Boards›Gameplay

Riots take on Autofill, however, they are tackling it from the wrong angle.

awdaf··13 votes·1,847 views

http://imgur.com/Zl5Y6yf

The issue isn't that people are troll picking when they are autofilled, the issue is that, that person doesn't feel comfortable at all on that role. In the scenarios I have had with champ select that someone was very angry that they got autofilled, they didn't troll pick, they just wished the could switch with someone or cry out that they are terrible at the position that they got filled in.

Imagine this, a person Queues up for ADC and Mid lane, they get Autofilled to Jungler. They barely play Jungle. Now on the other side of the Queue, the opposing team has someone who is a Jungle main, and is pretty experienced at what they are doing.

End result? It's obvious.

The more experienced Jungle will out class that Autofilled person. Why?

The more experienced Jungler will know timings better, better predicts when the Autofilled person is going to be at a certain camp as they are more likely to run a standard route to play it safe, they are better at smiting (Securing objectives), they are better at counter banking through certain bushes and more effective at map pressure overall.

This goes for every other role when you are Autofilled and the opposing team has a person who mains that role.

All this does is create a disadvantage for one team, when in fact the game is suppose to be as close to 50/50 as possible in terms of skill and rank, not RNG that you're not going to get one of the positions you are good at.

I do however agree with Riot, champion select trolls are a pain and need to be dealt with, however, the overall picture of someone getting stuck on to a roll that they are not comfortable is a much more dire issue.

64 Comments

The Deckowner9 votes

The real issue is the system misplacing support players in non-support role and focing others to be autofilled into support.

Xonra2 votes

Just today I queued up as Support/Top as I saw "autofill activated" and went, "might as well just put support and be done with it".

I was autofilled into mid. Person who wanted mid was autofilled support, and a second person had also put mid and was autofilled jungle. So two people wanted mid "primary" I primary wanted support, and it put THEM support, and ME mid.

Autofill feels pointless more often than not to me.

Omen462 votes

dang... here I happened to like auto-fill, but those points are very obvious and very important. I flounder in the jungle, even with practice I fail. The lanes are far more comfortable to me, I do prefer support and top but will play adc and mid. Amazing clarification. I hope maybe some change will be done to prevent those circumstances. I also feel EVERYONE should learn to play support properly to assist in team fighting better.

slôw2 votes

{quoted}

dang... here I happened to like auto-fill, but those points are very obvious and very important. I flounder in the jungle, even with practice I fail. The lanes are far more comfortable to me, I do prefer support and top but will play adc and mid. Amazing clarification. I hope maybe some change will be done to prevent those circumstances. I also feel EVERYONE should learn to play support properly to assist in team fighting better.

all the more reason to get rid of role picking, that way you have a much higher possiblity of getting an off role instead of mid for 20 games in a row then support

Then, queue times go from 3:40 for me down to about 1 minute and 20 seconds, players will start learning the game as a whole again, macro will improve, toxicity goes down from removing auto-fill. Literally every change to the system they made last season was negative. Revert ALL of it.

It worked perfectly fine before. You got in a row of 5, players arranged by mmr (they shouldn't of ever taken that out. Tired of d5's taking my fucking lane from me then getting shit on) Then the players who want their roles and also have the highest MMR get their role, helping the matchmaking system give better matches. If a player cannot play a role 95% of the time people will take it up for them.

HeeroTX3 votes

{quoted}

toxicity goes down from removing auto-fill

I realize you're saying toxicity will drop from removing autofill, but you also mentioned queue times and with your other thoughts I just have to say that at this point if you remove role select and expect toxicity to DECLINE then you are crazy.

slôw1 votes

sorry I don't know how low mmr works, but higher mmr It was rare to see someone freak out because they didn't get their main role. Especially since they had actually played all the roles already in the last 30 games. Now if pretty much anyone gets autofilled someone is raging the moment the queue pops and no one gives them their role.

If they want to keep their system they shouldmake people pick a 3rd role and get rid of autofill. Knowing at least 3 roles semi-okay should be a requirement to rank up consistently.

For players who don't know, at diamond 3-2, theres a wall that exists that the game lliterally becomes who's team autofilled and who's team got their main role and champion. The skill level at that point becomes so overwhelming that an autofilled jungler, top, adc, mid, support etc. ALL will instantly lose the game for you if the other team has atleast 1-2 mains on their shit. Especially in korea I found this to be so true it was incredibly frustrating to play against. The only way you could really get past the wall was to either learn support or hit fill or play 250 games.

In korea, no one gives the autofilled their role except maybe 1 time out of 100. It is very rare because all of them want to show how special they are and carry the game. You also know that the korean early game will result in that autofilled player being 0 5 at 8 minutes and the jungler will completely stomp them just from looking at their op.gg

After the game is 0 10 and 2 botlane towers are down, everyone opens. Every game at diamond 3-2 50lp for you.

The Yetii Rider2 votes

{quoted}

sorry I don't know how low mmr works, but higher mmr It was rare to see someone freak out because they didn't get their main role. Especially since they had actually played all the roles already in the last 30 games. Now if pretty much anyone gets autofilled someone is raging the moment the queue pops and no one gives them their role.

If they want to keep their system they shouldmake people pick a 3rd role and get rid of autofill. Knowing at least 3 roles semi-okay should be a requirement to rank up consistently.

For players who don't know, at diamond 3-2, theres a wall that exists that the game lliterally becomes who's team autofilled and who's team got their main role and champion. The skill level at that point becomes so overwhelming that an autofilled jungler, top, adc, mid, support etc. ALL will instantly lose the game for you if the other team has atleast 1-2 mains on their shit. Especially in korea I found this to be so true it was incredibly frustrating to play against. The only way you could really get past the wall was to either learn support or hit fill or play 250 games.

In korea, no one gives the autofilled their role except maybe 1 time out of 100. It is very rare because all of them want to show how special they are and carry the game. You also know that the korean early game will result in that autofilled player being 0 5 at 8 minutes and the jungler will completely stomp them just from looking at their op.gg

After the game is 0 10 and 2 botlane towers are down, everyone opens. Every game at diamond 3-2 50lp for you.

And? The change to auto fill was for Diamond players' queue times. You are the main beneficiaries of it, while down in the lower ranks we autofill just to drop maybe 30 seconds off our times.

cyberbullied1 votes

tbh i think if riot just made an indicator for players that were filled, it would do far more to enhance everyone's experience since teams could work to accommodate people

Aptest1 votes

he is not crazy. he just has a good enough memory of how things really were.

HeeroTX1 votes

{quoted}

he is not crazy. he just has a good enough memory of how things really were.

Of ALL the changes Riot has made since Season 5, Role Select is PROBABLY the most popular. I'm saying if you yank that one a LOT of people are gonna rage. You can talk all you want about how games might (doubtful, but ok) have been less toxic before Role Select but it doesn't change the fact that it will make people go ballistic if its removed. Heck, a lot of people are still mad about Team Builder being gone, and that was BEFORE Role Select went in.

Aptest1 votes

the point is this:

people wanted to play mid. the "mid" players wanted some way to assure them the mid role. but overall they dealt with not getting it in a mature fashion in game.

ofc there were a bunch of "i can't support" guys. and a bunch of clarity/revive shacos. and a bunch of "me mid or troll" guys (see revive/clarity shaco)

but they were a minority

HeeroTX1 votes

I'm a low elo ADC main, the number of people I get in support that are absolutely uncarryable garbage (or "feed/troll") is actually pretty low. (maybe it's because I usually Go: "1.Bot, 2.Support") Frankly, if this is a problem in HIGH elo (I'm not there) then I don't see how REMOVING role select fixes it. You've basically got some percentage of people in high elo that can't/won't play X role and (apparently) a team that won't trade with them. How is that ANY different for "I got autofilled" vs. "I got last pick"? If you are autofilled ANYTHING less than 20% of the time, then mathematically you're getting a preferred role more often with role select than with pick order. If you're autofilled 1 out of ten games, then you should be getting one of your selections 9/10 games. If you're going pick order, you should be getting last pick about 1 out of 5 games.

(ie. if not getting your role makes a player toxic, then 1/5 games (on average) at LEAST 1 pick order player is toxic, heck its even worse if 3/5 players wanted mid or something)

Aptest1 votes

in a "no role select" world, trading happens a LOT more. "youre fifth pick, we don't believe you, play sup" only happens once every 3-4 games.

HeeroTX1 votes

Here's how amazingly, beautifully non-toxic people were before Role Select (video from Apr 2014): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5UfO7qOHx5M

Aptest1 votes

this guy in the video, IMHO, does not get it.

not saying there was no toxicity. but there was definitely not "more" toxicity.

LostFr0st1 votes

I did enjoy that the old system actually encouraged conversation between teammates instead of the current rigid champ select where everyone auto-assumes they are the only one that got their second pick or autofilled.

ZephyrDrake3 votes

{quoted}

I did enjoy that the old system actually encouraged conversation between teammates instead of the current rigid champ select where everyone auto-assumes they are the only one that got their second pick or autofilled.

if by conversation you mean "can i be X?" "lol no you are 5th pick and i am 1st so screw you" then yes, it did encouraged a lot of conversation

LostFr0st1 votes

5th pick was built-in autofill where you had to make a case to your team as the lowest mmr player that your op.gg could vouch for your requested position. It wasn't uncommon at all for people with a good case to actually get their role.

ZephyrDrake2 votes

{quoted}

5th pick was built-in autofill where you had to make a case to your team as the lowest mmr player that your op.gg could vouch for your requested position. It wasn't uncommon at all for people with a good case to actually get their role.

"good case", sorry but that actually happened just as often as those who get autofilled ask for anotehr role and they actually get it. Whoever was in first pick would just pretty much say "screw you i am first pick" and pick whatever the hell they wanted. It doesn't matter if you were 5th, or 4th or even 2nd pick. They were first and they would pick whatever it is that they wanted and the same goes down the line. 2nd pick will pick whatever it was that they wanted not giving a single damn about the rest and so on and so on until you were 5th and had to pick whatever it was left unless 4th was unlucky enough to be stuck with the two positions that he hated the most in which case he just didn't care

LostFr0st1 votes

I was there just like you were. Usually 2nd 3rd or 4th pick would indeed bend. The difference was that the 5th pick didn't have "autofill lul I suck at sup" as an excuse. Everyone knew if they got 5th pick they were most likely support. Unlucky. So they either had a champ ready, dodged, or trolled same as today.

Xonra1 votes

I rarely saw people bend cause that guy that got 2nd/3rd this game was likely the guy who got the short end last game, and wasn't about to trade finally getting his role just to play support again.

I see people try to talk about how much better it was, but I think that is some nostalgia clouded memory or something.

LostFr0st1 votes

The thing that was for sure better was that people would type their prefs in champ select. That I'm 100% sure of. We'd then know if more than two people were in their secondary position and people would often swap to get more people onto their main roles.

Aptest1 votes

1

autofill lul I suck at sup

5th pick can't support was fairly common in my memory.

2

2nd 3rd 4th and 1st pick swapping roles with 5th was also fairly common

3

there were a bunch of support secondary players and quite often support was chosen by 3rd,4th pick. Especially in season 3 when ADCs were food.

4

toxicity was overall way down.

LostFr0st1 votes

yes to 1, 2, and 3. 4....not so much. They were still just as toxic. I specifically remember the feral flare junglers typing something very 'stern' into champ select as they locked in, but there were other things.

HeeroTX1 votes

{quoted}

2nd 3rd 4th and 1st pick swapping roles with 5th was also fairly common

toxicity was overall way down.

MAYBE in high elo... MAYBE. I still find that hard to believe though considering even now you get a bunch of people who are FINE with their role that won't even pick a different CHAMPION when people ask such. ie. "We need a tank" "Screw you"

chipndip11 votes

So we're just fucking lying now?

Aptest1 votes

just telling it like it is, same as always, but your cheerful remarks have been noted. thanks for the fish and come again any time.

chipndip11 votes

Toxicity in champ select was a huge factor in why we have our current system. Also, last pick was usually fucked. That's why Trinnimmortal even got popularity on YT to begin with by making a series dedicated to sarcastically suggesting champs for people that get stuck with last pick...because you'd usually be fucked.

Xonra1 votes

For the last like 2 years ofm the old system, your mmr had nothing to do with your placement in champ select, it was random.

Xonra1 votes

I found people talking just as little in the old system.

Most people usually just said their position, and whoever was first pick rarely talked and just locked in despite any talking in chat.

It wasn't any better than it is now by any means.

Most conversation I saw usually was arguing, and not actual conversation.

Blakiepug1 votes

{quoted}

I did enjoy that the old system actually encouraged conversation between teammates instead of the current rigid champ select where everyone auto-assumes they are the only one that got their second pick or autofilled.

Old system didn't always encourage positive conversation though. I got last pick 80% of the team and my team always forced me to play support even though I told them I was not good at it. Players are a lot more negotiable with the new system.

LostFr0st1 votes

My biggest problem is we can't see their secondaries right now, because people don't type their prefs. They just assume their role like automatons. I don't think negotiability has overall changed, but the assumption of no negotiation has. If two people knew that they got each others' primary, they would of course offer to swap, but they stay quiet right now and assume the other one got his primary.

Xonra1 votes

It didn't work fine before just FYI. Whoever was last pick was the equivalent of being autofilled.

slôw2 votes

Just for fucks sake stop the role pick bullshit. Go back to how it was where you had the possibility of getting every role so people didn't neglect a role for 80 games to finally get it and get shit on.

All this new system does is get you a role you would probably normally get all the time anyway, cept now you can randomly get a role you haven't played for a month. Before, you could say "not junngle pref" and people would take it for you, now they just use the role system as a way to put it on you and they lose the game from it.

ChargeItDownMid2 votes

[deleted]

slôw1 votes

You cannot have role select without autofill. The two are needed together.

I would also like to be able to buy stuff without tax, but tax is required for those purchases.

Therefore, role select AND autofill taken out entirely is still a net positive.

You could also allow a 3rd role to be selected and that would alleviate the problem a ton.

KVbqbFsC8e2 votes

The issue would be easily solved if Riot removed Flex que.

Lauchmelder1 votes

That sad excuse doesn't work any more. I'd rather stay unranked than go and support a team of randoms.

The reason I quit supporting in SoloQ was because of monkeys constantly getting my support until they were fed just to play TDM instead of winning games.

Xonra1 votes

Flex queue is garbage as it is, and it is doing nothing but dividing the ranked players like they said they didn't want to do.

When you have people in all sorts of divisions still against each other, STILL, it is obviously a failure. It also has like, half or less of the amount of players solo has. It is pointless, and I wish people that wanted to buddy queue would stick to normals, but at least I don't have to deal with them this season.

Lauchmelder1 votes

I see it in a different way: People that hate FlexQ by heart are bad teamplayers.

Quepha1 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Big Piece,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vjYZoLXb,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2017-02-02T23:27:27.853+0000)

The issue would be easily solved if Riot removed Flex que.

I think you mean remove solo/duo queue so we'd basically be back in dynamic queue of last season.

Twitch Chat2 votes

camille is actually gg tho

Xonra1 votes

When even in pro play she is 100% pick ban (she has gotten through I think less than 5 times in all major regions, and has been played when she was let through).

Smeb's number 1 way to "win solo queue", not as a joke was "Ban Camille, she is op".

MariusfPresident2 votes

Autofill was supposed to shorten qeue times, but the actual time it takes you to get in a game, is higher, because most of the times you have several dodges, in both game modes, ranked and normal

Xonra2 votes

I can queue for three games and have at least 6-7 dodges between those games. It is pretty dumb.

Had a game today where I had 6 dodges to the point I kept getting in lobby with the same one person and we were just laughing about it and counting it in chat every time we would come back.

It has gotten dumb, and Riot seems to refuse to see how toxic autofill has become.

Tychusfindlay9192 votes

Camille is legit gg, fuck riot for being so incompetent as to release her the way they did, and wait five years to throw some VERY OBVIOUS nerfs that were necessary.

Oh right, they had bigger plans, like nerfing darius.

Lexyy1 votes

"the issue is that, that person doesn't feel comfortable at all on that role. "

And you know how they can get more comfortable? By playing that exact role.

Also, switching roles between players is still a thing. :)

Xonra1 votes

No, they are going to feed, get flamed, and be less likely to want to play it in the future.

How is being forced onto a role you can't play IN RANKED, where people are already toxic for you missing a skillshot, let alone dying, helpful?

You aren't going to learn, because you will likely be on tilt from the flaming, feel bad for doing badly, and again, you aren't going to hop back into the role to learn it, because if you did you would have already.

Most times, people also don't switch, especially if you have support/jungle. It takes a special breed to main jungle and the same with support, and if those people had to be forced into the role, chances are no one else on your team wanted to.

If it was top/mid/adc that is one thing, but I have yet to have anyone switch with me getting put jungle or support one single time. Usually they just say something shitty, laugh, or no one at all talks in champ select.

Lexyy2 votes

If they're SMART, they'll start practicing all roles in normal - just in case they get autofilled.

I simply can't imagine only playing one/two roles and not knowing at least two champions for every role.

And I always switch, even if it's support and jungle. It's just for the sake of winning. :) Players complicate stuff and then cry on boards. It's freaking annoying.

Don't you see that the real problem here is the community? Players don't know how to play every role, they flame and insult others, players don't want to switch and only care about themselves. Players are brats who think playing two roles is enough for this game. Players are the issue, not the freaking autofill.

More from Gameplay

3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay764 comments
7,167
votes
3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay156 comments
3,510
votes
UPVOTE FOR URF
Gameplay606 comments
2,440
votes
Yes plz.
Gameplay456 comments
1,721
votes
3 Refunds per season, up vote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay114 comments
1,716
votes
When is ANYONE at riot going to address the awful new player experience?
Gameplay634 comments
1,383
votes

More by awdaf

Am I the only one who thinks the range you need to break Leblancs chain is way to far?
Gameplay264 comments
276
votes
Please give us an option to vote to disband lobby so we don't have to dodge.
Gameplay178 comments
225
votes
Solo Q badges are actually exactly what we need, here is why
Gameplay127 comments
221
votes
I just lost a game because a wasp flew on my head, and it was mid team fight
Memes & Games67 comments
215
votes
3 Years and this has not changed, come on Riot.
Gameplay84 comments
183
votes
Can we have a spot on the client dashboard to show our Ping before we get into a game?
Gameplay46 comments
168
votes