You know what we should add to Thornmail?

Burnt Light·Sep 14, 2015·206 votes·7,134 views

Grievous Wound.

EDIT: Grievous Wounds.

143 Comments

CaythelesSep 14, 201594 votes

We should make it deal % health True dmg.!!!

LegacyDAPSep 14, 20156 votes

Would be a good taste of their own medicine for all the fucking champs who have it though.

FloooooooooooopsSep 14, 201575 votes

Dude that's dumb... % maximum health true damage!!!

CaythelesSep 14, 201533 votes

Fucking Brilliant. I bow to thee

Ace Access Sep 14, 20156 votes

% maximum health + ( 8% of bonus HP) as TRUE DAMAGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1111

VerxintSep 14, 201512 votes

Obviously it should do 50 + (50% of armor) + (5% of their max HP) + (10% of their bonus HP) + (20% of their total AD) as true damage.

Then it can be healthy like Vayne! There's counterplay, just don't attack the Thornmail!

Skia AsteriSep 14, 201544 votes

I had rather just prevent lifestealling off the wearer.

Irelia BotSep 14, 20157 votes

[{quoted}](name=Skia Asteri,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vwolEtxi,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2015-09-14T02:45:33.700+0000)

I had rather just prevent lifestealling off the wearer.

that would actaully be really good. although might be almost too good. ANd how would it effect the active of BotRK?

BârdSep 14, 201536 votes

That is a damaging spell with a heal attached. It has nothing to do with lifesteal.

IcyPepperSep 14, 20153 votes

Dat downvote despite it being true :P

Just a quick look at its tooltip proves it too. If it counts as lifesteal, it's not being clear about it.

+1 because fact checks

LankPantsSep 14, 20151 votes

I don't know about that, outside of a few special cases ( DrMundo Vladimir Swain ) who can most likely avoid attacking targets with thornmail preventing lifesteal is considerably stronger than Grievous Wounds.

Ariel the CruelSep 14, 20153 votes

Riot is removing Grievous wounds because of how damning it is to healing in general. So why not just have the 50% heal reduction on life steal (ala grievous wounds) rather than removing it out-right?

WiegrafOfValorSep 14, 201511 votes

Your point doesn't make sense, since this kind of champions doesn't rely on AA

TenSlashTenSep 14, 201512 votes

bullshit. It needs true damage and percentage max hp. And a shield. And it needs to multiple all damage delt for a certain time everytime you take a crit.

KrinuSep 14, 201511 votes

Thornmail (Active): For (1 + armor / 100) seconds, on-hit effects do not trigger on you.

5000000000000000Sep 14, 201510 votes

That hard counters a lot of champions. As much as I hate Vayne, I don't think it's a good idea.

360D3GR3SSSep 14, 20158 votes

you need A LOT of armor for it to be useful

5000000000000000Sep 14, 20157 votes

I meant his proposed active. Even by itself, that's 1 second, and with base stats and one other armor item, that can easily become 2 seconds. That's basically 2 seconds of blind.

360D3GR3SSSep 14, 20153 votes

wat, he means things like redbuff and Yi's true damage per hit and stuff would not be applied however you are still damaged from auto attacks. Nothing like blind, its actually a weaker mechanic than blind.

KrinuSep 14, 20156 votes

Yeah, it would do nothing to the autoattack itself. If Vayne shoots you, Vayne shoots you, you take damage, etc. However, you wouldn't get Silver Bolt stacks, Blade of the Ruined King wouldn't proc, and if there's a Nami on the enemy team, Tidecaller's Blessing wouldn't be consumed.

Honestly, while it'd be decent against Vayne, it'd be far more powerful against champions like Kayle, Yi, and Shyvana.

Starcall CaseySep 14, 20154 votes

What is this? Dota2?

BeatzBoyFTWSep 14, 201511 votes

_Enemy team picks Vayne _

Malphite item 3075 : http://media.giphy.com/media/xIdqsZ5rmVifu/giphy.gif Shen item 3068 item 3143 : http://strengthbodybuilding.com/images/why_wait.jpg

Ariel the CruelSep 14, 201519 votes

Rammus OK.

Call A DrSep 14, 201511 votes

I think Thronmail should have also reflect true damage.

Taric the GaySep 14, 20158 votes

[{quoted}](name=Burnt Light,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vwolEtxi,comment-id=,timestamp=2015-09-14T02:36:31.693+0000)

You know what we should add to Thornmail?

Gems?

Wînter FoxSep 15, 20153 votes

Ruby for Vigor

Taric the GaySep 15, 20153 votes

{quoted}

Ruby for Vigor

Opal for harmony.

Snake TownSep 15, 20152 votes

Someone please nerf this man's name, too op.

KikirinoSep 14, 20155 votes

Are you fucking serious? I made this exact thread yesterday and it got downvoted...

Lazypeon100Sep 14, 20152 votes

{quoted}

Are you fucking serious? I made this exact thread yesterday and it got downvoted...

I feel bad, but I just laughed at that man. The hypocracy of the forums strikes once more!

I didn't see your thread yesterday, though to be fair, I don't really agree with grivious wounds as the solution.

WiegrafOfValorSep 14, 20152 votes

I've being saying Thorn should GW the attacker for a year..

I feel you bro..

Dragonlord7137Sep 14, 20154 votes

I love it but you forgot your s.

Silents429Sep 14, 20153 votes

That.

Actually could work.

RyzeReworkSep 14, 20153 votes

And then enemy plays vayne and you're dead anyway

ChillenSep 14, 20153 votes

You shouldn't automatically lose to someone just because they built thornmail and you're an auto attacking champion. Adding grievous wounds to it will make it so you can't even fight those targets, its already bad enough as it is. Most of the time you take out 80% of your health just trying to kill targets with thornmail if you don't have double lifesteal. Only silver and bronze players think things like that are good. I'm not even going to check but I know you're one of them just by your request.

PerishSoftlySep 14, 20154 votes

On the converse, you shouldn't lose to someone simply because you're a tank and they built Bloodthirster. Or BotRK. Or Last Whisper.

Sounds kinda silly doesn't it? Counter-itemization is there for a reason.

hgjkdlsaf jeldvbSep 14, 20155 votes

Thornmail is the only item that actually lets a tank properly threaten an adc. If someone has a thornmail, you don't focus them until your team has mopped up enough of the enemy that they can help you. Thornmail will give the take an easy 1v1 against the ADC, but it will not win Xv1s.

If you're talking about shit being unfair, play a tank into vayne and then tell me about unfair.

SoMNiaSep 14, 20151 votes

A tank is NOT SUPPOSED TO threaten an ADC. Not alone. Their job is to disrupt the ADC's efforts to kill the rest of their team, not to 1v1 them and kill them. Vayne beating tanks is not unfair. It's the way the game is designed. If you want to be a Big Damn Hero and take down their carry, play an assassin.

Auz the RipperSep 14, 20152 votes

There are several tanks who's main job is to threaten the ADC, with champions like DrMundo Shyvana and Volibear it's the only way they have to draw aggro to themselves

hgjkdlsaf jeldvbSep 14, 20155 votes

Tanks absolutely have to threated carries, otherwise carries can just ignore them. It doesn't have to be through damage, but a carry should neither be able to ignore, nor melt a tank.

I understand that vayne was "designed" to shred tanks and kill squishies and pretty much everything. Her design is garbage. Just because it's in the game doesn't mean it's good, and the standards that riot adheres to change with the wind.

Rand0mH3r0XSep 14, 20152 votes

That would be amazing. There doesn't exist an AD item that has that currently. 50% healing turns Vayne's standard 30% lifesteal into 15%, and then Thornmail can actually negate Lifesteal all together!

StephenizgodSep 14, 20152 votes

Would be a good idea indeed, couple this with a item 3143 and a tank might actually be able to survive against ADC's... maybe

OrangesilkSep 14, 20152 votes

While I do believe tank itemization needs to be looked at, ADCs ARE supposed to kill tanks, because if not them then who? Burst mages? Assassins? Bruisers?.

StephenizgodSep 14, 20151 votes

ADC's are suppose to take down turrets and inhibitors not melt a tank in 3-4 shots :\

Lazypeon100Sep 14, 20151 votes

Actually, they kinda are supposed to kill tanks. Tanks want to disrupt the adc and their team, wile the adc wants to kill anyone they can safely. The ADC is going to kill the tank the fastest usually just because of how they dish out their damage versus other roles.

StephenizgodSep 14, 20153 votes

Yes ADC's do kill Tanks, but i believe their original Role was to take down Obectives the fastest, it just so happens that AD>Armor/Health so ADC's also take down Tanks the fastest (specially since nerf to several armor items)

Lazypeon100Sep 14, 20153 votes

Fair enough