PSA: Do NOT buy lootboxes with RP

Eedat·Nov 11, 2017·317 votes·9,972 views

It is not even close to worth buying lootboxes with RP at this point. The amount of Orange and Blue Essence you get out of them has gone down drastically. The amount of Orange Essence you get for disenchanting is now half. Blue Essence from disenchanting is obviously down as well. This is a warning to just buy the skin you want instead of opting for lootboxes.

This is not thread debating "Yeah, but we get more shards from leveling!". Whether we do or do not, this isnt a thread discussing that. This is specifically for lootboxes purchased with RP. The message of this thread is simple:

Although the RP price of lootboxes has remained the same, the value of the content in those boxes has dropped by half compared to a box you bought a week ago. Until there is some form of compensation for purchasing them with RP, do not buy any.

60 Comments

Stick In MuddNov 11, 201761 votes

Riot probably should take a look at the box prices. As you said, it doesn't give as much anymore, so they should go down in cost.

ModCaptainMårvelousNov 12, 20175 votes

Also, you only get (at best) 2 things from a crate.

Maybe if your crate opened and got something like 2-3 items (with one being a guaranteed shard) it could be justified but right now you're paying 0.99 cents or so for what is basically a champion shard with an incredibly slim chance at a gemstone.

Velzard of KozNov 12, 20178 votes

They likely won't. Their worth might not have changed based on their perception. Lootboxes can now drop chest + key, additionally there is bad luck protection. Yeah it's not much from my point of view either, but they literally drastically nerfed OE from disenchanting because you get extra box every blue moon at milestones that may not even drop OE based content.

So If they actually thought the boxes from leveling are good enough reason to drop the worth of shards, they will certainly defend themself that these minor changes to lootboxes maintain their prize.

Also lootboxes were never really worth buying with RP even before. Maybe in very special cases when you lacked minor amount of OE to redeem content you got from free chests, but other than that it's overpriced since you don't instantly get the content inside but need several chests to grind OE AND you can end up getting content you could've grinded for free.

Riot's purchasable lootboxes were always scam. It's just that some people probably really love this company when they go crazy and scream "hazard" with every other company applying unfair lootboxes, but they don't mind the fact they can actually get content worth less than what they paid If it comes from someone they like.

It's been whale-bait up to this point so why should they now change it? People will still buy it, just like people pay for the over-glorified Chromas or the pathetic Emotes.

rtbf225618241Nov 13, 20172 votes

But isn't bad luck protection only for Level Up boxes? They're not the same as Hextech Chests y'know?

GentlemanGhidoraNov 13, 20173 votes

We're talking about a company charging huge amounts of $ for minimal gain, look at so much as a tiny example of chromas where people on the boards were making better quality ones in Photoshop and 3D programs in under an hour.

VexingRavenNov 12, 201728 votes

As somebody who was dumb enough to buy the 10-pack Legacy Orb which is now worth so little I can get like 2 skins out of it... FUCK YOU RIOT. And I wish I had known the orange essence value was also going down and not just BE.

RainbowIceeNov 13, 20174 votes

Not only this, but now there's less likely for skins to drop because they now share a drop chance with emotes.

DaCushNov 12, 201719 votes

Lootboxes are horrible in the first place. This is online gambling people and the odds are MASSIVELY in the houses favor.

Why do you think that every game company out there is going for this lootbox/lootcrate method? Because they are BANKING off of it. They are taking advantage of people's addictions and lack of finances. Someone doesn't have the cash to purchase expensive skins? Try your luck at a lootbox/lootcrate.

I'm sorry but in my opinion, companies should AT LEAST provide the ratios that they have given their gambling boxes for the products that pop out. You know that basic shit tier stuff has a 95% chance of coming out of those things and the valuable stuff has an extremely low chance of coming out. Hell, who knows if something was excluded from it entirely. They don't have to tell you shit.

Honestly, I have always appreciated Riot's business strategies when it came to people using real money and there is a reason why it works so well for them but I will NEVER support this rng online gambling lootbox bullshit ESPECIALLY to minors (except it's jumping through legal loopholes since lootboxes aren't classified as online gambling as far as I know).

I'm sorry but video games are going down the wrong road and getting way too greedy. Micro-transactions and DLC's are spiraling out of control and I understand that LoL is entirely based on a micro-transaction model and that's completely fine (as long as that model is fair and LoL's model has been a great standard in the past) but there is a line that you shouldn't cross and RNG lootboxes is across that line for me. Gamers need to stand up and speak out together to try and slow down this greedy bullshit and hopefully stop it down the road. If not, the game industry is going to spiral out of control and you're going to have to end up paying to reload your gun on CoD or revive yourself in LoL.

Tomoe GozenNov 12, 20173 votes

What difference would it make if you knew your chances or not? Are people still deluding themselves into thinking they have good chances, even after having a gut feeling they don't? Or they need that in official writing so that they know for sure the chances are not in their favor?

Some people are lucky and can open a box with the most expensive skin in their first go (my friend got Elementalist Lux) while i opened 40 or so boxes (just from S ranks) and have gotten only (from what i recall) Program Lissandra i actually wanted to own (i have a few more skins for her i want but i don't play her regularly). What people want depends on what's their prefered champion pool and what skins they actually want out of them.

If they have many skins, loot boxes sound like a perfect idea. Whatever they get sounds like a perfect plan to stock up on any skin cheaper than what you can buy in the store. But even Riot has said that if you want something specific, the cheapest option is to buy it directly, not from loot boxes.

When you have a mini-game of chance in any game, always assume you're getting the short end of the stick. You can get incredibly lucky and get that rare perfect thing it's advertised or you can get nothing, most of the time. So if you ever intend to buy loot boxes, buy them responsibly and in smaller quantities to make sure the money you spend on them satisfies your curiosity but doesn't end in regret from overspending.

SEKAINov 12, 201714 votes

{quoted}

I'm sorry but in my opinion, companies should AT LEAST provide the ratios that they have given their gambling boxes for the products that pop out.

As much as people so often bash on China for everything, at least they have it that game companies (or at least their branch in China) are legally required to show the odds of lootboxes. And we could use that too.

Tesla EffectNov 13, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Lootboxes are horrible in the first place. This is online gambling people and the odds are MASSIVELY in the houses favor.

Why do you think that every game company out there is going for this lootbox/lootcrate method? Because they are BANKING off of it. They are taking advantage of people's addictions and lack of finances. Someone doesn't have the cash to purchase expensive skins? Try your luck at a lootbox/lootcrate.

I'm sorry but in my opinion, companies should AT LEAST provide the ratios that they have given their gambling boxes for the products that pop out. You know that basic shit tier stuff has a 95% chance of coming out of those things and the valuable stuff has an extremely low chance of coming out. Hell, who knows if something was excluded from it entirely. They don't have to tell you shit.

Honestly, I have always appreciated Riot's business strategies when it came to people using real money and there is a reason why it works so well for them but I will NEVER support this rng online gambling lootbox bullshit ESPECIALLY to minors (except it's jumping through legal loopholes since lootboxes aren't classified as online gambling as far as I know).

I'm sorry but video games are going down the wrong road and getting way too greedy. Micro-transactions and DLC's are spiraling out of control and I understand that LoL is entirely based on a micro-transaction model and that's completely fine (as long as that model is fair and LoL's model has been a great standard in the past) but there is a line that you shouldn't cross and RNG lootboxes is across that line for me. Gamers need to stand up and speak out together to try and slow down this greedy bullshit and hopefully stop it down the road. If not, the game industry is going to spiral out of control and you're going to have to end up paying to reload your gun on CoD or revive yourself in LoL.

Preach it, my intellectual brother!

ŚhunpoNov 13, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Lootboxes are horrible in the first place. This is online gambling people and the odds are MASSIVELY in the houses favor.

Why do you think that every game company out there is going for this lootbox/lootcrate method? Because they are BANKING off of it. They are taking advantage of people's addictions and lack of finances. Someone doesn't have the cash to purchase expensive skins? Try your luck at a lootbox/lootcrate.

I'm sorry but in my opinion, companies should AT LEAST provide the ratios that they have given their gambling boxes for the products that pop out. You know that basic shit tier stuff has a 95% chance of coming out of those things and the valuable stuff has an extremely low chance of coming out. Hell, who knows if something was excluded from it entirely. They don't have to tell you shit.

Honestly, I have always appreciated Riot's business strategies when it came to people using real money and there is a reason why it works so well for them but I will NEVER support this rng online gambling lootbox bullshit ESPECIALLY to minors (except it's jumping through legal loopholes since lootboxes aren't classified as online gambling as far as I know).

I'm sorry but video games are going down the wrong road and getting way too greedy. Micro-transactions and DLC's are spiraling out of control and I understand that LoL is entirely based on a micro-transaction model and that's completely fine (as long as that model is fair and LoL's model has been a great standard in the past) but there is a line that you shouldn't cross and RNG lootboxes is across that line for me. Gamers need to stand up and speak out together to try and slow down this greedy bullshit and hopefully stop it down the road. If not, the game industry is going to spiral out of control and you're going to have to end up paying to reload your gun on CoD or revive yourself in LoL.

I mean....Overwatch is pretty fair in the way it goes about loot boxes. You get 5 items (off the top of my head) and even if they're all sprays they go towards unlocking everything in the game. Duplicates also hardly ever occur now ever since the changes awhile ago. Oh oh, and here's the best part.....you get actual content and not shards AND you can open the chest straight away!

Oh, and you know that essence you have? It's worth jack shit unless you're blessed with good RNG and get a skin shard you like. You can't actually directly buy skins with orange essence! What a laughing stock.

SkeletalLampingNov 17, 20171 votes

There is nothing wrong with trading money for a product that you know you are receiving. It's called commerce. There is also nothing wrong with betting real money on an unforeseeable event, it's called gambling.

However, in most places you need to be an adult (in the US the age is 18) in order to be able to make the decision to gamble. You need to be old enough to understand that what you are receiving is likely not worth the amount of REAL MONEY that you are putting in.

I'll forego all of the grandstanding I want to do and just urge players not to get suckered. The only way any of this will change (undoubtedly in the favor of players) is if enough people stop falling for it and these companies stop making all of the money in the goddamn world.

Weiss GuertenaNov 12, 201713 votes

Sadly for every one player who sees through this scam, thousands will still buy boxes. And since wallets speak louder than words, Riot will keep on with this atrocity.

"But it's OK because you get more sources of orange essence" My ass you do. What, one extra shard every milestone level? Boxes giving less champion shards but getting saturated with useless emotes instead? Riot straight out lied on this one.

RapidtrapNov 15, 20171 votes

the thing is you dont get skin shards from lvl up. soo i didnt see why they lowerd OE

Weiss GuertenaNov 15, 20171 votes

Exactly. Supposed extra sources of orange essence are far too scarce to compensate for massive loss in shard disenchanting. Anyone who can do basic math can see that buying chests is simply not worth it anymore; if you want to spend some RP you get better value of your money when buying specific items rather than gambling. And higher effective value in exchange for randomness is what makes this kind of gambling enticing; take the extra value away and there is no point in it.

Now let's just hope that people who can do basic math outnumber people with severe gambling addiction here, or we are all boned. Tho I'm really skeptical about that, as evidenced in my first post.

RozzetaNov 12, 201711 votes

No to mention you can now get emotes from those things. By far the most useless addition to the game.

LichKing234Nov 12, 20176 votes

Emotes should cost blue essences and 100 at the most not fucking rp i wouldnt mind buying them if they didnt cost rp

VexingRavenNov 13, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Emotes should cost blue essences and 100 at the most not fucking rp i wouldnt mind buying them if they didnt cost rp

I mean, if ward skins, which are almost never even noticed, can cost OE, then emotes can too. Which is fine, as long as emotes dropping don't reduce your OE output compared to before.

RozzetaNov 13, 20175 votes

I just opened a hextech box, and got an emote. It activated itself right away, without giving me the change to dismantle it for OE or BE. Since I don't care about emotes, i won nothing from that box.

Biscuit BiteNov 12, 20179 votes

[slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

PaladinNONov 12, 20179 votes

Do NOT buy lootboxes with RP

I can vouch for this one.

I bought the 10+1x bundle around Worlds, and the content was barely worth the 1950 RP cost. I was even refused the 55 Worlds tokens from it, because I bought it a week too early - Support said the date for the included tokens was all communicated in a thread made a month+ earlier. Who even remembers such things? It's not like they would've gone bankrupt over those free, digital tokens. Talk about being cheap... :|

Coral Reef Malphite

Karma
Hextech Janna
Lord Darius
Alistar
Bouquet ward
Katarina
Lee Sin
Forsaken Olaf
Viking Tryndamere
Bloodfury Renekton

Add to the free Worlds orb contained Explorer Ezreal, and I wish their own regulations even covered gambling.

So best just spend money elsewhere.

Downvoted? Okay, I got better things to spend money on anyway. https://www.fenix-store.com/fenix-tk76-led-flashlight/ https://www.fenix-store.com/fenix-tk75-led-flashlight-2018-edition-5100-lumens/ 2x https://www.fenix-store.com/fenix-pd35-led-flashlight-960-lumens/ 2x http://www.fenixlight.com/ProductMore.aspx?id=26&tid=8&cid=1

Much, MUCH better value than the ~150.000 RP I could have bought with that money.

Mysticman89Nov 11, 20176 votes

Officially the orange essence for disenchanting changed from 33% to 20%, so if it's actually half its more likely a bug. Suspect it's not literally half though and saying whatever that actual ratio is is a pain.

Also worth noting theres bad luck protection of hextech crates now, so you're assured a skin shard/gemstone within X crates (don't remember the number off the top of my head).

Neither of those things should be taken as disagreeing that the value of hextech crates has gone down, but those are both things to at least be aware of if we're talking about crate value.

Fisher No ChainsNov 12, 201727 votes

Why should I pay to get 195 essence from a 975RP skin shard?

The bad luck protection argument makes no sense imo. That stuff is REQUIRED in the current system since you need like 6 shards to unlock a 975RP skin now, whereas before you needed half that amount.

PsybicilinNov 12, 20176 votes

I think Riot should have champion loot boxes and skin loot boxes, and have them drop a permanent shard (if it's a skin, it should be one you own). They can raise the price of them to compensate, but I think this system would be a lot fairer. I guess people still buy the crates, because they haven't changed them at all, so who knows lol. People like wasting money I guess.[slayer-jinx-unamused]

Comic SanslerNov 12, 20176 votes

Very surprised the first response wasn't a downvoted-to-hell defense of shitty business practices.

JanakinNov 12, 20176 votes

This pisses me off so incredibly much. Like, how the hell can't developers of the most played game in the world do this high school level math? Or these runes ... like ... I am absolutely sure a talented, creative high school student would be able to make them WAY better if he worked solo. I know it is not easy, I am programmer with 5 years experience, 3 years out of it focused on game programming. But damn it, you can't be serious with all of this. This is just terribly designed and calculated. Please Riot, I beg you, do the math. It is beautiful.

VexingRavenNov 13, 20173 votes

{quoted}

This pisses me off so incredibly much. Like, how the hell can't developers of the most played game in the world do this high school level math? Or these runes ... like ... I am absolutely sure a talented, creative high school student would be able to make them WAY better if he worked solo. I know it is not easy, I am programmer with 5 years experience, 3 years out of it focused on game programming. But damn it, you can't be serious with all of this. This is just terribly designed and calculated. Please Riot, I beg you, do the math. It is beautiful.

They can do the math. Why do you think they made this change? Riot's PR department may be great at spinning things, but you can be sure that the people actually in charge of this stuff did the math, and this is exactly what they intended.

I nid a leeschNov 13, 20172 votes

What they "intended" was using their well known strategy. Make X champion OP people buy X skins then after sales drop they finally "realise" their mistake and nerf em, ye right. It's always been the same, every newly realised champion was super broken and then few patches later nerfed. People need to open their eyes, look at Ornn the only champ that was weak at release and now he's getting buff after buff after buff. I wonder wattle happen i'm pretty sure they dont want people to buy his skin and then nerf him a few patches later. :)

ENRAG3DCHICKENNov 12, 20176 votes

If only I had a time machine. I could have received this PSA so I never bought any hextech type chest ever.

#WalletDevalued

ThilmerNov 12, 20175 votes

To be fair, buying lootboxes with RP was already stupid before, since it's always better to just buy the skin you want with those RP.

ENRAG3DCHICKENNov 12, 20172 votes

its the stupidity tax. Instead of owning skins these people spent RP's on devalued skin shards.

Amumu

Shuriman CuratorNov 12, 20175 votes

I wont be spending anymore money at all on this game LUL

WrÆthNov 12, 20175 votes

I'm not buying anything anymore. Not going to support a company that's going to completely fuck us over with blue essence like they did. If they thought they were going to make more money with this stupid blue essence shit, they were wrong. I had trusted them to not fuck up the blue essence change, but I guess I put a little too much faith in them.

EnchantéNov 12, 20174 votes

"lootboxes" the first thing I thought is Overwatch

"Wait what since when can we by lootboxes with RP?"

LOL I'm in the wrong game

TPA Jason123Nov 12, 20174 votes

I think Riot should just lower the price of Hextech Chests now

Biscuit BiteNov 12, 20174 votes

This is riot now.

https://i.imgur.com/RsI9t.gif?noredirect

xelakerNov 12, 20174 votes

it's never worth rp. buy skins if you want, that's fine. but please dont give riot money for these scam boxes

SirΤeemοNov 12, 20173 votes

i have skin shards worth 23k orange essences , i need 65-70 legendary skins disenchants to make all these skins permanent ...

LeonerdoNov 12, 20173 votes

To make up for essence drop rate changes, we'll tune the way loot boxes work to increase the amount of skins you'll get from them. We'll also add "bad luck protection," so you won't ever go on long streaks without getting a skin shard or a gemstone from chests.

-- Source

So you're supposed to get more shards per chest, to balance the decrease in per-shard value. I await proof that this is not the case (preferably screenshots of 10+ loot box openings).

C9 Scott Free Nov 12, 20173 votes

I've always been anti investing in RNG

I nid a leeschNov 13, 20173 votes

Damn boy, straight to the point.

Acheron16Nov 13, 20173 votes

{quoted}

It is not even close to worth buying lootboxes with RP at this point. The amount of Orange and Blue Essence you get out of them has gone down drastically. The amount of Orange Essence you get for disenchanting is now half.

A third. Skins now give a third of their total value in Orange Essence.

Riot doesn't even try to hide that they're copying from Overwatch, down to the shitty skin value.

when yourNov 13, 20173 votes

Didn't you see the BS answer Cactopus wrote in another topic? Apparently it affects their revenue and the changes in runes have put in work too even though runes were mostly bought with IP, RP was just another option and I believe majority of the community didn't spend RP on runes just like that. It's whatever though, it isn't worth anymore and Riot will see it themselves later on when they work with numbers and data.

Tesla EffectNov 13, 20172 votes

Thank you for this thread. Hopefully more people will see this and stop supporting horrible business decisions.

KloqdqNov 13, 20172 votes

The only time they were ever worth anything was when you could get those special ones that costed roughly the same but gave you like 3 items. Now those aren't even worth it to be completely honest. Just reroll. You'll have a better chance at getting something cool than you'd every be able to with the OE you gain now.

Terrible system and no one should support it.

ForFoxSakesNov 13, 20172 votes

2/3 of my last boxes gave me shit level emotes. I hate the entire emote system and those boxes basically gave me nothing of value, cant even DE them. Reduced DE value on top kills crafting for me

Tohtori SykeröNov 13, 20171 votes

Saddest part is that I have 10k orange essence and nothing to spend it on. From my last chests, I've gotten champion shards and ward skins (that im not using orange essence on). My orange essence is just sitting here doing absolutely nothing because I'm not buying boxes with RP.

MonkeyMadnessNov 15, 20171 votes

Except you can still reroll those skin shards for a random skin, so there's that...Also consider the fact that Riot announced that drop rate for skin shards has increased so there's that...Also Riot said they will make sure you don't go a long stretch without getting a gemstone so there's that...But no, ignore these points, as they clearly oppose your narrative...

darnar360Dec 6, 20171 votes

Well they will all take a hit as soon as the gambling commission decides loot boxes are gambling and well I expect gaming companies to fork over a good chunk of cash in compesation for letting minors gamble but hey when in rome you don't gamble