Can we have a Zhonya's for ADC's?

LegacyDAP··2 votes·1,387 views

I think that would be a great addition in the marksmen update.

This would be some sort of Attack Speed + 2.5 second invulnerability + 90-120 second cooldown sort of thing (whatever zhonya's is), it needs to set you off your main build path, and it can't be viable on everything, and make it a unique passive with zhonya's so champions like Diana can't have 5 seconds invulernability.

17 Comments

Jetridder113 votes

ADC's have qss. That's the difference. Mages do not.

Mister Mackey2 votes

Bard ?

LegacyDAP1 votes

I mean yes kind of, but you can't have it every game. Plus most Bards are just terrible.

LegacyDAP1 votes

Right, because when ADC's get caught out they should die, but when Leblanc Ahri Annie and other mages get caught it's fine.

Crett1 votes

Do you really want to give Ezreal and Corki and Caitlyn a Zhonya's

Solo Josh1 votes

[deleted]

LegacyDAP1 votes

Nearly every mage takes Zhonya's don't even say that only some mages use it, because that's not even remotely true, nearly every mage and assassin takes it, because it provides invulnerability.

IgsabBTGk01 votes

{quoted}

Nearly every mage takes Zhonya's don't even say that only some mages use it, because that's not even remotely true, nearly every mage and assassin takes it, because it provides invulnerability.

That's not really proof that Zhonya's is a great item as much as it is proof that mages are in a terrible position atm.

SorryBoysImLes1 votes

{quoted}

There are some mages designed for close quarters combat, like Kennen, Morgana, Karthus, and Swain. Zhonyas is there so they can have their playstyle and not feel like they are being punished for it. When you play an ADC, you're pretty much a back lines guy trying to snipe people down and stay out of the mix. I can't think of any bottom lane marksmen that thrive in close combat.

Mordekaiser

DrCyanide1 votes

The AD Equivalent of item 3157 is item 3139

  • Both give maximum offensive stats in their tech tree
  • Both give defensive stats against the opposite tech tree
  • Both have an active for getting out of troublesome situations

If you make an AD Zhonyas, then there needs to be an AP QSS-based item.

LegacyDAP1 votes

That's fine with me. Mercurial scimitar is garbage is stops 1 CC or debuff and then you get killed again.

67chrome1 votes

I think that would be a great addition in the marksmen update.

Ehh

Giving the same unique passive to everyone runs into issue where build paths stop mattering and defining champions as much, and everyone becomes an amalgamation of unrelated stats that have no clear strength, weakness, or identity.

With keeping things like Life Steal only viable on auto-attackers and Stasis only available to AP you create a distinct feel for each build path. With AD you have life steal to sustain long enough to deal sustained damage as a defining play-style feature, where with AP you have a burst of defense between bursts as a defining play-style feature.

This is further reinforced within build paths where certain stats are only tied to a specific partner stat - such as MR and HP/5, life steal and AD, armor penetration and AD, and so forth. This creates defining choices where armor-heavy builds don't get a high level of HP/5 and life-steal heavy builds don't get much in the way of armor penetration, leading to a lot of decision points with A OR B.

Specifically limiting Stasis to AP itemization alone enforces certain weaknesses on various champion archetypes, it crease a clear OR point which is vital for choice to matter - which it really should in a game with 100+ item choices that aren't simply set up in a tiered format of Iron armor, Steel armor, Mithril armor, etc.


Making an AD zhonya's item runs into a major issue where you cause itemization to be more of a muddled brown rather than a clear red, yellow, green, blue, black, white kind of dynamic.

Chuck Charles1 votes

nothing stopping you from building zhonyas on an ADC as a defensive item. its usually a terrible idea, but situationally I've built it on an adc and its saved my ass. Against rengar for example it is not a bad idea. A champion like Ashe, Ezreal, or any of the ADCs with decent ap ratios (tristana even) can make use of it even if its not ideal as a defensive item. If you need stasis for that game you can build it. but generally as an adc if you need stasis its because something is able to catch you completely off guard like Rengar, twitch, shaco, evelyn, etc. or you need to zhonyas a veigar ult, syndra ult, etc.

While its not because marksman "dont need stasis" like some have said in this thread. marksman like any carry need items that help them peel for themselves. I feel the reason mages get it and marskman don't is because a lot of mages have to position themselves in the middle of a team fight and this is there one way of helping their all in. Katarina, twisted fate, diana, etc. all go balls deep and the zhonyas helps their team follow up their engage while the enemy team cannot focus them.

Marksman on the other hand prefer to position themsleves as safely as possible and should almost never jump in unless on an organized team and they KNOW they are going to get peel/shields/heals/etc. Because marksman aren't encouraged to dive in, they don't really need stasis as badlly. Like I said, if you NEED it, you can situationally still build it and it isn't the worst buy.

A lot of people want all marksman defensive items to have offensive capabilities to fit their identity. item 3156 item 3139 item 3072 but situationally regular defensive items are well...a good idea. keep in mind your defensive item even the ones who provide offensive stats are only bought to keep you alive. If you were only building for more offense you would just build a second item 3031 or item 3508 . But you usually need a defensive item to stay alive. And people forget you can buy item 3102 item 3026 and yes even item 3157

Mecha MaIphite1 votes

they already do

it just comes in the form of a bunch of fat tanks that bodyblock everything you try to do

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