DFG - an item of value?

Earl Eulrich··2 votes·468 views

I think I´ll start of with a comment from Pwyff on 3.13 and DFG:

I'm not saying that DFG pidgeonholes champions into building the item but a lot of the time if assassins are strong then the competitive meta can get focused on who manipulates DFG the best. Syndra does build DFG more often than the others on your situational picks, and Annie / Veigar are unpicked for other reasons. LeBlanc / Ahri / Syndra (sometimes TF and lategame Fizz) do build it and those are the AP assassins we'd probably see come up if they do get strong. Even Lissandra there's a very real danger when she gets played that she instead goes for a DFG and blows fools up (as someone put it).

I'm not saying it's as black and white as pidgeonholing but I am saying that the danger of burst mages rushing DFG is a pretty unhealthy world. We'd instead prefer to have that power on the mage themselves."

I think that pretty much sums up my problems with the item...it only seems to create cases of abuse, but doesn´t add anything to the gameplay.

  • It makes killing things quicker ->less reaction time ->less counterplay
  • It allows for more sloppy plays ->still seeing many deathlogs when Ahri missed q and e and killed someone only with the non-skillshot dmg from r+w+dfg, same for other DFG-(ab)users ->in a way rewards overly for making misstakes ->amplifies snowballing
  • It´s not at all hard to use, it´s just one more button ontop the usual combo

So for me personally I came to the conclusion it would most likely better to just delete the item and think of a new 120ap-tier item that really brings value to the game. Or is there sth. about DFG I don´t see that makes it worth having it in the game?

6 Comments

Serpents Embrace1 votes

"Just delete it" is a terrible suggestion. There are a lot of items that ding really offer much to the game and removing them isn't really the fix for any of them, except maybe Frozen Mallet.

DFG might be better suited as a 40 or 80 AP item that is cheap to build and works for mages and supports to "mark" an event target for their slits to focus. Remember, unlike Charm the damage it amplifies isn't specific to a source, just a type.

But, having only 5 120 AP items* is limiting and finding new ones that would fit would work wonders for late game build diversity. Did you have any ideas for those?

//* Seraph's Embrace gives 60 AP and the Insight passive gives roughly 60 more AP without any other mana items, but isn't strictly a 120 AP item.

Earl Eulrich1 votes

Well yea, deleting might be a tad bit much...having it as an low-Ap-supportive Item without basedmg could indeed be interessting.

For other 120Ap items i could imagine sth. like a lategame Mana-Item that has some ways of aggressive-manarestore, for cases when you went aggressive in your build early on without sustain and then want to get mana later on, but tear´s not worth stacking anymore (maybe a 20%maxhealth->40%maxmana trade active?).

Or sth. that is based around imropving waveclear/AoE, so mages that cannot push well gain some additional power here (like hydra, maybe just another change to Banner of command).

Maybe even sth. like an item that lets you radiant in power once you´re dead and amplifies your allies for a short amount of time - so an item that proccs on dead like GA but not in a selfish way (nice for initiator mages like diana/lissandra).

There sure are a lot of possibilities to explore.

Serpents Embrace1 votes

Deathcap is enough of a wave clear item, and a high AP mana item would infringe on Seraph's identity.

The death well seems really cool, though. Although somewhat impractical. But even that would seem better on a lower AP tier, because it lends itself to supporting others and won't necessarily help get the user ahead to continue purchasing luxury items.


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Worgslarg1 votes

I dislike DFG, simply because it's another button to push in a combo, and I dislike having to manage more than 1-2 item actives.

Hoi Im Temmo1 votes

I like dfg...but i kinda agree. I rush DFG on veigar in lane - and usually get it levl 7-9. I save my ulti till then (unless obvious easy kill) - and when i get back to lane, i got stun->DFG->Ulti-Q and get a kill. At this point, i can q farm away from them until ulti and dfg are back, and get another easy kill. By the end of the game, there is so much AP on Veigar, that any champ (not just ap's) get insta-deleted by dfg+ulti. adc, jungler, tanks. doesnt matter.

Linna Excel1 votes

DFG is strong because the active is basically a champ's gateway into 100-0ing people. IMO Dcap is a better damage item over time, however because it's missing that active rushing it doesn't give you that delete ability that people want or need to have. This goes double for assassins, they need to be able to do their job and both parts of the active of DFG allow that to happen, or speed it up in a few cases.

Honestly I'm not sure what should be done with it. It is needed on one hand. On the other it has caused a lot of issues and needed a lot of champs to be nerfed because they rush it in game.

I think if they got rid of the initial damage of the active and stuck to marking a target only, it might work better.

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