A tiny nerf to his ult-mark? That's cute, especially if you think about just how hard he synergizes with the new item.
He has the best waveclear of all assassins, the best poke, the best splitpush, the best safety - and now he gets the strongest synergy with the items. Wow. I'm sick of seeing that champ in every single game I play. At least he will be perma ban now... which means that another toxic pick will come through, yaaaaaaay....
Very Hard Engage39 votesthis nerf is the equivalent to -3ad on vayne.
but its ok its ok, just ban him and the zed main will surley dodge and you wont have to worry about him in the next game.
Dominick Destine12 votesthis nerf is the equivalent to -3ad on vayne.
-3 AD? gutted.
qetzel3 votesit actually dropped her win rate by a little over 2%. It wasn't an insignificant change.
Stars Shaper12 votesDon't worry they'll nerf his attack speed soon or later.
Silents4291 votesThat attack speed nerf was huge, I don't get the joke here.
I'm not even being sarcastic, I saw Zeds mains struggling for a bit to adjust to that.
Stars Shaper1 votesIt's like nerfing Vel'koz hp regen, is a stat that it doesn't concern him at all. Actually nerfing Zed's attack speed has been a buff since he can time his passive better and chose his targets more easily, expecially with the new item.
Silents4291 votesUm, no less attack speed means it takes longer in between farming, assuming you click + move to farm.
It also means he can't proc his passive on marked champions anymore (as fast), lowering his ult damage potential, as well as cutting his ability to split push.
Stars Shaper1 votesYou only need your passive to last hit minions and if you spend too much time on your target to attack 2-3 times after your ultimate you are a dead Zed (implying you have competent enemies).
Silents4292 votesIt's usually the incompetent that rampage about Zed having no counterplay and being broken.
The attack speed nerfs were a huge hit.
FastAsHeck2 votes
5 ad
Starcraft243ver3 votesVayne is not in a really good spot atm (not because of the nerf, but because of the meta).
Very Hard Engage1 votesVayne is not in a really good spot atm (not because of the nerf, but because of the meta).
vaynes not good because the game is decided in the first 15minutes.... not because vayne is any weaker.
its all about the early lead and tower pushing right now.
Axis the Dragon2 votesWhich is... exactly what he said. Vayne is weak because the meta, not because she was nerfed. ._.
Saianna26 votesRioter_Boss: How to fix Zeds getting perma banned? Rioter_minion_1: M..Maybe N..n...nerf.. him? Rioter_Boss: You have just been demoted to toilet cleaning. Take this man away! Rioter_Guards: Yes, sire! Rioter_minion_2: Maybe lets remove bans from the game? Rioter_Boss: !... Great idea!
LegendmakerGX11 votesCan't even call this a nerf, His ult use to do 40% not 50% so Riot lowering it to 45% while giving him a new item is still consider a buff to me.
AninLegions7777 votesMate. Have you even played Zed? Come on! I have over 500 games (not that much) with him on different accounts so let me dissect your post:
You are just bitter because you have probably been losing lanes to Zed and you don't want to put in effort to stop that so you are looking for an easy way (nerf). Sorry mate. That won't happen.
I for one, am overjoyed whenever I see Zed on the enemy team. Pick Fizz or Talon or Malz or even Syndra and he's practically useless. Get Zhonyas/QSS and congratulations, you have successfully removed half his burst. It's not hard. So stop whining.
IGotScuttleCrabs1 votesI agree with most that. I think that problem is that he's at least really good at all those. Of that list, all those champions are best at 1 and good at 1 maybe 2. Zed is just all around good at all those. That's the main complaint people have.
Why call the best plumed in the world to come work on your house when you can call a great jack of all trades to fix multiple shi get in your house?
AninLegions7773 votesNice analogy and I get that. But the problem with nerfing one aspect of a "Jack of all trades" is that you might end up messing up something else. Just look at when Riot gave him a 1 sec delay on his R. My God, the threads that popped up on that one. Now imagine if they reduce his R dmg to 25%. Zed will get Urgot level of pick rate.
KomePrePongo7 votesSo you're basically saying that Zed can do EVERYTHING very good (second place), but there are options who are number ones. Only thing, that you can't pick 3 champions (talon, shaco, lb) on 1 mid, but you CAN pick zed and be excessively good at everything.
AninLegions7773 votesWho says he's second place? I'm just talking about assassins. There are bruisers than do those things even better and faster. I even forgot to mention Yi. I think we all know the difference between a fed Zed and a fed Talon/LB/Shaco. You always prefer a fed Zed. Why? Cos those 3 champs can delete you with 0 counter play while Zed has Zhonyas/QSS already making his life a living hell. Say otherwise.
KomePrePongo8 votesStop saying zhonya counter Zed completely, it doesn't It can give you time if your team is around you to react and highest hope for you is not dying to ult+new item. Because in 1v1 zed doesn't care about zhonya, he can kill you right after you get out of stasis. Damn, zed now doesn't evenneed his ult, w+q+e+aa+thunderlord is a TON od damage from level 3 to end of the game. Zed is not healthy. He has too much of everything. The only counterplay to him is ban. If you think outplay = you're not dead+enemy is dead, with zed it's "you're not dead+ zed said "pussy" in all chat and pressed one button to return to safely". Too bad Zed isn't the only problem in season 6, there are around 20 champions who are overtuned completely and Rito's intentions to bring diversity in roles turned out to 2-3 champions who are easily the best in their role and picking anyone else is considered either stupid or presumptuously.
AninLegions7771 votesPlease. When Zed ults you, he usually drops his W immediately meaning that once you Zhonya, he'll probably have used his Q and E leaving him without abilities or energy. So yes, Zhonyas counters it. Also, why the fck would you 1v1 Zed when you aren't stronger than him? It's just like trying to 1v1 Jax as Xin or Yi. Just pointless. If you use that W>Q>E>AA combo as Zed, chances are you'll get insta-CCed and you'll have a bad trade. Also, the enemy jungler may be waiting in the brush for you to use your W and you are a sitting duck.
Zed IS healthy. He requires multiple plays to get really good. The good Zeds I lose to usually have over 200 games and outplayed me good. Zed's R has over a minute long CD even at rank 2 so if he doesn't kill anyone with it, that's a lot of assassination potential and Safety gone. If you can't capitalize on that, then you are the one to blame.
Hope you don't mind, I looked at your ranked stat with Zed. I even have more games with him on my smurf and last I played with that was 2014. I don't know how I can talk about a champ when you might not even know his weaknesses. I'm sorry but I don't think this should continue. Have a good day.
KomePrePongo1 votesIt's not rocket science, you don't need 200 hours of playing to know a champion. Also, you are completely wrong with this argument. Why? Because I'm not talking about ME playing zed, I'm talking about me playing AGAINST zed and trust me I've had my time with this. Tell me Zed's weaknesses. Only Zed's. No "gank him\cc him" it can be applied to all champions (plus zed can either escape gank with W or build qss if he's countered hard. Mercury blade has also very good stats for him). I tell you what, Mr. lvl-19-I'm-afraid-to-show-my-silver-main, Zed currently is the most unhealthiest assassin in the game, with bs damage, personal item, <10sec flash and free out of the jail button. I don't like playing Zed. There was a time when to perform good with zed you had to really show some skill. Now Zed can faceroll his entire kit and all his plays could be considered as outplay, he did get a kill, right? Because, it's impossible not to.
AninLegions7771 votesHis weaknesses? High CD on his main escape ability since it is maxed last.
Not as much ranged poke as AP mages
No hard CC only an unreliable slow
Easily has majority of his burst countered by two items: QSS/Zhonyas
Easily ganked when W is on CD.
These are his weaknesses. Also will he escape with his W when half the people saying that Zed is OP think it has a 4 sec CD. It has an 18 sec CD at level one and that's how it will be until level 12/13. So it's easy for a jungler to sit in a brush and wait for Zed to use his W then gank him and kill him or force him to flash. Not rocket science.
Make fun all you want man. Main got banned from boards cos someone posted a spam link with this account. I really don't care what you think. I'm playing with experienced players and that's all that counts. He's not the unhealthiest. You keep saying stuff you can't back up. LB's Q>R<W deletes any ADC faster than Zed can. And unlike Zed, no one builds QSS against her to cleanse her mark, meaning she'll keep deleting ADCs. Same with Talon, thanks to vision nerfs, he's almost impossible to fight as an ADC. He's also Zed's second worst nightmare after Malzahar. Ez gets a flashlike ability in shorter time. Same with Lucian. You really need to stop complaining and learn how to counter the champ.
KomePrePongo1 votesHigh CD on his main escape ability since it is maxed last. cdr+e gives -2 seconds for each champ hit. Not as much ranged poke as AP mages Hahaha, really? He has more poke than most of the mages. He is considered OP now for amount of poke he can do during the laning phase. First, he can spam his Q as soon as it's off cooldown and he won't run out of energy. Second, his W+Q has more range than flipping XERATH which is considered synonym for poke No hard CC only an unreliable slow Why do you need cc? That would be too overloaded. Easily has majority of his burst countered by two items: QSS/Zhonyas No. I already explained two posts higher. Easily ganked when W is on CD. Arguable. All champions are "easily ganked when their escape tool is on cooldown", it's not Zed weakness. Plus, you can ult ranged champ, run behind him, slow jungler with E from your initial position's shadow and if they are chasing you\trying to kill just tp back to your ult's shadow and boom - you are safe. So it's easy for a jungler to sit in a brush and wait for Zed to use his W then gank him and kill him or force him to flash. Nice way of balancing. Now we just need to add a 6th player to every team facing zed - he will be constantly sitting on mid waiting for zed to burn his W. What about wards? Do you know that zed is the best champion to kill minions under the turret? This should give you a hint on how to counter your statement. LB's Q>R<W deletes any ADC faster than Zed can We're not talking about someone fed against not-fed Zed. Fed zed can jump with ult Q-E-AA+Thunderlord delete adc in less than 1 second, but he should be really fed. Like that LB with q-r-w. See the patter? The difference is, if LB is not fed, she fails at assasinaton. If Zed is not fed, you just have to wait 2 second after that for your ult to proc and deal >half of the target hp.
Same with Talon, thanks to vision nerfs, he's almost impossible to fight as an ADC Again, only fed one. Plus talon is counter by one item that costs 75g and an adequate support that can peel. Plus, if talon made a mistake, he's dead. Zed just presses 1 button. ADCs don't have means to fight assassins, they are not made to.
AninLegions7771 votesYou are against ranged champs. How many times will you possibly hit them with your E? 2 times tops when you use your shadow and that's still 14 seconds to wait and don't forget that starts AFTER his shadow disappears.
His Q poke is mostly used to last hit minions. If you aim champs, you'll either miss or deal really low dmg thanks to it's dmg being reduced by minions. His W has a long CD. Also read above for the rest. Can't copy and paste it twice. Now in that time, any ranged champ can land enough skillshots than he can trade thereby putting him in a low hp situation.
Well Kennen has CC. Very short CC and effective too.
Yes it does. I won't bother checking those posts. If it doesn't negate, then why is it mostly purchased when you are up against Zed? Tell me pls.
Nah mate. AP midlaners usually don't have escapes. You know why they are hardly ganked? Cos they are ranged and overextend less making it hard to gank safely. Also, they have CC to stop the enemy jungler in his tracks. So yeah that's a weakness. Yeah mate, like that will work against Malz or Lux or Fizz. Man it's to easy to counter than combo. Also one person stays at his R shadow until it's gone. That's how to be sure he doesn't use his R again.
Lool. What do you mean constantly? At low elo and sometimes in high elo, most Zed players use their W immediately it's up to poke laner. It's easy to wait for it to go on CD. Wards? Please read about the vision nerfs. Moving on, ermm, then don't hard push lane? Zed pretty much pushes the lane really fast when he's not being poked. So there's your answer. Don't poke and he'll push giving your jungler a chance to nail him.
Who says LB needs to be fed? She has high AP %, high base ability dmg, a mark that does a shit load of dmg when procced and you proc it twice so you see now. LB with Morellos can reduce an ADC to 1/4 hp. LB with Morellos and Luden's Echo will straight out delete the ADC. Also, most people itemize armor over MR sooooo....You see now why LB can oneshot faster than Zed?
There are only so many pinks that you can get for Talon. That's the thing with Talon, he might not even be seen before he engages. With Hydra and Ghostblade, he can R>Ghostblade>E>Q>W and the ADC is dead thanks to his insanely high dmg. He can then 1v1 the support. Zed can't do this. That's the thing, Talon rarely makes mistakes. Most time he doesn't even need is R to kill an ADC. Zed presses one button and returns to a short range where he can easily be caught and destroyed thanks to all his escape abilities being on CD.
Hard Penetrator5 votesHe is just bullshitting ppl. Talon can't get perfect CS and keep high mana for all ins against any decent opponent. He was only actual assassin that often went flask just to exchange his HP for cs and playing passive for a few lvls. lvl 1-3 Talon cannot CS and harass not because its impossible but because his early W dmg is pathetic for its mana cost . Talon's waveclear at lvls 1-4 is pretty bad.
Poke is similar, both have pros and cons. I think Zed wins early while Talon wins later. Both are more about all ins than poke (1 good poke means target will potentially die in 5-7secs)
Zed splitpush is worse than Shaco but who cares, shaco playrate is probably 1/20 of Zed's.
4 he is right
5 Both Kha and Rengar are equally good with Hydra/Yommumu as Talon. Heck, with recent Rengar Q buff that increases his total AD by 20% I would say he might be better than Talon.
AdamFrostyBeast1 votesMate. Have you even played Zed? Come on! I have over 500 games (not that much) with him on different accounts so let me dissect your post:
- Best Waveclear: Pls. Talon Takes that crown. Mana cost? Wutt? I've never run oom with Talon in lane and I get near perfect cs thanks to his W.
- Best poke: Again. Talon takes that crown. His poke does more dmg and is harder to dodge but for Zed, just move left or right. Not rocket science.
- Best Splitpush: HAHAHA. Don't make me laugh. Shaco takes down turrets faster than you can type clone.
- Safety: LB is the mother of Safety. Want to gank when her W is down? Nope, her R is up. Want to trade after her Q>W combo? Nope, she's already back to where she started. Zed's only safety is his W which he can't just use without thinking about the consequences.
- Strongest synergy? I haven't seen anyone get better synergy with Hydra and Ghost blade other than Talon. Say otherwise.
- He's in every game because people are trying to learn how to get good at him or how to counter him instead of coming on boards to complain.
You are just bitter because you have probably been losing lanes to Zed and you don't want to put in effort to stop that so you are looking for an easy way (nerf). Sorry mate. That won't happen.
I for one, am overjoyed whenever I see Zed on the enemy team. Pick Fizz or Talon or Malz or even Syndra and he's practically useless. Get Zhonyas/QSS and congratulations, you have successfully removed half his burst. It's not hard. So stop whining.
butt hurt zed main detected down vote this bad boy and his nonsense to oblivion ty <3
AninLegions7771 votesChecked the region: EUNE.
You reside in the cesspit of butt hurt individuals. You are so butt hurt people think you all went to an overcrowded prison. [slayer-pantheon-popcorn]
AdamFrostyBeast1 votesChecked the region: EUNE.
You reside in the cesspit of butt hurt individuals. You are so butt hurt people think you all went to an overcrowded prison. [slayer-pantheon-popcorn]
yeah with the literally butt hurt newcomer being you :) You get it... prison --> butt---> hurt
AninLegions7771 votesMade no sense at all [slayer-jinx-unamused] . Stop disgracing Europe pls [zombie-brand-facepalm] .
GlockHammer5 votesGreat, another fucking must ban in an ever growing horde of cancerous freelo champs that must be banned.
Orangesilk4 votes
Who do I even ban?.
RyzeRework4 votesthe best waveclear of all assassians? cause talons waveclear is better so is ahri and lb and diana wait a second.....
Saianna45 votesHave you ever heard of a thing such as...
#mana?
RyzeRework3 votesHave you ever heard of a thing such as...
#mana?
so manage your mana? if your spaming spells to waveclear on zed your ganna run outta energy?
Taryn18 votesLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
iamthegoatofwar43 voteszed out of energy pick one.
Jeddy01716 votesLet's see: Run out of energy=sit back & wait a few seconds. Run out of mana=have to back to base.
Slack King4 voteshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozcQiHnVFq0 Here is a little bit of pbe ingame bs with it
Very Hard Engage10 votes[{quoted}](name=Slack Attack,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=w1ERrHy0,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2016-02-10T01:41:09.966+0000)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozcQiHnVFq0 Here is a little bit of pbe ingame bs with it
"but its such a high skill cap" -zed main
Voluug132 votesHas 1 (fast and on energy) skillshot and easy farm passive that also doubles as anti-defensive itemization and execute too.
''high skill cap''
Stereo Dreamer1 votesBest waveclear?
Talon, Shaco, and eventually Kat, Ahri, LeBlanc and Rengar have better wavelear unless you build Hydra on Zed and/or use his Shadow and hit with both just to clear.
Ahri. Poke. More spammable too. But Zed is definitely up there if he uses a full combo -- [also leaving him somewhat vulnerable], I'll give it that.
He's a good split, but not among Shaco, Talon or Rengar. Although, why would you split with Rengo anyway unless you were really behind.
Main point though: Preemptive nerfs generally aren't accurate. This nerf is probably for the time being until live numbers and builds see how Zed adds up and what he excels even more in when building this item and if it makes him better at what he already is good in as well as the efficiency of it and the gold worth of the item on him vs others or if this item will even be a core on Zed. Makes nerfing the right things easier.
Ratbert26 votesWhen did shaco have waveclear?
Stereo Dreamer1 votesSince Shiv+Hydra instakills a wave | + Shaco retains safety, can kill a squishy mage or ADC sent to stop him [even if they're close to turret] while also having an ult to take down turrets easier, faster and with a minimal wave of your own.
Voluug1314 votesSince Shiv+Hydra instakills a wave
Those are items. I can buy Shiv and Hydra/Runaan on anyone and call it waveclear.
- Shaco retains safety
No. Shaco is a squishy whose only ranged spell is single target and on mana.
can kill a squishy mage or ADC sent to stop him
Only someone that forgets that Shaco is made of paper. Stabby paper but still paper.
while also having an ult to take down turrets easier, faster and with a minimal wave of your own.
You mean IF the tower is unprotected. Which is unlikely tbh.
NichtHurz2 votesShaco shouldn't be like paper if you want to play him successfully
Voluug135 votesYou listed 2 glass canon, fully offensive items. A Shaco with those items is not the most resilient champion, as Shaco himself is not.
Unless you build him bruiser/tanky (which is a ridiculous lose of time and wasting Shaco's glass canon oriented kit for mediocre damage), even a fed shaco is made of glass. Stabby glass, but still glass.
Voluug1310 votesTalon
Mana
Shaco
lolwut
Kat
Sucks at ranged.
Ahri
not an assassin
LeBlanc
Mana and has to use Ult.
Rengar
Melee.
Zed gets best waveclear because:
Its all AoE. Double Q and E.
On Energy.
Ranged.
His waveclear basically gathers the best of every other assassin's waveclear without the cons.
