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Why are the boards so sensitive about Sona?

Eedat··133 votes·7,630 views

Why is it that whenever you say anything about Sona you immediately get bombarded by downvotes and hateful comments from 50 DJ Sona icons? Why is it that even in the past when Sona had a 53% win rate and 7% pick rate Sona players always still insist "Sona is gutted" and "she has an extremely small player base"? Why is it that when you point out that Sona is obviously way too strong on this patch, people still insist she isn't?

Let's be honest. Sona is way overtuned on this patch. Pick your poison on which site you use, but Sona is floating around a 57% win rate across all ELOs with around a 20% pick rate now. And no, win rate isn't everything. However if you factor in her play rate quadrupled you must also agree that her average skill level has gone down. Having her average skill level go down while her win rate explodes upwards is a pretty good indicator that she is extremely strong right now.

So can we stop pretending she is still fine on this patch? Instead of sticking heads in the sand and insisting nothing is wrong, can we discuss what could be done without destroying her?

229 Comments

Marshbouy94 votes

Bc the boards is fucking stupid.

Arakadia22 votes

Its like a hivemind at times.

Jasiwel21 votes

At times? Make valid arguments against the following champions Ahri Amumu Cassiopeia Chogath Evelynn Garen Heimerdinger Nami Nasus Sona and you will be lambasted by 100 people. It doesn't matter when or where, if these champions are actually blatantly unhealthy for the game, or if they just need a little tuning - you are wrong in every case according to the Boards. Then once these champions become OP, they flood the Boards with "THIS CHAMP IS OP FK U RIOT" and find some other lukewarm champion to buzz around like some charity cause.

RedCyclone48 votes
  1. People take shit out of proportion
  2. Sona has a history of being mishandled
  3. Sona mains are really vocal about their waifu

As someone who has played mained Sona since her release in S1, i'll say she is pretty bonkers right now and needs some nerfs, I'll only be vocal about Sona if it's something totally unjustified

Kingnewgameplus29 votes

Ha... I get it... vocal.

vampirekid1314 votes

{quoted}

  1. Sona has a history of being mishandled

i dont know if riot buffed her at all in the last year, but there was a point where sona had less starting armor than a minion.

LESS STARTING ARMOR THAN A MINION.

let that sink in before imagining how frightening the idea of sona changes is

Junkο1 votes

I don't think that's possible. Minions have 0 armor and MR. You are probably thinking of when her stats were bugged so she had old stats when using the classic skin instead of the updated ones, so she was squishy AF.

Nobody11112 votes

{quoted}

I don't think that's possible. Minions have 0 armor and MR. You are probably thinking of when her stats were bugged so she had old stats when using the classic skin instead of the updated ones, so she was squishy AF.

Nah, I think I know what he is meaning but he is calling it wrong, she never had less armor the a minion, but she did have a time she had 2 more effective health then a melee minion at the time melee minion:
445 HP, 0 Armor.

which is 445 effective health.

sona had

410 HP 9 Armor

which is 446.9

thats the squishiest I can remember her which was season 1 or two? Ibeen a while

Aeolian Melodies2 votes

{quoted}

i dont know if riot buffed her at all in the last year, but there was a point where sona had less starting armor than a minion.

LESS STARTING ARMOR THAN A MINION.

let that sink in before imagining how frightening the idea of sona changes is

She has received no direct buff since her rework if I'm not mistaken.

She did not have less starting armor than a minion, she had less starting HEALTH. That was old Sona with armor+MR aura on W, they balanced her around the fact that she had it on permanently (which she did not since she had to cast other spells XD).

dunder kill41 votes

get bombarded by downvotes and hateful comments from 50 DJ Sona icons

actually chuckled a bit

Reinou34 votes

Even Meddler, someone that works for Riot said she's overpowered LOL

Daxterr5 votes

Well it's not like Rioters don't acknowledge Riot's mistakes. They've been pretty good about it except for dynamic queue.

manbearswine10 votes

{quoted}

Well it's not like Rioters don't acknowledge Riot's mistakes.

Actually they (nearly)only do so on extreme cases, or when changes are already up/heading to pbe.

Considering they are thinking about hotfixing her, it's just one of those cases.

Akali is SO HOT25 votes

The Sona circlejerk is one of the bigger circlejerks in Gameplay.

YurÌ on Ice12 votes

[{quoted}](name=Akali is SO HOT,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=u0Er0Any,comment-id=000c,timestamp=2016-07-16T06:37:10.043+0000)

The Sona circlejerk is one of the bigger circlejerks in Gameplay.

You have'n seen the old anti-Zed circle jerks or the current Anti-Azir circlejerk bandwagon.

Leetri15 votes

Or the anti-Lee Sin ones. Even when he's sub par they still wanted him to be gutted.

Junkο13 votes

He dominated and solely defined the jungle meta for 5 seasons straight. Don't think that's called "sub par".

JustMonika136 votes

[{quoted}](name=Miss Janna,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=u0Er0Any,comment-id=000c0000,timestamp=2016-07-16T08:01:06.591+0000)

You have'n seen the old anti-Zed circle jerks or the current Anti-Azir circlejerk bandwagon.

No circlejerk is bigger than the anti-Yasuo circlejerk.

The Bearded Bard22 votes

Because Sona players are a bunch of whiny brats.

Hayaishi222 votes

Hopefully Riot learns that you don't buff horrible design. Any champion that can't deal with getting buffed without becoming OP needs to stay in the gutter.

Xeruon9 votes

You're correct, dunno why you're getting downvoted.

Immortal spax6 votes

Of course, sona mains...

Xeruon9 votes

Sona mains are gaining a reputation worse than Riven mains. Is that really what you all want?

TNHA Baritone8 votes

needs to stay in the gutter.

That's why. No champion deserved to be carelessly reworked, then trashed then overtuned.

Sounds like Sona...and hmmm...Karma.

Decrit3 votes

Welp, i downvoted and i don't play that much sona. It just seems that the poster has some bias designwise and balancewise, putting up things as if those were black and white. In short it is not constructive.

Xeruon3 votes

"Not constructive" or not, he's correct. Sona isn't a well-desinged champion, and no amount of downvotes and hate comments are gonna change that.

Additionally, in Sona's case it is black and white, due to her being a very binary champion. She's either single-handedly carries the bot lane by outpoking / outhealing the enemy, due to an item and exp lead. Or she's just a stunbot in teamfights who doesn't do much else since her heal is kind of lackluster unless she's ahead.

That was until her recent buffs, where now her poke went from "if you're gonna ignore me, you're gonna have a bad time" to "oh look there goes half your health in one spell" and her heal is almost Soraka levels of absurd.

She's too much like Rengar; she becomes absolutely unplayable with some mild nerfs, but give her a buff that's bigger than +5 base AD and she's gonna be wrecking the META. She needs a complete gameplay update because her kit is outdated and like I said before; binary.

Decrit2 votes

Hey i ain't hating, just disapproving.

What you said is a bit twisted, i believe. Not because i don' t think she is like you said atm, but because i believe she potentially can be healthy even while being buffed/swapped powerwise.

Stuff like gating her targets up to a number based on ult level ia an example, even thought we can agree is not the right choice atm.

What i am saying is: she is problematic, but she can be not. Mine is a matter of potential, not of state, and regarding that her kit has potential to not be black or white.

Xeruon1 votes

If what you mean is her kind of being the "Jack of all trades, but master of none" type of champion, I can get behind that. If she can poke, heal/shield, provide stat steroids, and provide CC, but be only okay at them, I guess that would work. If you want more heal/shielding, you go Soraka/Janna, but sacrifice poke, stat steroids, and CC. If you want poke, you go Zyra, who has decent CC, godlike poke, but no steroids or healing/shielding, etc.

That and I feel she's Completely outclassed by Nami when she's not META.

Decrit2 votes

I was talking more on the lines of if they change how she develops/deploys her power she can get more balanceable and less stat checky. Mine is not a matter of meta, just of design :)

Masala Chai14 votes

Because of Pika310, Emmy Chaos, Miku Hame Sama, and co.

Penguin Eclipse3 votes

{quoted}

Because of Pika310, Emmy Chaos, Miku Hame Sama, and co.

The funny thing is that several of the most vocal sona-maximalists are the really only a few people with multiple accounts. And most of them don't even play Sona on any of their accounts.

The Yetii Rider14 votes

Sona players get upset because Riot historically has to keep Sona incredibly weak to balance out how easy she is to play.

If Sona has good numbers, everyone picks her because she's simple with a low skill floor.

So Riot constantly keeps her having BAD numbers, and that's frustrating because Sona fills a stereotypical primary utility niche. She's one of the few basic supports we have left who has lots of buffing power.

Janna is a peeler, Bard and Tahm Kench have extremely weird utility. Leona and Alistar go in. Taric is almost completely defensive.

Sona and Lulu have primarily buff skills, but Lulu has offensive skills on the same key.

Sona's power is not focused in how she can harm her enemies but how she can strengthen and empower her allies. That's just a fun type of champ to play. If she wasn't so brain dead easy we could actually enjoy her for more than one patch.

BastionKross8 votes

The pattern usually goes:

Rework => Bunch of nerfs => Extended amount of time => Repeat

I'm not a Sona main personally, but it's not difficult to see why they would have a sour reputation towards game balance. The majority of the time you see Sona in the patch notes, it's usually either a straight nerf or a buff that also comes with a nerf. And that's for the reason Yetii stated; her numbers can't be good with the kit she has/had.

But at the same time, it's not fun having your main be nerfed constantly. I think back in season 4 or 5 Sona was nerfed in seven or eight consecutive patches. And it's not like the multiple reworks have solved her "How do we give this champion a simple, supporty kit that can be given decent stats at the same time" problem. People like to meme Ryze as the champion that Riot just can't get right, but Sona isn't far behind.

Sona has become one of Riot's favorite punching bags.

Sire Hippington4 votes

has to keep Sona incredibly weak

exept that she nearly never was even close to weak, she nearly always had a 52%+ winrate with 6%+play rate in plat+ Only in the days where poke supports generally struggled due to support itemisation she didn't do all that well, though still better than her closest relative nami and still decent enough.

This is why people dislike the sona circlejerk. All eveidence points to sona beeing perfectly viable an rather on the strong side nearly all the time, yet you guys say she's kept weak and you can only enjoy her for 1 patch. Yes, she recives alot of nerfs, and yes, her numbers are kept low. But that does not mean that she's kept weak, her kit is just so strong that she needs low numbers to balance it out, and many players then few her weak as alot of the power in her kit is rather subtile. The damage from Q for allies isn't seen in the endgame stats as the tagged allies are used as source, we have no damage shielded stat and on a single target(which you usually focus on) it's not that great, but the aoe shield really ads up over the cause of a teamfight. The teamwide ms boost is massive i used right by the team, yet many players think it's a usless skill... Alot od sona's power is still hard to apreiciate(and imo that's perfectly fine) and this causes many players to precive her as weaker than she actually is.

The Yetii Rider2 votes

That argument isn't relevant to me because I'm not plat.

Sire Hippington3 votes

By the virtue of simplicity, her win rate is usually the same or higher in lower elos, and her popularity also is usually higher in those elos... Also, riot state to focus balanceing on plat+

The Yetii Rider2 votes

She's simple, but her base stats and MS are so terrible that she's really easy to kill if your positioning is bad or you get caught out, two things that happen all the time in lower elos.

And I know that Riot is going to balance around plat+, that's not going to stop me from being sensitive about the way Sona is treated, which is the goal of the thread. I'm not arguing for Sona not to get nerfed, I'm answering the question of "Why do Sona players get so butt-hurt every time Riot touches her?"

Miraweave3 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Yetii Rider,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=u0Er0Any,comment-id=00270001000000000000,timestamp=2016-07-16T17:46:00.182+0000)

She's simple, but her base stats and MS are so terrible that she's really easy to kill if your positioning is bad or you get caught out, two things that happen all the time in lower elos.

And I know that Riot is going to balance around plat+, that's not going to stop me from being sensitive about the way Sona is treated, which is the goal of the thread. I'm not arguing for Sona not to get nerfed, I'm answering the question of "Why do Sona players get so butt-hurt every time Riot touches her?"

Ok, so sona's bad if you're bad. That's applies to every champion except singed who directly scales with bad ideas.

The Yetii Rider1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Archangel Avacyn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=u0Er0Any,comment-id=002700010000000000000001,timestamp=2016-07-17T02:03:10.702+0000)

Ok, so sona's bad if you're bad. That's applies to every champion except singed who directly scales with bad ideas.

No. Sona's base health is lower than every other champion in the game except Anivia. Her base health was nerfed specifically because of her old auras that gave her armor and MR. Then after her rework her base MS was lowered so that her laning pattern of poke and retreat became harder. Specifically she's that much easier to get punished by Thresh, Leona, Blitzcrank and Braum, champions who are supposed to be weak to being poked out.

Sona has no place in the game. She has a high win rate because she scales incredibly well into the late game (and because she's overtuned right now). It's not nearly good enough to make up for how much crap you have to put up with early game because you're glass.

Penguin Eclipse2 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Yetii Rider,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=u0Er0Any,comment-id=0027000100000000000000010000,timestamp=2016-07-17T02:24:49.417+0000)

No. Sona's base health is lower than every other champion in the game except Anivia. Her base health was nerfed specifically because of her old auras that gave her armor and MR. Then after her rework her base MS was lowered so that her laning pattern of poke and retreat became harder. Specifically she's that much easier to get punished by Thresh, Leona, Blitzcrank and Braum, champions who are supposed to be weak to being poked out.

Sona has no place in the game. She has a high win rate because she scales incredibly well into the late game (and because she's overtuned right now). It's not nearly good enough to make up for how much crap you have to put up with early game because you're glass.

She has no place because of poor champion design. Her laning phase is heavily dependent on simply getting in range, pressing Q, (Powercording if applicable), and retreating. If she has a higher MS she becomes too much of a lane bully for some other supports (specifically squishy non-healers) to handle. But with a lower MS (like now) she performs rather poorly in lane because she is too easy to catch out of place. They could make her tankier, but a tankier Sona will likely lead to new problems and the solution will again be unfavorable.

Her buffed heal may actually be one of the best approaches at this point. Her risk can't be safely lowered but her ability to safely recover can be raised.

Blåbæret13 votes

Sona mains genuinely believes Sona is UP/dog tier even when she's at a 57% win rate. Pre-patch they went as far as saying that she's unplayable lol.

Shield of Targon3 votes

She's OP this patch, but she'll probably be nerfed soon. Let them have their moment.

Blåbæret5 votes

Yeah lol. I even remember mentioning Sona being picked at LCS. Got downvoted by Sona mains saying she was troll picked Nothing else and that she isn't viable in any elo. Lmao.

Weasel Kensei2 votes

{quoted}

She's OP this patch, but she'll probably be nerfed soon. Let them have their moment.

you mean their bouncing between 53-54% win rate for months now 58% win rate moment? Really long moment theyre having. She will get the Malz nerfs, that means she will go down to a 55% win rate and Rito will call it done.

FastAsHeck7 votes

I upvoted. Does that make me special?

By the way, we're so sensitive about Sona because RIOT has a habit of... mishandling her. I don't want to see her Olaf'd again.

SkyBlade796 votes

The same reason that Annie mains absolutely refuse to change anything at all about her oppressive playstyle :/

Baron Perenolde5 votes

Who says she's fine? She felt very strong to me and I'm a pretty subpar Sona.

blackfootedfox5 votes

whenever you play adc you fear her because she alone can chunk out 3/4th of your health with one ability you cant dodge

Slamurai Jack4 votes

The worst part about it is that they didn't even choose the right waifu. Sure, Sona's got the rockin tits but she simply doesn't have the personality to back them up.

On the other hand... http://static.zerochan.net/Leona.(League.of.Legends).full.1503264.jpg

Xeruon8 votes

Sona's personality is about as deep as her skillcap :^)

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