Losing bottom turret at 8 minutes should not result in the game snowballing out of control

Yenn·Aug 11, 2017·13 votes·477 views

When the fuck is this being fixed? We've been complaining about this since the season started, and there still hasn't been anything done to mitigate the insane advantage taking bottom tower provides.

The tower gold, kill gold from the clusterfuck that you obviously won because you took the tower, denial of enemy jungle control, and the fact that middle tower is all but guaranteed to go down next as the enemy team can't defend against your advantage + 3/4-man mid, is too much.

It's retarded that such a huge portion of the outcome is decided as soon as one team hits level 6.

14 Comments

YennAug 11, 20172 votes

I have a stalemate at top.

My mid lane gets slightly ahead, hits 6 early, and a four-man clusterfuck at bottom happens, with my team winning due to the level 6 advantage. Bottom tower goes down, enemy team loses control of their jungle, and their mid tower goes down shortly after because they can't defend against our advantage.

My lane opponent goes to help his team, but can't do shit because my team mates are too fed. Meanwhile, I haven't even left the lane, nor have I had a single opportunity to use teleport.

Both myself and the other top laner had zero opportunity to impact the game. This is really fucking stupid and not fun.

JackMcSnipeyzAug 11, 20171 votes

Why didnt you TP to help the fight before tower was lost? If you take TP and dont use it, might aswell take ignite and snowball your land to create pressure.

YennAug 11, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Why didnt you TP to help the fight before tower was lost? If you take TP and dont use it, might aswell take ignite and snowball your land to create pressure.

Try working on your reading comprehension, my team won that game.

JackMcSnipeyzAug 11, 20171 votes

In that case why didnt your enemy tp bot? You are nitpicking when the little details dont matter, you can have impact on the game and first turret lost can be contained if you dont keep throwing.

KloqdqAug 11, 20172 votes

Not always possible to get off TP. Sometimes you just don't get to use that TP or it is wasted. The fact alone that you need to have TP to impact top is a sign of poor power balance on the map.

YennAug 11, 20171 votes

{quoted}

In that case why didnt your enemy tp bot? You are nitpicking when the little details dont matter, you can have impact on the game and first turret lost can be contained if you dont keep throwing.

I would have TP'd with them and they still would have lost, but in reality, I probably wouldn't have even needed to because my team's early game was stronger.

You're 100% wrong.

RainXBladeAug 12, 20171 votes

For me, I think there are two reasons for this unhealthy power shift; being:

Bot is very, very easy to dive on since unless the support is tanky enough and can peel for the ADC, they're usually both dead since it's a 2v4.
Dragon is located along bot side, so it's more accessible as soon as first blood tower is taken.

For me, I think a good solution to this is to actually reduce the first blood tower gold gained if a bot or mid lane tower is taken. Right now, first blood tower grants along 500g to the team that got it IIRC. I think we can reduce that to a measly 50-100g so that 4-manning bot lane isn't as worth as it can be, but the normal gold granted from the top tower/s are still the same. In addition to the reduction of the first blood tower gold, Riot can buff the bot lane towers to become much harder to dive and siege by:

Giving it more damage & more attack speed to take down waves faster and punish divers and....
Durability so that they aren't very easy to take as they are right now.

To add to that, we may need to nerf the buffs the Dragons gives since those buffs are invaluable, essential and easy to get as soon a team 4-man's bot. This is to also make 4-manning bot even more not worth. On top of that, we can buff RH in that we can give it more survivability and pushing power so that it's a bit more compelling and worth to take.

I know this isn't tower-related, but overall, Riot seriously needs to lower the amount of power bot lane has in the game. Bot lane right now is too influential with Janna's and Tristana's running amok in the game. I think this needs to be addressed.

MoldyCheese1Aug 11, 20171 votes

they reduced tower gold

YennAug 11, 20174 votes

{quoted}

they reduced tower gold

It's not the gold alone. It's a combination tower gold, kill gold (because you clearly won the clusterfuck if you took the tower), EXP advantage, denial of map control to the enemy team, and middle tower being free shortly after as you collapse on it.

Taking the first tower gives too many benefits.

deadlychuckAug 11, 20171 votes

I mean, it doesn't help that taking the bottom tower basically gives you nearly incontestable control over dragon pit just from a positioning prospective.

YennAug 12, 20171 votes

At 7 minutes, Aurelion Sol shoves my lane and E's to bottom, where the enemy team tried to 4-man the tower. I teleported down and defended it. At 8 minutes, he shoves again and E's to bottom, and they 4-man it again. I can't get there to defend it and the tower goes down.

Game over. Enemy team proceeds to 5-man mid tower + 2 kills from diving us, starting the snowball from taking the bottom tower.

http://i.imgur.com/WJYfmLB.jpg

After that, they try to 3-man top; we managed to defend it 4v3 once, but lose the inner middle tower, because the total advantage they got from taking first tower made them too strong to defend against 3v3.

There's nothing that could have been done to stop this once the tower went down. Kog'maw could have came mid, but he's already behind and would have gotten further behind due to lost CS, and likely wouldn't have stopped them from taking it. Gnar could have preemptively come mid to defend, but Urgot would have taken his tower, resulting in roughly the same outcome. We could have given up the outter turret, but then they just would have continued to take the inner turret.

This is stupid as fuck and needs to be fixed.

YennAug 12, 20171 votes

I'm jungling, bottom lane gets double killed before I even hit level 3, game over. I hover around their lane and stop the enemy jungle from ganking them twice, because I don't want them to take the tower early.

The instant they hit 6, enemy team 4-mans bottom lane, and we can't defend because our bottom is still 5. Tower is lost, I lose control of my jungle, and the enemy uses their advantage to take two more towers. End of game.

This is a huge fucking waste of time.

YennAug 12, 20171 votes

Wow, enemy had a Soraka support and I was playing Kog'maw ADC, so we switched it up and rushed mid tower at 8 minutes. It had the exact same effect as rushing bottom tower and we snowballed into a waste of 15 minutes, as the enemy team had no chance thanks to our advantage.

YennAug 15, 20171 votes

Oh boy, up 3-0 at bottom lane!

And then Sivir hits level 6, pops her ult, and dives us with her jungle. Our tower goes down and then by the time we've respawned and gotten to a lane, we've also lost mid tower and dragon, shortly followed by top tower because we can't defend it against their advantage, and the game is pretty much over as they snowball to victory.

Super fun.