20165 votes

And that's also not answering the question that I asked.

Let's say that Valor is never going to fight. Okay.

Why? What was so bad about Valor fighting? Did you not enjoy the Assassin-y playstyle that Valor provided? Did you not think a ranged champs turning into a melee champ for an ultimate wasn't powerful? Do you just have something against birds?

I've already written off Quinn as someone that I play often. I don't really have a dog in this race anymore. But I would at least like some answers.

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 201613 votes

It didn't make sense for her to fight as Valor anymore. In order for that to ever be a good idea, she would need something that made that a good idea. The old reason why it was sometimes something you wanted to do was to burst a guy hard, which we didn't think was appropriate in the version of Quinn that had no ultimate cooldown.

BetweenSkillFeb 7, 20165 votes

The issue is that, at least for me (and I'm assuming from feedback, others), that dual-identity was a core concept in her what it felt like to play as her. Her ult was impactful, it felt good to use.

You pressed R and it was like "Okay time to kick some ass", now it's very clunky an empty feeling to me. It's just Quinn, Valor feeling about as important as that old lady sweeping the streets in the back alley of Whiterun from Skyrim.

Why was assassin Quinn unhealthy? Two dynamic sets with her performing as a kitey/utility ADC, and when you see a lone target escaping the clutches of Demacian Justice you could go all in.

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 20169 votes

Though I think the champion we made with Quinn's update is a good one, I do acknowledge it came at a cost I'd like to avoid in future updates, hence all this early communication and what-not.

I'm happy to answer questions about Quinn in other threads, but I'd like to keep this one about mages, which is what the post was originally about, and I want to be respectful of the creator. So this will be the last Quinn-related question I'll address.

Quinn had assassination elements, but she could hardly be considered a good assassin. She relied on bullying in lane to get ahead, and had a notorious reputation for being useless when behind. With the exception of her blind, which she used to enable her bullying, she lacked a fallback pattern that wasn't becoming a suicide bomber. I think players liked bursting people as Valor, but I really don't agree that they were two dynamic sets. Thematics aside, Quinn and Valor were basically the same champion, one of which was a little faster, burstier, and riskier.

HellioningFeb 7, 20163 votes

Okay then. http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/0IqHif0z-so-repertoir-wants-to-talk-about-quinn-in-other-threads

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 201618 votes

lol

cvrtFeb 7, 20163 votes

As a bystander in this thread, I understand that you may feel somewhat pressured – but this comes across as both much more smug and much more dismissive than I believe you intended.

AbyssphereFeb 7, 20168 votes

{quoted}

Yeah, that was me being honest about what was going on.

? He's asking why you never answered the question on why you made the design choices you did. Saying "Sorry, this is the choice I made" is ok, but people wanted the reasons behind the choice. You never gave those.

I don't think it's too big a deal, but people are interested to know. I'd personally be curious as to what you thought the problems with Quinn's melee form were, and what you thought the strengths of a permanently ranged character with a non-combat ult were in comparison.

tl;dr people want to know WHY you do things with certain champions, not just... that you wanted to do them. Tell us why some things had to go, why some things had to come in, etc.

Valor BotFeb 7, 20162 votes

I'd like to know this too. I understand they wanted to give her a strategic identity as "the roaming marksman," but did that really necessitate the removal of Valor?

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 201610 votes

Visually, not necessarily. If that question is slightly adjusted into "Did Quinn's new strategic identity necessitate the removal of Valor's burst capabilities?" then the answer is yes.

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 201616 votes

I think more often than not, players can find that information if they look for it. I'm sure somewhere along the way, I answered questions as to why we opted to no longer let Quinn fight in Valor form, as I spent a lot of time talking to players about her. That particular quote, which people like to use as some kind of evidence that I (or Riot more generally) don't listen to players, was cherry picked from my closing comments of the Quinn PBE thread. I wasn't even asked a particular question in that case. I was just giving a daily update.

Earl EulrichFeb 7, 20163 votes

mh, though for me it looks like taric will be handled like shen at this point - finish up, throw on the PBE; ignore all feedback by the actual playerbase of the champion, get positive feedback on release after you create some hype, continue to ignore constructive criticism from the old playerbase...see his winrate go to an all-time low and all players jump ship till some patches in he´d be successfully turned into another Karma that now is loathed by her old mains and still can´t attract many new plaer due to seriously dumbed down/binary design.

and yea. i am a tad bitter with your (not you personally, just Riotas a whole) reworks (SIon is the only one that actually worked out well so far).

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 201614 votes

I somewhat hope his winrate goes to an all time low on release. He's a brand new champion that should require some time to learn, and Taric has spent basically his whole existence at win rates above 50%. If he comes out much over that, he's probably broken.

Earl EulrichFeb 7, 20164 votes

He's a brand new champion

that´s rather frightening considering he already has an established identity. i hope this won´t go to a karma/cassio situation all over again were everyone that enjoyed the champ once just becomes alienated by a forced new identity... i can appreciate him being less of a stat-check, but i sure hope his "elaborate simplicity" doesn´t get altered too much.

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 20169 votes

Simple's the goal for him. I did try to make the feeling of playing him and the overarching things he's trying to do to win familiar, but at the end of the day, he'll be more changed than not.

EROTIC RAID BOSSFeb 7, 20162 votes

{quoted}

I have design ownership on Malzahar and Cassiopeia for their upcoming changes.

Statikk on brand and velkoz, certainlyt on vlad and zyra?

RiotRiotRepertoirFeb 7, 201611 votes

Nope! Though Statikk and CertainlyT both actively engage in feedback and direction setting for the upcoming changes, this time around, neither of them is actually owning the design work on any of the champions. We rotated some designers around teams at the end of the year to get people exposure to some new stuff, so the remaining 4 mages will be taken up by designers doing their first design work of this type.

I'd go into more detail as to who's doing what, but I think it would be more fair to let them have conversations around their projects as they see fit.