Riot only wants you to play about 20 champions to climb. All others are feeder

5050BS·Oct 1, 2018·60 votes·15,508 views

They dont want to balance 150 champs so they pick 20ish and that is all they so anything for.

46 Comments

SuperCosmicHoboOct 1, 201818 votes

Well basically yeah... Some people do tend to play off meta, sometimes quite well. Though even the person is really really good with their non-meta pick. People still scorn the person for going off meta with champs that are not in the current favor. It's like someone choosing Teemo and becoming literally god-like in a rank game. But still blamed for their nexus getting burned down for absolutely no reason.

Pika FoxOct 1, 201815 votes

I hate to break it to you, but literallg every champion in the game is viable to master tier. If someone can climb to master as a one trick support kat, you can play whatever you damn well please.

EvenOct 2, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Pika Fox,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vzOL6ILG,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2018-10-01T15:29:08.902+0000)

I hate to break it to you, but literallg every champion in the game is viable to master tier. If someone can climb to master as a one trick support kat, you can play whatever you damn well please.

who is support kat is master tier

Pika FoxOct 2, 20184 votes

No idea on name, people who play regularly at higher ELOs might know the persons name, but they do exist. No idea if they still play, but literally any champ will get you to master tier if you play well.

Automated RivenOct 2, 20186 votes

^^ completely accurate here. Balance barely applies to lower elos.

SangreDeNocheOct 2, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Pika Fox,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vzOL6ILG,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2018-10-01T15:29:08.902+0000)

I hate to break it to you, but literallg every champion in the game is viable to master tier. If someone can climb to master as a one trick support kat, you can play whatever you damn well please.

That's like saying since one guy can beat dark souls with his rock band drums or whatever that no one has any excuse to have trouble beating the game. The game is known to be challenging for a reason, people beating it does not change it no matter how high they crank up the difficulty for themselves. They are good/experienced, the game does not become easier as a result of their skill. Nothing has changed on the game's part.

LeetriOct 2, 20181 votes

Anyone can beat Dark Souls if they're willing to put some time in. Likewise, anyone's able to climb with any champion if they're willing to put the time in. You pretty regularly see posts on reddit saying things like "I reached Masters by playing just tank teemo jungle AMA", so clearly it doesn't matter if the champion is "viable" or not. Sure, stronger champions require less effort, but you can still climb with anything (except maybe Ryze and Azir). If you can't get out of Silver/Gold/whatever it's not because "Riot only allows certain champions to climb", it's because you're not good enough/haven't played enough games. Most people are around average, and it just happens that silver is average.

Pika FoxOct 2, 20181 votes

Youre comparing apples and oranges, and putting words in my mouth. Im not saying people cant have difficulty, im saying its not because insert favorite champion here isnt balanced or is too weak. The game is balanced extremely well, such that you have literally 0 room to argue about balance until you get to mid diamond, as until then youre physically not good enough for the slight variance in champion strength/usefulness to matter.

I am 12Oct 2, 20181 votes

Didn't someone climb to diamond or masters with support singed?

DuskDaUmbreonOct 1, 201814 votes

List these 20 you seem to think are the only viable ones?

FCJAAAAGOOOOOct 1, 20184 votes

Like does anyone even have to at this point?

saltranOct 2, 20183 votes

That would be too much effort for this shitpost that of course is no the top of the Trash Boards.

usul1202Oct 1, 201811 votes

Which are the 20?

ParoeOct 1, 20183 votes

{quoted}

Which are the 20?

Thats the question, isnt it?

I really wish riot would stop lying and be transparent about who youre supposed to play in ranked until you get actual skill with a non-normal champion.

usul1202Oct 1, 20186 votes

I was asking since I legitimately feel that it's not true. I'm a velkoz main and have found very nice success, even when he was the 3rd lowest playrate supp (above xerath and mf, below sion I believe) and had a below average win rate. As far as I've seen, most champs reach a ~54% win rate or higher when mained.

Yea there's a few dumpster fires, hello azirmains, but I've found that the list of "viable" is pretty large.

I will say that jungle is an exception. A few powerful picks there definitely crowd out the "not op"'s pretty quick.

OHminusOct 2, 20183 votes

jungle is an exception

You right, and that is why I absolutely hate the jungle right now.

Why play my favorites Hecarim when Graves Khazix can outduel, outfarm and outgank me at any level

EvenOct 2, 20186 votes

{quoted}

You right, and that is why I absolutely hate the jungle right now.

Why play my favorites when can outduel, outfarm and outgank me at any level

Hecarim is completely strong right now?

AetherArisingOct 2, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=I NEED YOU,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vzOL6ILG,comment-id=00060000000000000000,timestamp=2018-10-02T02:14:37.491+0000)

Hecarim is completely strong right now?

I will attest to the fact that vi feels like dogshit rn though so hes like half-right Been able to climb out of silver in >50games once i started hard maining kayn and warwick

KhaZix BotOct 2, 20182 votes

Comparing Kha'Zix to Graves is a joke. Graves is so far beyond every other jungler that he has no comparison.

Related, I can't remember the last time that a Vi (who was building to duel) was unable to duel me. No, Vi should not just win the fight without itemizing to do so just because bruisers counter assassins. If Vi builds trinity and isn't behind she steamrolls Kha'Zix in duels.

Also Hecarim is sleeper right now. Kha'Zix's buff brought him from 49% winrate in plat+ to 50%. Complaining about that is completely bandwagoning.

Handy Sandy Oct 1, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Which are the 20?

I thought that was pretty self explanatory. They're talking about op.gg's highest tier/playrate.

usul1202Oct 2, 20186 votes

But on op.gg there's 67 champs with a win rate over 50%. That means if you're completely average (and no one maining a champ should have its avg win rate) you'll climb.

I personally climbed this season with a champ that had a 48% win rate at the time. Unless you play a champ that riots pretty much stated is meant to suck in soloq like azir or ryze then it's not that bad.

94 of leagues 141 champs are within a 2% win rate of 50/50, according to op.gg. Only 5 champs are higher than 53% (at up to 53.59%). Yea shit ain't perfect but that's...... Really not that bad imo. (unless you're a ryze main. 41.98% win rate lul)

XhaidenOct 2, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Which are the 20?

The list is bigger...

Yasuo, Zed, Katarina, Fizz, Lux, Morgana, Jax, Darius, Garen, Yi, MF, Jinx, Jhin, Tristana, Vayne, Lucian, Graves, Irelia, Pyke, Urgot, Teemo, Soraka, Nasus, Tresh, Lee Sin, Kha' Zix, Wukong, Pantheon, Zyra , Tryndamare, Warwick, Quinn, IIIaoi, Braum, Draven, Sion, Ryze, Vladimir, Talon, Ashe, Diana, Kled, Leona, Ezreal, Swain, Annie, Shen, Janna, Vi, Caitlyn, Ekko, Cho'Gath, Malph, Nocturne, Alistair, Nami and so on (rarely seen).

Moon MomOct 1, 201810 votes

Sure. Which is why i've climbed to Diamond 4+ on two accounts playing Diana, who is not one of your magical 20. You can play any champ in any lane almost to challenger.

NaymlissOct 1, 20188 votes

You can play whoever you want to in low silver. Hell, there's a d5 player who plays troll pick jgs exclusively. That's not what's holding you back.

CppLOct 1, 20183 votes

I think he just tired to see same 20 champs over and over and over again...at least i am.

xxx6Wizard9xxxOct 1, 20185 votes

What is ther requirments to be a Rito game balancer? Earning thousands bucks for totally shitwork seems like a fun job

DJNoctisOct 2, 20181 votes

You should work in the food industry. Same principal.

chipndip1Oct 1, 20185 votes

There's a guy that plays with a straw in his mouth and he's apparently Gold 5. Climbing through Silver should be possible for literally anyone.

MasterDCloneOct 1, 20184 votes

Show me a list of 20 viable picks from now, then show me a list of 20 viable picks 6 months ago, and then show me another from 6 months back lets see if it's all the same champions

LTK KoRoOct 1, 20183 votes

Yeah i can't climb too i have played two games with AD ahri top and i lost both of them riot why you're making climbing with off meta stuff impossible, these freaking Zed players have it too easy while truly skillful champions are neglected!!!!! We need to buff Azir, Kalista, Ryze, Shaco, Heimerdinger, Viktor, Amumu and Shyvana asap or game will die!!!!!! I don't understand why these pesky Yasuo or Camille players are getting more lp per win and lose less lp after losing, but this is unfair!!!!! I hate this meta, it's the worst meta ever, remember the AD Ahri top meta in s2? This was a good meta, not this... assassins meta where nearly everything is playable.

DeracadaVenomOct 1, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=LTK KoRo,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vzOL6ILG,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-10-01T11:05:01.590+0000)

Yeah i can't climb too i have played two games with AD ahri top and i lost both of them riot why you're making climbing with off meta stuff impossible, these freaking Zed players have it too easy while truly skillful champions are neglected!!!!! We need to buff Azir, Kalista, Ryze, Shaco, Heimerdinger, Viktor, Amumu and Shyvana asap or game will die!!!!!! I don't understand why these pesky Yasuo or Camille players are getting more lp per win and lose less lp after losing, but this is unfair!!!!! I hate this meta, it's the worst meta ever, remember the AD Ahri top meta in s2? This was a good meta, not this... assassins meta where nearly everything is playable.

Hey, Camille is REALLY hard to play. I hate to sound whiny but... she is

LTK KoRoOct 1, 20183 votes

Im aware of that, Camille is my most played in this season. She isn't REALLY hard to play, but she isn't braindead/easy by any means. I "forgot" to add /s after entirety of the previous post.

RyzeTheSmurfMageOct 1, 20183 votes

Azir Ryze Kalista and Vitkor do need skill tho. And more than the current Zed that instakills as soon as he hits lvl 6 cause of ignite and electrocute.

LTK KoRoOct 1, 20183 votes

Zed takes skill too, but i guess we're still in the narration: "lvl 6 zed kills me only with r+aa+ignite, nerf pls pls pls".

I asked for any video of that. Never got any.

But i have seen the Ryze "fair and balanced" late game: Click

It's funny how he tried to waveclear and killed Lucian without really trying to lol

RyzeTheSmurfMageOct 1, 20181 votes

I saw that clip too. Lucian is a very squishy ADC, Ryze had 1000 AP and was fed. I didn't say Zed kills only with auto ignite r and electrocute but his E and Q are imposible to miss at point blanc range after his R.

LTK KoRoOct 1, 20182 votes

The point is, if someone is fed, then someone can kill people effortlessly. Like this ryze, or fed Zed

Zed is easy to play only if enemy doesn't have any mobility spell OR hard cc which isn't root. His R tells you basically: "i'll be behind you after a second, cc me please". Also flashing after his r (not instantly) makes him usually miss both q and e.

Counterplay against Zed does exist, and his lvl 6 is a big powerspike, which should be respected. If you don't have flash, and Zed have his ignite, then he should be favored.

RyzeTheSmurfMageOct 2, 20181 votes

Most stuns on midlane are skillshots. Zed can use W to dodge them.
Zed instakills in early too. And not just ADCs who are the most squishy. Basically what I'm saying is that if the enemy Zed is good and you are an immobile mage he'll win lane hard in 80% of the cases, and his pickrate is high, so unless you permaban him or play assasins (which some people including me DON'T like playing assasins or Annie cause she has a point and click stun) the game will be anti-fun most of the times.

saltranOct 2, 20181 votes

Yes, Azir-Ryze-Kalista-Viktor need skill I agree there.

But Zed also needs either skill or that your oponent plays like a monkey.

JohnnyNeverSinsOct 1, 20182 votes

True..sad thing is that people also play mostly meta champions in normals as well...I used to play normals because I could play morde or the old aatrox or Yorick..I wanted to play those off meta champions in normal games since you don't lose LP..well guess what,everyone picks garen,akali and Jax even on normals ...so yeah..I also pick something meta since picking one of the above off meta champions is like ounisging my self..for the last couple of days I've been playing reksai,most fun I've had in literally years.

LTK KoRoOct 1, 20187 votes

You still can play off meta stuff in normals, but you're scared of losing to these meta players i guess

Also some people are treating normals as a practice to rankeds, and there's nothing wrong with that, and with picking meta champions in normal. I can have fun with meta champions, and with off-meta champions too.

KadexeOct 2, 20182 votes

There will always be champions better than others. Champions with many favorable matchups, champions that are the best at what their class does, etc. As it stands though, the gap between the best and worst champions isn't actually that large. You can play pretty much anything in soloqueue.

ZedexOct 2, 20181 votes

Implying your skill level equals that of pro players where the apparently "viable" champions dominate?

XeronicOct 2, 20181 votes

I’m an ekko main and i’m climbing fine.

HÔPÊOct 2, 20181 votes

Yeah. It sucks. Playing off-meta is trolling now.

OznapOct 2, 20181 votes

Champions having overlapping gameplay/gamestyles is going to lead to a limited pool in general. The diverse roster in reality is pretty limited if you really look at it. Name a champion that has a dash, cc, a shield, and a aoe ability. You can prob name around 20 or so champions with ease that fill this criteria because it was a meme back then for new champions being pumped out during the time.

The meta generally revolves around who has the better stats because the lines of uniqueness is generally blurred into just numbers at the end of the day.

rayzoOct 3, 20181 votes

Any of these champs are viable in their current state: Aatrox Ahri Akali Alistar Annie AurelionSol Blitzcrank Braum Camille Chogath Darius DrMundo Draven Ekko Ezreal Fiora Fizz Gangplank Garen Gnar Graves Hecarim Heimerdinger Illaoi Irelia Jax Jhin Jinx Kaisa Kassadin Katarina Khazix Kindred Kled Leblanc LeeSin Leona Lucian Lulu Lux Malphite MasterYi MissFortune Morgana Nami Nasus Nocturne Nunu Olaf Orianna Poppy Pyke Rakan Rammus Renekton Rengar Riven Rumble Shen Singed Sion Sivir Sona Soraka Swain Taliyah Talon Taric Teemo Thresh Trundle Tryndamere TwistedFate Twitch Udyr Urgot Varus Vayne Veigar Velkoz Vladimir Warwick Xayah XinZhao Yasuo Yorick Zed Ziggs Zilean Zoe Zyra