When a Kennen/Annie/Brand/MF or even Zyra press 2buttons and cuck entire teams it's fine because it's positioning But when a Riven does a ER WQ(2) R2Q combo instantly on the backline Riven is the toxic champ with no counterplay and takes no skilll.
SchmidttyGames6 votesNone of your examples can also stand in a team-fight and survive. Kennen and MF's "move speed" doesn't match Riven's Dash(es). None of your examples can shield themselves naturally. None of them can simply bounce away like a happy bunny if their tricks don't work out.
Apples and Oranges don't compare.
Astôlfo5 votesKennen does Flash and/or Protobelt + R + Zhonya's. Annie does the same minus the Zhonya's. Brand can just mash his keys on a grouped team for ruin from long distance. MF just stands behind her tanks and ults into a grouped team.
None of them have the risk of getting and staying vulnerable in close range. Riven needs to get in close range and go through a longer duration combo on a single target without being instantly CC'd and peeled off.
SchmidttyGames4 votesOh, so you need to buy items or use Summoner Spells to do what Riven does on her own? What a surprise. Who would have thought that they could make a difference.
Annie has no range and is squishy as hell. Not to mention, when her 4 stacks are up, she can do nothing else except E without burning them.
Kennen's E is a Move Speed Buff, but not a significant one. It's primary purpose is to charge for W. He does need Flash and Protobelt to pull off something exciting, but Riven can use these too if she wanted to.
Brand's Q and W are both skillshots that can be easily avoided. His E is not, but it really helps his E to have the target already on fire, requiring Q or W to be fully effective. Brand's Ultimate is reduced to almost nothing if your teammates separate or he targets someone who flashes into a null zone (away from allies and minions)
MF's ult is pretty awesome but has a limited range. Once she uses it, she has little left to really scare you with.
Riven can bunny hop into your team while shielding and decimate everyone while gaining health from it, shielding from it, and doesn't require any of your fancy items to do it.
Apples and Oranges don't compare.
dominusx2 voteslimited range on mf ult. yeh you should give it Nami ult range. Annie squishy? nice joke man. she is a battle mage she is only squishy if the player is greedy and goes pure ap instead of the bruiserish build wiht rod rylais and abysal. Did i mention riven has to jump around 3-4 times to get in range whereas the others need to only flash in and instantly do their so called COMBO ? you gonna tell me riven can do the same? and yes she can but riven takes more time and MORE BUTTONs to do the same job aka she has more room to fuck up/get outplayed/get exhausted. 1.5 seconds and .5 seconds are miles apart in league.
SchmidttyGames2 votesMF's ult is a cone. You can sidestep the damn thing. You can also knock her out of it with any CC that isn't called Slow. This argument means nothing Riven can use flash. That argument means nothing. Annie is squishy as hell. That's her drawback for being 5 years old and being able to erase you. Once her kit is spent, if you didn't die, she will.
You're trying to compare Cancer to AIDS. While they might both still kill you, they do it in totally different ways. If you want to complain about Riven, compare her to a cancer that does the same thing she does. Yasuo.
dominusx2 votesMf ult is a cone that does 2k dmg in pretty much 1.2 seconds from RANGE big range. so yeh its not like i'm mad thay mf ult does dmg i'm annoyed because it ticks too fast and melts everything
Astôlfo3 votesRiven needs Flash too to actually catch someone off-guard fast enough against a team.
Annie doesn't need to do anything except wait and then engage with stun ultimate.
"not a significant one" my ass. I don't think you've seen Kennen ever ult a team if you think it's not strong too.
Not in a grouped team fight where everyone is clustered they can't. And Brand's R bounce range is longer than Flash.
MF's ult is all she needs. And if she gets Q off, that's an easy 70-80+% of a carry's maximum health.
She bunny hops into the team. Team laughs at clearly broadcasted attempt, CCs her, peels the carry away, and/or kills her. She doesn't dash while locked down already, AKA, no shields. And she needs multiple damage and tank items to actually deal any meaningful damage as well as survive long enough.
Try again. :) The overexaggerations and Riven salt is amusing though.
Wheatloaf2 votesJust sayin', don't people complain about Riven in lane more than in fights? She's only ridiculous in teamfights if she snowballs out of lane.
WoonStruck4 votesKennen's E is a Move Speed Buff, but not a significant one.
You think +100% movement speed isn't significant? Get out of here.
All of the examples you have are pretty bad and generally can't be avoided.
Also
Riven doesn't gain health without specific items.
Kennen doesn't need Flash or Protobelt. They help, but they're hardly needed lol.
Oh, the ADC with an auto reset and AS steroid has nothing left to scare you with? Hmm...
dominusx2 votesNone of the examples need to press more than 3 button to destroy a team whereas the other example needs an 8 button combo. cant compare cancer to skill you are right.
Jinzo Torrance3 votesCancer is what you get when you think that Riven main think she's "High Skillcap" just because they have to "master" (exploit) a gimmick that's faulty by design and is nowhere, fucking nowhere mentioned in her kit, because she wasn't intended to use it in the first place, and they still ask for buff because they can't climb above Master.
All you do in lane is mash button in any order, canceling your animation while you do it giving no time to react to the other guy other than "Stay out of her range xD" "Just chain CC her till she dies xD", then you wait 15 seconds and you do the same crap again.
Don't act like Riven is totally fine in comparison to Flash-Tibbers, it's the same unfun, low-counterplay crap.
Just look at the outplay here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlqbPwUttSs
Riven fucks up her combo, wait for her very very long CD, tanks an entire wave, double inputs to kill the Gangplank who just survived her all-in and outplayed her. Totally deserved. Maybe it's even GP fault for you, he should've expect it, right?
By the way it would be "Hypocrisy" not "Irony".
dominusx1 votesgp facetanks the entire first rotation and autoattacks misses an auto then procceds to miss an easy barrel combo and doesnt even dodge her R2 excute dmg nor her second Q3. he just missplayed and got punished.
devdev4631 votesgp facetanks the entire first rotation and autoattacks misses an auto then procceds to miss an easy barrel combo and doesnt even dodge her R2 excute dmg nor her second Q3. he just missplayed and got punished.
Not to mention gp had already used his ult on something else... And he only hit 2 out of 3 of his attempted barrels, and both of the barrels he did hit went into her shield. If he had his ult for that engagement he would have won it easy.
dominusx1 votesriven is just abroken champ. she needs to press a lot of buttons to kill you. The only balanced champ in this game is Annie and adcs
Astôlfo3 votesRiven doesn't even do it instantly anyways.
dominusx1 votesdepends on the player. i can do it in 1.2 secs other can in 0.8 others can do it with auto attacks after the flash by buffering like adrian
Ariel the Cruel3 votesDon't you compare my Kennen (support) to Riven. I want no attention brought to my instant AoE Stun chains. . .
Cowseed2 votesPeople would much rather die to point and clicks or high burst AOE than be out played actually.
Handy Sandy 1 votesIn Annie's defense, why did you group up so close that she could get a 5 man stun, or even let her get close to you in the first place.
BBQChicken Alert1 votesI think people are more salty with riven when in a lane against her, not when in teamfights.
LegitBacon661 votes
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DemoGuide1 votesIt is mobility what pisses off people the most. When you and brand see each other at the edge of vision you can just walk back. When you see riven, you can't outrun her. She will just come and wreck you hard.
Mogarl1 votesI hate all those champions more that Riven (except maybe MF who I have no strong feelings for or against). However 1 on 1 a skilled Riven can be worse than one of those champions, because while she does use her entire kit, she uses every skill in less time than any of those champions one skill lasts. The thing that bothers me though is that she's impossible to catch. Even if she does mess up Riven can usually get away if her mess up wasn't diving 1v5/4 and getting stunned.