Aram - mabye make the "r" finally stand for random?

Earl Eulrich·Aug 5, 2014·21 votes·8,056 views

I really likethe concept of Aram...it´s quick, it´s action-oriented, it´s full of variation, providing lots of room for improvisation. That´s the theorie however.

Unfortunately in practical play it turns out that very many Arams are just very onesided...not because one team plays much better, but because their teamcomposition just dismantles the other. It neither enjoyable to stomp without having someone fighting back, nor is it enjoyable to get stomped.

So how can this be improved?

I think the main-problem currently is that there are a damn lot of players that own a lot of mages/ad-carries and maybe some supports - but not many melee champions (that traditionally don´t do all that well in Aram)...so players that own many/all champs are more likely to "lose" champselect in aram...and most matches include a lot of high-poke champions, while you very rarely see a multitude of melees. The other problem is the reroll button...as it just steamlines setups more into the poke>>>all direction, so if you don´t reroll your melees you can be sure the opposition has the better matchup.

So from my perspectives two things have to change:

The dice-roll should include all Champions, wether or not a player owns them to make sure everyone has the same chance to get an Aram-powerhouse
this would also force players to improvise and adapt a lot more, which is what the gamemode should be all about in the first place (playing a random-champ should lure you out of your comfort-zone from time to time)
this would also shut down specific aram-accounts that only own Champions that perform very well in Aram
rerolling should not be an option, or at least should be limited to 1 reroll per game
alternatively the reroll could lower the amount of IP gained as a trade-off (thanks to Fluxbound for the idea)
If you get a champ you seldom/never played before - so what? The Champs are there to be played, and maybe you´ll find a new champ to fall in love with that way. As I said...the gamemode should bring out the best in the players regarding improvisation - not make them stand 2000range away from each other and just play a game of poke&chicken if things work out well (I still would absolutely dig an ultimate-bravery mode).

52 Comments

RiotRoboLionsAug 6, 201424 votes

We agree that something could be done to make ARAMs a more balanced and cohesive mode. We're still working towards identifying an end solution so I can't share any specifics at this time, but I want you to know we are on the case! :)

Tapu FiniAug 6, 20142 votes

Glad to see it's being looked at. The three biggest problems I usually see are Poke comps, sustain comps, and all-in comps. A mix of them is nice, but when you have 4/5 champs with a heal, and summoner heal... Making headway is pretty rough.

Earl EulrichAug 6, 20145 votes

Wow, can´t tell you how glad I am to hear that. It´s really a mode with the potential for brilliant games, hopefully you´ll find the right way to make sure most of the games are actually awesome (and not 5melees without hardengage fighting a ziggs/sona/ashe comp). Keep up the great work!

Linna ExcelAug 6, 20142 votes

I'm just sick of getting a champ I don't feel like playing ATM too many times in a row. That's the big problem with ARAM and why I think it has less popularity than it should have: not getting the champs you want to play often enough is bad.

That's we people make aram only alts.

Neer InvictaeAug 7, 20141 votes

i remember when ARAM 1st came out and every game had a Zilean in it

Sire HippingtonAug 8, 20143 votes

I think the whole point of aram is getting a random champ, not the champ u want, and from my experience, aram acounts are more about getting the 'OP' picks so u can feel strong and mighty without much effort.

The main problem i have with arams these days is that u see 70% poke comps(not just a bunch of champs with poke, but a setup with lots of poke AND a strong disengage), and no-poke comps can't win vs poke comp unless they it'S a allin divecomp with hardengage, but getting such a comp rarly happens.

I think the main reason for this is the Reroll button. Most players will reroll if they don't have a poe-champ, i've seen serveral comps starting with like ashe, udyr, sion, vayne, rammus ending up with ashe+sona+lux+vayne+gragas, so rerolls lead to alot off poke-comps. Most players also have bad expirience with dive-champs, as a aatrox or J4 usually sucks in ararm IF he is the only melee in the game, which often happens, so they reroll those champs as soon as they see them, even though they work great in a dive comp with multiple of those champs. This means that manny good engage comps with like malph+Vi+J4+Irelia+velcoz end up with Irelia as the only melee left, as everyone else reroles, wich than leads to irelia having a bad expereience as only melee in ararm, so she likely rerolls melees as well in future games, regardless of the teams setup.

Conclusion: -remove reroll buttons for variation in comps -let players random from the entire champion pool rather than from their own pool to avoid aram-only acounts and further increase the varity of picks.

If alot people would like to play all-mid without random picks cause the want to play a specific champ and like the poke vs poke battles that will most likly happen, they can do so in custom games, just like aram was played along time in custom games till it became an oficcial Q. If than the blind/draft pick all-mid scene grows big enough, they could implement a draft or blind Que for Howling-Abyss, but with a not high enough playerbase, the Q time would be awfull(looking at dominin-draftmode...)

Jesus is SaviorAug 7, 20142 votes

You're "looking into it"? The solution is simple: it picks from ALL champs, not just "owned" champs. I can't even play this mode because of "ARAM only accounts". It's not fun. Besides always being at a disadvantage (because I own like half the champions in the game - which is a lot), I also get less IP for ARAMs, because I am more likely to lose, because I'm not an "ARAM only account".

People are actually NOT playing this mode because of this issue. That's how bad it is.

Garlyle WildsAug 7, 20141 votes

Thanks, Robolions. I play more ARAM than any other mode in League and have since Howling Abyss was made an actual thing; so it's nice to hear that there are still Rioters looking into it. Aside from Rioters asking the community to come play, we get less attention than Dominion and Twisted Treeline do (and, let's be honest, that's saying something)

AcceptedAug 7, 20141 votes

As long as it stays full random with selecting your champion, im up for anything. But personally im fine with the way it currently is.

Its random for a reason.

CharQueenAug 16, 20141 votes

I just made a post with tons of ideas. Please, Riot.

Your initial random pick is biased towards heroes you have available that you have played the least.
Your rerolls are unbiased and include the entire pool of heroes.
Three available dice.
You will have a free reroll for every match. -20% IP / EXP gains if used.
Your other two dice must be earned. The first earned dice will subtract an additional -10% IP /EXP gains. The second earned dice will subtract an additional -20% IP / EXP gains.
Filling up another dice meter removes +5% of the IP / EXP debuff. This stacks up to +30% IP / EXP to reward players for playing unfavorable champions or trading with their team.
You may only trade with someone if one of you owns that champion. This creates a more versatile team to have more control over their roles.

Earl EulrichDec 15, 20143 votes

So well...it´s 4months now and i perceive as ARAM only gradually gets worse, feeling less random and more streamline poke-comp vs streamline poke-comp every damn game. Please don´t just abandon every map that isn´t SR!

RiotRoboLionsJan 6, 20154 votes

I'm not sure how you think it is we have "abandoned every map that isn't SR". Ignoring the Freljord update we have had a good selection of game modes on the map and continue to collect more and more valuable data (such as data that was harder to get when ARAM was done in custom games).

We are learning a lot and performing experiments so that we can confidently identify what is the most healthy thing for ARAM.

iainB85Jan 6, 20154 votes

{quoted}

I'm not sure how you think it is we have "abandoned every map that isn't SR". Ignoring the Freljord update we have had a good selection of game modes on the map and continue to collect more and more valuable data (such as data that was harder to get when ARAM was done in custom games).

We are learning a lot and performing experiments so that we can confidently identify what is the most healthy thing for ARAM.

I dunno man, it's been 5 months since your original post of, "We are looking into it" and the only thing every ARAM players are asking for is to make it truly random and not specific to unlocked champions.

This doesn't seem like that hard of a fix. Certainly not one that should take over half a year to release.

JedditeJan 6, 20152 votes

{quoted}

I'm not sure how you think it is we have "abandoned every map that isn't SR". Ignoring the Freljord update we have had a good selection of game modes on the map and continue to collect more and more valuable data (such as data that was harder to get when ARAM was done in custom games).

We are learning a lot and performing experiments so that we can confidently identify what is the most healthy thing for ARAM.

Snowdown Showdown, All For One: Mirror Mode, and Legend of the Poro-King ARE NOT supporting ARAM. Those are just temporary game modes that are featured on the Howling Abyss map. That's where the similiarities end. The Ascenion game mode WAS NOT in any way balancing or support for Dominion -- it was just a re-skinned Crystal Scar.

The only support ARAM gets is half-baked, ARAM-specific items (Horn of Winter, Orb of Winter) with no follow-up, -or- itemization changes that clearly were made with ZERO consideration for ARAM (Quill Coat ward functionality, removal of jungle items, removal of Executioner's Calling). "Because Summoner's Rift."

NO WARDS NO ROAMJan 6, 20156 votes

{quoted}

I'm not sure how you think it is we have "abandoned every map that isn't SR". Ignoring the Freljord update we have had a good selection of game modes on the map and continue to collect more and more valuable data (such as data that was harder to get when ARAM was done in custom games).

We are learning a lot and performing experiments so that we can confidently identify what is the most healthy thing for ARAM.

Alright.

Riot takes an astronomically long time to solve problems and then refuses to communicate on the topic to explain why for months at a time. Learn from the East Coast fiasco, please. Either do something or tell us why you haven't, because in my eyes there is no reason any potential aram changes should be taking so long. A lack of results and a lack of communication combined just makes Riot look like a disorganized, lazy company incapable of getting anything done. We, as players, don't know what's going on at Riot HQ, so don't expect us to believe that anything meaningful is happening if you refuse to show us, one way or another.

For what it's worth, my perception is that Riot has abandoned every game mode except SR. Featured game modes hardly count.

Sorry if this post is harsh, but I don't see how else to get the point across. It's a Riot-wide problem, so I hope you don't feel like this is a personal attack; it's not, at all.

I want to know, from your perspective (addressing anyone at Riot), why we shouldn't feel as though the topic is being ignored? ARAM has gone completely unaddressed since your last post in this thread five months ago. No changes, no communication. Why, in your opinion, should that translate, to us, as a good sign? As progress being made? As players being listened to? The same could be asked about a multitude of topics; again, Riot-wide problem. Is Reddit and the forums exploding with rage (see: East Coast) the only way to drill this in? Finally progress is being made on the communication side in that area, but after so long, and it took THAT much to make it happen. You know very well that this issue will never reach that level of importance; does that mean we should never expect communication, at all? That seems to be how Riot does things.

iamthegoatofwarJan 8, 20152 votes

How about the most healthy thing is you unlock every champ for that mode...There I just solved your issue. Get it done.

Earl EulrichMar 23, 20152 votes

Well, just read what TheRazorX answered to Zenon about that topic, it sums up the more important flaws pretty well...http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/2zn8f5/if_permanent_urf_mode_would_get_stale_why_does/cpkqv8s.

But yea, TTT is massivly fucked up since you just removed the t2 jungle start without 2nd thought after making the jungle hit really hard for not that much xp in the map. Not to mention some items are really just dumped in that map without having some of the components available. shouldn`t be that much work to at least look at these things beforehand and either give a statement or fix them. Dominion could be improved if you somewhat made it more ascension-esc..or at least added some more specific balances + items. and Aram...just for starters - it would help a ton if you´d enable all champs for everyone, so aram-accounts instantly get shut down.

Every patch there is a damn lot going on for SR, but not even 10% of that works goes in all other maps combined from mine perception, and that is just bullshit. please donßt take that personal however, it´s really not about you - but rather about how Riot as a whole is handling everything except SR since quite forever.

Kowe The EwokJan 6, 20153 votes

The problem: People make dedicated ARAM accounts, featuring only champions which are "overpowered" in ARAM.

Solution: Grant every player access to every champion. Since people can't choose their character anyways you are in no danger of loosing out on champion-sales. Instead people can use it to discover champions. This solution equals out the chances for everybody and helps so overcome dedicated ARAM accounts.

4nth0l0gyJan 6, 20153 votes

I hope you have considered that this solution the OP has posted, that ARAMs allow for true randomness in champion selection; a solution that has been reiterated MANY, many times on boards and the forums before that in varying fashions; does, in fact, fix the problem, not only effectively, but in a way the community supports.

I really do think it is a shame that you can't share any specifics with us, because we are being very specific for Riot's benefit. In fact, I'm disappointed, because this has typically been Riot's response to anything that has a seemingly easy fix. No explanation as to why that wouldn't be the case, no chance to include the community in the actual discussion. We're just here to throw ideas at you and see what sticks, I guess.

Hoi Im TemmoAug 5, 20144 votes

I agree with the first point - but on the second, I feel it would be better to just allow 1 reroll per game. Every game.

None of this earning your reroll, I should just get one reroll.

Earl EulrichAug 5, 20142 votes

might be a compromise, though i still feel like it would benefit the gamemode to really put people off their comfort-zone, so they can learn to enjoy league as a whole with lots of power/viability to explore away from the "metas".

Hoi Im TemmoAug 5, 20142 votes

Yeah, but then it becomes a question of who rolled their main, and who didn't OR who is gonna dodge this one.

Example: we ALL have that one champ we can't stand to play (At least one) - do you really think people who roll, say, Poppy, aren't gonna dodge or afk?

Earl EulrichAug 5, 20142 votes

Well, I think if it´s clear for those things to happen once someone agrees on playing an Aram...i doubt there´s any reason to dodge/afk - it would be the same chance for everyone to get the 1 champ he really cannot stand.

I personally e.g. absolutely hate playing Sion, yet i play him from time to time in Aram (or /rnd dominion) - and every now and then i even manage to find a game when i can enjoy playing Sion. Sometimes it´s good to be forced to try sth. anew you did disregard a long time ago

Hoi Im TemmoAug 5, 20143 votes

Yes; but consider the immaturity of the majority of the player base (especially among those who joined this season (not all, most)) - We are talking about players who reported me for playing Teemo in normals because its "Trolling." The truth is, people will play aram, not get a champion who dominates, dodge/afk, try again - unless you give them a chance to ditch the champion they rolled, at least once.

Personally, there is like 5 champions in the game I actively dislike. The rest are fun to play, even if I suck at it XD

Earl EulrichAug 5, 20142 votes

though i wouldn´t want to gerneralize any part of the playerbase - i guess you have a valid point, maybe it would be better to allow players one reroll per game.

FlemmanAug 7, 20142 votes

A good thing will be to have a "memory" of the champ when someone dodge, in addition with the longer queue time for dodge, that gave them the same champ over and over again, don't think they will dodge many time after that.

Honestly, unlock all champ seems the best idea but I really doubt riot would do it since a player who only do aram will no longer need to unlock any champ (bad for buisness :s) Maybe a pool of 20 bonus champ per week (in addition to the free one and the champion you already have), with only 2 use max for each champ would be better to lower the effect of the "unlock aram only" champ

Hoi Im TemmoAug 7, 20141 votes

Honestly: riot should probably increase the free champ pool anyway, we are about get our 120th champion....

But I like the memory thing XD You don't like Urgot? THEN YOU GET URGOT, B****. Yes pls,, riot.

1cec0ldOct 14, 20141 votes

That would make urgot go afk and cause an unenjoyable experience for the 4v5 match. I hate queue dodgers as much as the rest, but I'd rather wait in queue for another 45 seconds for a 5v5 than lose because someone isn't happy with their champ.

Hoi Im TemmoOct 14, 20141 votes

Valid point....but if he didnt dodge, and someone else did, it would re-randomize, yes?

JamenerAug 7, 20143 votes

You're right. There should be punishments for dodging a queue, just like in ranks.

FluxBoundAug 6, 20142 votes

Or you could always have 1 reroll and be able to earn another reroll, BUT you lose some of the ip gain in doing so

Hoi Im TemmoAug 6, 20141 votes

hmmm.....or just you can reroll up to 4 times, but sacrificing 25% of the ip gain each time (down to 0 IP)

Serpents EmbraceAug 5, 20143 votes

Making all champions available in aram is a great idea. It would also stop players from making aram accounts with nothing but free champions and the aram gods. I know some people with those. :/

Might not feel great to players who don't have the rune pages for every type of class, though. Wonder how fun aram would be without runes and masteries...

Earl EulrichAug 5, 20143 votes

I don´t think masteries can be taken as an argument...as you can still swap them during champ-select at will.

Runes might be problematic, but then again....i played more than 1 game as ap-zed because i forgot to change runes and came out ahead in the end. Runes mostly affect the laning-phase, lategame the impact is a lot less - and as aram has no real laning-phase i think the impact of runes&masteries in the mode is fairly low compared to SR.

+most players at least will have one alround ap and one allround ad runepage once they are lvl 30.

Serpents EmbraceAug 5, 20141 votes

Compared to the people with a rune page made solely for aram? Heavy health regeneration is so useful in aram but useless elsewhere.

Just saying, the edge of preparedness isn't just about what champions the account owns. Runes need to be purchased too. You got me with masteries being free so keeping them would be whatever.

Earl EulrichAug 5, 20142 votes

Though massive health-reggen would be sort of universal, so that doesn´t get affected by having the chance to get any champ in the game. All in all I really think the impact of runes onto arams is fairly minor, though there might be guys that spend quite some thinking into maxing their winchances that way aswell. And having only a limited set of runes/pages really is a problem in general, not sth. specific for Aram.

JedditeJan 6, 20153 votes

I'm not sure how you think it is we have "abandoned every map that isn't SR". Ignoring the Freljord update we have had a good selection of game modes on the map and continue to collect more and more valuable data (such as data that was harder to get when ARAM was done in custom games).

We are learning a lot and performing experiments so that we can confidently identify what is the most healthy thing for ARAM.

Well... you guys *did *remove Executioner's Calling from ARAM. Even though literally ZEROS OF NONES of players asked Rito James™ to remove one (of the only two) items that inflicts the Grievous Wounds debuff from ARAM.

But a fantastic amount of high-level consideration by top men went into that decision, right? OK good -- just checking.

Gambol x ShroudAug 10, 20142 votes

I think ARAM is fine. Sounds like a lot of bum hurt.

CharQueenAug 16, 20142 votes

The solution sounds simple to me - The champs that you have played the least have a higher chance of being selected. I can't tell you how irritated I am from playing over at least 30 matches as Alistar, Elise, or Garen. Today, I bought Zyra, Zilian, and Gnar. I've already played three matches with Zilian. Meanwhile, I have never played ARAM as Tristana. And I can't even remember the last time I played Jinx.

I would like to see reroll be truly effective. The dice should give you a champion from the entire champion pool. I agree with that completely. Anyway, bullet list...

Your initial random pick is biased towards heroes you have available that you have played the least.
Your rerolls are unbiased and include the entire pool of heroes.
Three available dice.
You will have a free reroll for every match. -20% IP / EXP gains if used.
Your other two dice must be earned. The first earned dice will subtract an additional -10% IP /EXP gains. The second earned dice will subtract an additional -20% IP / EXP gains.
Filling up another dice meter removes +5% of the IP / EXP debuff. This stacks up to +30% IP / EXP to reward players for playing unfavorable champions or trading with their team.
You may only trade with someone if one of you owns that champion. This creates a more versatile team to have more control over their roles. Example: owns . doesn't own . can trade with . cannot trade with .

C'mon Riot. Beam me up!

BlueThingamajigAug 6, 20141 votes

I agree with much of this in principle. Some of the most fun I've had in ARAM have been massive melee brawls when nobody has any real poke available.

I remember a one-for-all I played with some friends that ended up being Yorick vs. Volibear. It was legitimately hilarious.

Knight DevoutAug 7, 20141 votes

You don't know how many times I tried to raise this point. The usual answer was "git gud and dodge".

LammahAug 14, 20141 votes

In the ARAM NA forums I saw a very interesting suggestion regarding champ select.

He was suggesting both teams should be rolled until a each team has a similar total champion winrate. This would prevent totally one sided games where one team with OP champs (~300% winrate) would face a poor team (200% or less).

Opening the champ pool for rerolls seem like a great idea too.

Another option is to leave the last 40 free week champs open for ARAM at all time.

Unlocking more rerolls based on the number of champions owned could be nice.

Earl EulrichAug 14, 20141 votes

He was suggesting both teams should be rolled until a each team has a similar total champion winrate. This would prevent totally one sided games where one team with OP champs (~300% winrate) would face a poor team (200% or less).

I think while that sounds reasonable it has one major failure: A champions winrate doesn´t tell you anything about his strenght in a specific teamcomp. While most melees will have a rather bad winrate in Aram - if you put a bunch of them together and add some hard-initiation you can just steamrole over most poke-comps despite having 100%less combined-winrate. I think adapting to very different comps is really sth. I like most about Aram, and I think if the Championpool get´s bigger for everyone and less Poke/Sustain-comps are seen it´ll be enough to make all Champions viable enough...if however it should turn out that matches are still not balanced enough after enlarging the roll-pool - it might be worth a shot.

LammahAug 15, 20141 votes

Indeed, the winrate only tells you the average odds of winning the game with that particular champs. It is true some team comps with a similar winrate could be countering another one hard. Stilll that suggestion would help reduce the occurrence of totally one sided games.

SmokingPuffinOct 14, 20141 votes

The purpose built aram account is a serious problem for the mode. Still pretty happy with my aram experience but perhaps you can matchmake the 16 during aram champ account togetherso they don't bother the rest of us?

JedditeJan 6, 20151 votes

Riot RoboLions -- were you even on the Rito James™ payroll back when Rito James™ decided -- totally randomly -- to remove one Nexus Turret in ARAM? For reasons that were laughably rationalized as "reducing the average match time", or some such? Only after massive, immediate negative player feedback did Riot BEGRUDGINGLY reinstate the second Nexus Turret.

That's about the last time Rito James™ "supported" Howling Abyss after the map re-vamp. And it was terrible.

SparkfunJan 8, 20151 votes

Remember when twisted treeline was a thing? yeah me neither

Warning ShotSep 28, 20151 votes

As someone who owns every champion besides 7, id be rather upset that i spent hundrteds of games to unlock champions and suddenly everyone can play them in aram for free, like, yeah. necro.