You know what tank supports need? A good shield that scales off of max health.

Paroe·May 15, 2018·22 votes·11,844 views

When is riot ever going to add-back ~~thorn barrier~~ shield battery? It was such a good passive and deserves to exist... What if it was a passive on kindlegem?

61 Comments

Devilreaper XIIIMay 15, 20189 votes

tank supports need an nerf up their arse not a buffed item.

LordGeovanniMay 15, 20181 votes

cause that will get people to stop playing Janna and Lulu.

ChaddyFantomeMay 16, 20181 votes

{quoted}

cause that will get people to stop playing Janna and Lulu.

Janna Lulu aren't een top tier. Tank supports are.

LordGeovanniMay 17, 20181 votes

Im saying you want to nerf Tanks and people on the boards like to complain about Lulu and Janna being the only picked supports cause they sit back and do nothing as sheild bots. But i guess if they are the top picked champions tanks arent though. But then again just like but completely opposite to adcs does it really matter what the best of the worst class of champions are (best class of champions for adcs). These people are no doubt complaining about a 2 second window of increased resistances that can only be used once a team fight.

Devilreaper XIIIMay 16, 20182 votes

{quoted}

cause that will get people to stop playing Janna and Lulu.

tanks are too strong as it is no need for a buff.

LordGeovanniMay 17, 20181 votes

Tanks are too strong compared to what?.... I am not getting 1 shot in less than 3 seconds from 400 range by any tanks.

Devilreaper XIIIMay 18, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Tanks are too strong compared to what?.... I am not getting 1 shot in less than 3 seconds from 400 range by any tanks.

no but they can solo tank you 24/7 whilst you bash them with 3 to 4 teammates, and you still get killed, while the tank walks away.

LordGeovanniMay 18, 20181 votes

Even the best tanks with passive stats boosts cant take a bashing from 3 characters as defensive items are now and there are worse tanks than them. What people like to take is when a bruiser feeds into a tank. Because even though tanks are bad bruisers are worse. Then the other lanes also lose to their lane and encounter a tank they may not be able to kill him in less than 5 seconds with 3 people but it definitely takes less than 10 and that is only if a tank is ahead builds cdr on a damage item and is full hp before an all in. There are only 2 items that fit those criteria and one is a tank item one is an ap item but only one of those gives significant kill pressure. in an all in fight.

Devilreaper XIIIMay 19, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Even the best tanks with passive stats boosts cant take a bashing from 3 characters as defensive items are now and there are worse tanks than them. What people like to take is when a bruiser feeds into a tank. Because even though tanks are bad bruisers are worse. Then the other lanes also lose to their lane and encounter a tank they may not be able to kill him in less than 5 seconds with 3 people but it definitely takes less than 10 and that is only if a tank is ahead builds cdr on a damage item and is full hp before an all in. There are only 2 items that fit those criteria and one is a tank item one is an ap item but only one of those gives significant kill pressure. in an all in fight.

wtf are you talking about? i see plenty of tanks going in 1vs5 and live, i said 1vs3 because i know for a fact all tank champions can survive that, just one example of an tank going 1vs5, taking at least 1 or 2 kills and walking out alive is leona.

LordGeovanniMay 19, 20181 votes

Im not saying you cant see that im saying that if you do see that its because the enemy literally ignores their engage aka the only thing you guys want tanks to be able to do at all

Devilreaper XIIIMay 20, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Im not saying you cant see that im saying that if you do see that its because the enemy literally ignores their engage aka the only thing you guys want tanks to be able to do at all

i'm sorry i don't understand what you are saying O.o take a deep breath please and formulate this beter. and maybe use -------> , <--------

i don't mean offence by it.

from what i understand, you are saying that opponents ignore engage? and thats what we all want tanks doing at all??????

decrypt your own comments please .-. and please, please use ------> , <------

KlydeFrogMay 19, 20181 votes

Alistar can

LordGeovanniMay 19, 20181 votes

Well that would be because damage reduction isn't a stat wouldnt it, but rather the result of lots of stats reduced for the amount you stack on any other champion that stacks it. Its the same reason why annie can walk close to you, you can jump on her with and assassin or fighter and she just walks out of it. Diffrence is that annie has it on a basic spell low cooldown and does damage with it and gives it to tibbers with a speed boost and alistar has it on a long cooldown ult.

KlydeFrogMay 19, 20181 votes

And he can tank 1v5 point proven? Well leona and stoneplate can. Taric can. Just saying

LordGeovanniMay 19, 20181 votes

No one wants to use an item that provides horrible stats with the condition that you have to be surrounded to get decent stats and then cut their own damage by 60%. the same way mages cry that they do no damage when they just build the cheapest path of damage rather than they best scaling path of damage.

KlydeFrogMay 19, 20181 votes

The point of it was 1v5 and survive

LordGeovanniMay 20, 20181 votes

Again its an item that wont likely be picked up because of what it does bad stats in less than 3 situation and its stats arent good enough for a more than3 situation if you get into a 1v5 with any of those champions you arent surviving. the only tank with a chance at that is Malphite and that is if he gets engaged on is near a wall and has his ult on the condtion that he is running away not 1v5ing. the only way 1v5's end is if one of the 2 parties die and i dont see leona and taric killing 5 straight people even less so with stone plate cutting their damage

KlydeFrogMay 20, 20181 votes

You really dont like being proved wrong do you

LordGeovanniMay 20, 20181 votes

No one does but you have yet to prove anything. item 3193 is not viable to pick up on a support nor is it usefull to use when you are chain stunning people

Dead flag bluesMay 15, 20183 votes

item 3190

ParoeMay 15, 20185 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dead flag blues,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vHl0BnP5,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-05-15T11:10:38.828+0000)

SUch an aweful item on anyone but a support with income.
But it would also make a ton of sense to have a passive self-shield, since it lacks HP on its own.

{quoted}

what? no

They got the item for the shield and never sold it until last item.

What? I NEVER saw an ADC - even in pro play with it was a viable strat - upgrade it unless they were behind, and they always sold it shortly after lane phase ended. Are you confusing it with steraks or something?

MhihnjMay 15, 20183 votes

you replied to the wrong guy dude

ParoeMay 15, 20182 votes

{quoted}

you replied to the wrong guy dude

No... I qouted two seperate posts and put them in one...? Try setting your view type to something less Reddit-ee, you'l understand then.

ModWulf HelhammerMay 15, 201811 votes

People don’t get notifications when you do that.

LordGeovanniMay 15, 20181 votes

as much as i can i try to stay out of Cronological view

nelogisMay 15, 20181 votes

What? I NEVER saw an ADC - even in pro play with it was a viable strat - upgrade it unless they were behind, and they always sold it shortly after lane phase ended. Are you confusing it with steraks or something?

Dude it was like at the start of season 8, right before the supp item reworks (well "rework" more like a rushed patch if anything, to end the "everyone abuses the supp items" meta)

Just watch a video or a stream from before the supp item reworks and look at bot. Almost all ADCs in high elo picked it, the only guy of the top of my head that didn't do it was Tyler1 and he dropped like there is no tomorrow because of it.

Steraks was a whole other story

Edit: By the way I don't get notified when you reply like that.

AzadetheMay 15, 20181 votes

Yasuo with his core three items + item 3190 is near unkillable.

BattalionMay 16, 20183 votes

Enough, no more shields, it's getting to the:

#If everyone is broken, no one is broken

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/219/863/a32.png

nelogisMay 15, 20182 votes

What the fuck is a thorn barrier?

You mean Courage of the Colossus?

ParoeMay 15, 201811 votes

{quoted}

What the fuck is a thorn barrier?

You mean Courage of the Colossus?

No. And upon looking it up, its actually shield battery. Oops.

Regardless...
UNIQUE – QUEST: Earn Gold 750 using this item. REWARD: Shield Battery, a permanent shield for 255 - 340 (based on level) health. The shield regenerates slowly when out-of-combat. Executing minions with Spoils of War regenerates 64 - 85 (based on level) shield value.

It was the old targons line quest reward. I guess i remember it as something much cooler than it was, but oh well!

nelogisMay 15, 201813 votes

ADCs abused it and walked around with 1/3 of their HP as a permanent shield, thats why it got removed.

Courage on the other hand would be a nice keystone that could replace Afterschock and give tank supports their shield back instead of that Guardian thing.

ParoeMay 15, 20182 votes

{quoted}

ADCs abused it and walked around with 1/3 of their HP as a permanent shield, thats why it got removed.

Courage on the other hand would be a nice keystone that could replace Afterschock and give tank supports their shield back instead of that Guardian thing.

... What? ADCs never upgraded to targons brace or higher. They kept relic shield and sold it off as soon as the laning phase was over.

nelogisMay 15, 201825 votes

what? no

They got the item for the shield and never sold it until last item.

saltranMay 15, 20186 votes

Yup, it was really busted but being honest I enjoyed playing Jinx in that meta xd

MagnusOfProsperoMay 15, 20182 votes

It's such a crime that adc's abuse a tanky item to survive the amount of one shot assassins in the game, so they remove all quests, forever making support items a joke again, but no one bats an eye when half the ezreal players build an iceborn gauntlet becoming unkillable when combined with his flash on a 10 second cooldown.

DoozkuMay 15, 20182 votes

Except support items aren't a joke and the fact that ADCs abused it wasn't the sole reason why it was removed.

AzadetheMay 15, 20182 votes

They've lost about 2500-4000 gold a game, even if you are the best user of them after all the Season 8 changes.

item 3311 also prevents you from protecting your lane in the case of a recalled adc or a Bad adc. I've tested that. Got put on cooldown for 11 minutes.

item 3302 gold gain has actually INCREASED for both adc and support, because of the fact most gold gain was throttled into the siege minion, so supports who execute siege minions now gain 50% to 100% more gold per minion than they used to.

Rathar DashingMay 15, 20181 votes

item 3311 the penalty for CSing goes away after you complete the quest. So like after 10 minutes or so you can start pushing in your own if you're that kind of support ( Morgana or Lux )

item 3307 they also nerfed the passive gold gain this item gives per 5 seconds, down from 4 to 1. This balances out to about the same, much less if you miss a cannon minion. Also in no way does this affect an ADC's gold income.

AzadetheMay 16, 20181 votes

Yes but you completely missed the boat of what I'm saying. Bot lane is often decided by 10 minutes. By 10 minutes, your opposing laners have often been to your turret 3-4 times, and you can't CLEAR IT.

I'm literally stuck bringing minions to 10% hp and not killing them, when an adc isn't in lane, just because it will f me for the rest of the game if I kill them.

Even if the adc is in lane, often they STILL last hit minions under turret rather than clearing them.

Do you know how frustrating that is? to have to sacrifice minions just because your adc's timing is off? to Sacrifice part of the EXP? To Sacrifice the gold?

Adcs already often destroy your XP momentum as support, because you get more XP when they kill minions than when they wiff and miss.

It's literally the ONLY item that punishes you for owning it. And your lane. And your team.

I top Ornn and take item 3096 . I often finish the quest before supports do.

Rathar DashingMay 16, 20181 votes

Uh, yes, I know exactly how frustrating that is. I'm a support main.

If your ADC isn't CSing or is constantly out of lane, then he's a bad ADC. Unfortunately, as a support, your performance is tied to theirs as well. However, that's the life the support chooses.

Also, buying Spellthief's is a choice. If you think you'll find yourself in a situation where you need to push a lane as a support, just take Coin.

AzadetheMay 16, 20181 votes

I take Coin on non mages. Mages do worse with it though. You really need Spell on Zyra Morgana for example.

Rathar DashingMay 16, 20181 votes

If you can get the procs and make the most of it, yeah. In that case too you're making a pretty big dent in your enemy's HP, or even getting your lane a kill.

Emo TwinkMay 16, 20181 votes

{quoted}

No. And upon looking it up, its actually shield battery. Oops.

Regardless...
UNIQUE – QUEST: Earn Gold 750 using this item. REWARD: Shield Battery, a permanent shield for 255 - 340 (based on level) health. The shield regenerates slowly when out-of-combat. Executing minions with Spoils of War regenerates 64 - 85 (based on level) shield value.

It was the old targons line quest reward. I guess i remember it as something much cooler than it was, but oh well!

I want support quests back, maybe even for completing the final support item thing to give more incentive for fully completing it.

AirKingNeoMay 15, 20182 votes

so tanks top lane abuse it?

LordGeovanniMay 15, 20181 votes

they both need it along with bruisers since riot want to stick all of bruisers value into 400 hp items instead of giving them items with more than 60 ad and 50 magic resist / armor as hybid items with ad / attack speed and even if they dont lock the item from adcs they could lock some of the stats from them.

Teridax68May 15, 20182 votes

My thoughts on this:

To start, Shield Battery never scaled with max health. It was a flat value that scaled with level.
As an always-on shield, SB was functionally not that different from bonus health. The shield certainly had more ways of regenerating than health on champions lacking in sustain, but that in itself did not differ significantly on an item that itself provides health regen and self-healing.

So basically, asking for a Shield Battery-like effect, imo, simply ends up translating to asking for more bonus health in a slightly different color. I could definitely get behind a shield or mini-health bar that regenerated very quickly at certain times in combat, but that would end up being a completely different effect.

remakoroMay 16, 20181 votes

If only there was such item item 3309 item 3190

ParoeMay 17, 20181 votes

{quoted}

If only there was such item

THe idea is shield battery, which gave you a shield that acted as bonus health but was not bonus health. It was very useful in many situations, but never amounted to much more than eating an ability or taking a few extra hits from a marksman.

remakoroMay 17, 20181 votes

That shit was insanely OP -__-

ParoeMay 17, 20181 votes

{quoted}

That shit was insanely OP -__-

It... was not, in any way o.O It was, however, the most accurate quest reward in terms of theme. And it was around when the eye item for tanks still had 400/500HP; Right now, it would just be a great thing to have on some item. Making locket of the iron solari, an item which is all about the shields, also give you a shield instead of HP... Would simply make it a better item for most players, and not make it super overbearing in pro play.