If he uses it there should be a window of opportunity to fight him. Instead 6 seconds later he is using it again and it does a ton of damage. A while ago I made a post about certain op things on certain champions. I laughed when they said garen was immobile so he would keep his silence, or fizz has a long cooldown on his moves. I don't understand how the balence team thinks. It litteraly makes no sense sometimes
Azazelhellfire24 votesLet me guess, you got owned by a fizz in your last game
http://i.imgur.com/j3dMAML.png[/img]
You would've never created this thread if he was on your team.
Stop crying about a champion just because you got owned by an higher skill player.
morris11 votesThat build looks so tempting...
Endogenic13 votesyou main Diana and you're complaining about Fizz? lmfao this thread is such a joke
Rozair5 votesDiana has way more counterplay than fizz.. Dodge her q. Countered
Ginjavitis5 votesDiana has way more counterplay than fizz.. Dodge her q. Countered
I'm sorry, but since you play Diana, your telling me that she has counterplay means nothing. Also, you said that her counter play is dodging the Q, well at max rank is has a base CD of 6 seconds, and according to lolking the second most built item on her is nashors. Now 6 seconds x .8= 4.8 seconds, that means that i have 5 seconds of counter play to kill a champion who's only counter play is a ranged poke that she can just throw out and walk away if it misses? Fizz has an 8 second CD on a damaging ability that has to put him in melee range in order for him to kill someone. Lets continue to compare them since apparently fizz isn't allowed to have mobility, damage rediction, and burst. 1) diana has a double dash, not only that but it's on a 0.0 CD when done right, on top of that she has a hard CC that pulls you back into her and slows you, not only does she have mobility, she has anti-mobility on a non-ultimate. 2) Damage reduction. Diana has a shield that scales with AP that, at max level, blocks 200+.6 AP. Fizz gets 14 reduced damage on AAs....not even going to justify this with a comparison of numbers. 3) Burst--They're both assassins, they both have burst, simple enough, and then you should think about how Diana can hit everyone equally, but for a fizz that's not fed but in a normal state, he has to hit his ult to get his levels of assassination damage, and that will only be on one person.
Celeste Benal2 votesComparing Fizz's E to Diana's Q is preposterous. Diana gets damage and a 0 CD on her R if she uses it to jump to the debuffed target, assuming she hit the skillshot to begin with. Fizz gets a gap-closer/escape, invulnerability, tons of aoe damage, and even a slow if he doesn't reactivate, all on one ability.
Then there's his Q dash and his massive on-hit magic damage from W (which is a % missing HP modifier on top of the base+scaling AP damage), and his damage amplification from his R, if he hits that.
Also, Diana's E is not hard CC. Its an extremely short-ranged displacement ability with a soft CC tagged on the end because otherwise it would be total trash. Not to mention the ridiculously long cooldown.
Ginjavitis2 votes[{quoted}](name=Celeste Benal,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=twRG8yAW,comment-id=0002000000000000,timestamp=2016-01-06T18:31:34.183+0000)
Comparing Fizz's E to Diana's Q is preposterous. Diana gets damage and a 0 CD on her R if she uses it to jump to the debuffed target, assuming she hit the skillshot to begin with. Fizz gets a gap-closer/escape, invulnerability, tons of aoe damage, and even a slow if he doesn't reactivate, all on one ability.
Then there's his Q dash and his massive on-hit magic damage from W (which is a % missing HP modifier on top of the base+scaling AP damage), and his damage amplification from his R, if he hits that.
Also, Diana's E is not hard CC. Its an extremely short-ranged displacement ability with a soft CC tagged on the end because otherwise it would be total trash. Not to mention the ridiculously long cooldown.
You all say he gets that on his e, but the truth is he only gets a few of them depending on what he's doing. Attacking-damage/gap closer, running away-escape (he's not going to damage you when running away unless you're dumb enough to flash into it. Yes it CAN be all of those things, but not at the same time.
Massive damage? No, massive DoT, decent on hit damage. Want to talk about massive on hit damage, let's talk about Diana's manaless on hit damage with a 250 base, 80% ratio AOE on hit damage. Fizz doesn't get to that level with all of his abilities active, and if you want to talk about lichbane to "disprove me" then we'll give that to Diana and she gets that damage too
Now the E, this is where I laughed, please learn what hard cc is before you play this game anymore. Hard cc impairs movement, prevents channels, and may prevent autoattacks, now tell me can you flash out of my "displacement?" Didn't think so. Fizz's ult must be a simple upward displacement to you I guess. Condescension aside, I was replying to a statement said by the op about how the counter play to Diana was to dodge q.
SH Azykan9 votesI find it funny that you main Diana and are complaining about legit the easiest matchup in the entire game for you other than Katarina...Diana destroys Fizz at every point in the game. Also "Dodge her Q" Which is one of the most awkward skillshots in the game to dodge unless you play her...and she still has fall back in her shield and just walking away if she misses. Fizz goes in, and his only way back out is his E. If he saves it for an escape he loses a lot of his damage.
-Fizz and Diana player
MasterSomething9 votesNeither does your spelling. Honestly Fizz E is on such a high cooldown early game it feels like a chore waiting for it. Early game and his shitty waveclear is his defined weakness. And Garen is immobile. He has one speed up, and that is it. No dashes, no blinks, no jumps, just a speed up.
Rozair4 votesYou must play fizz. Yes early game it's kinda high but considering it makes him invisible and can jump over freaking walls and goes as far as 2 flashes it's way too low. I think they either need to lower the damage or increase the cooldown
MasterSomething11 votesYes I play Fizz, I am trying to learn him at least. His E gets lowered because he builds CDR items. I also didn't know it makes him invisible, kappa. He is currently in a balanced state, as much as it hurts me to say that statement. The cooldown is fine early, and it makes sense late because it is maxed by then and gets reduced by CDR. The damage has been nerfed many times, and it's his only hope at any waveclear without burning his ult, so reducing the damage is not an option either. Remember, this is Fizz's only way out of any deadly situation. Like any assassin, if you stun him once, he is dead.
Rozair3 votesI don't think he's in a balanced state at all. He has too much in his kit. 20% damage bonus and reduced damage from basic attacks. It's all too,much.
Rozair4 votesHe majority of mid champion gave a ranges skill shot stun he can dodge with his e so yes it's not fair
Fisherman Fízz4 votesHe majority of mid champion gave a ranges skill shot stun he can dodge with his e so yes it's not fair
How about you learn the matchup vs Fizz instead of complaining about him, His E in the laning phase has a long cooldown, even if he max it first, it will still be around 7 seconds at level 9. And also if he max his E first, most of the burst will come from that ability, so if you dodge it or he uses it to clear minions you can easily trade with him.
Yosuke Apperu1 votesHave you ever faced a leblanc? XD
Jbels11 votesI don't think he's in a balanced state at all. He has too much in his kit. 20% damage bonus and reduced damage from basic attacks. It's all too,much.
Except this preseason and even last season he's suffered nerf after nerf. You're complaining that an assassin is doing his job. Killing people and getting out. Fizz is actually a lot weaker than he used to be before, and telling someone who defends the champion you're bashing "Oh, you must be a "X champion" main" Is so totally immature it's not even funny. They are presenting their case for why the champion isn't broken, and you're whining that they don't have an argument because...they play the champion? That makes total sense. You might as well have said "Everyone here who hasn't played Fizz come to this thread and bitch about him with me!"
Penns1 votesIm a Fizz "main" and I gotta say, his wave clear isnt bad, at least when he isnt behind (
E + 3 auto attacks on melee minions is usually enough to clear a wave early- mid game). Of course its not ranged but its still pretty good.
MasterSomething1 votesThanks for the tip, will try that soon.
RISE Shlack1232 votesWell, the thing about early game is that there are very few champions who can burst Fizz down while his E is on cooldown. And a good Fizz will keep his E in his pocket until a champion tries to use their combo. And if he uses it to dodge your snare or CC, he can just reactivate it to go all-in. Fizz has a good amount of damage early game, and if a good Fizz uses their E at the right time, you can easily kill someone at lvl 3.
And his waveclear isn't that bad, either.
MasterSomething1 votesYea, I need to get better at Fizz. Still learning him. It's just so hard to bait those damn stuns >.<
Yosuke Apperu2 votesLet's play sometime mate! :) I'm always up for practicing whether it be 1v1s or playing some normals.
Eedat8 votesFizz is fine right now tbh. Sure he has his troll poll, but has suffered nerf after nerf after nerf to his damage over the past year or so. His E has a very high cooldown early and something you aren't addressing is it has a very high mana cost. Its mana cost is more than most champions' ults. You don't get to just spam it whenever you want in lane.
Yosuke Apperu7 votesFizz's E starts at a 16 second cooldown and costs him 90 of his (if you get that ability first at level 1) 317 mana. By level 18 he only has 946 mana(without mana items/runes/masteries) and his E is costing him 130 mana. It goes down to a six second cooldown from 8 seconds by buying cdr. If he's using his E as much as you make it seem he should constantly be being oom and you should constantly be forcing him back to base. Also if you really are a Diana main you shouldn't be losing to a fizz... especially after all the times that fizz took nerfs to the face(whether it be through champion or itemization). It's okay to complain.. but make it a valid complaint.. if fizz goes in on E he loses a lot of his escape potential, if he escapes with E he loses a lot of damage.. actually besides his ulti his E is his strongest ability that he sacrifices to get away from you.
VaguelyRoyal1 votesdude. im not one to judge but he has an ult as his e now. a new champion named xayah sure youve heard of her has the same thing as his ult be untargetable and be able to move and when you land or when it casts it deals damage funny thing is fizz does more damage than her lol. i love fizz i main him its funny to see people complain about his kit cause they suck but i kinda started feeling iffy when i heard a couple of challengers talking about it.
slippykitten5 votesExcept he needs to at least sorta be balanced for high end play, where 6 seconds is an eternity (also not the actual cd, but w/e)
Fizz is melee and all his abilities require him to be in melee range, without his pole up, he cannot engage in a team fight whatsoever without being killed. In a team fight where the enemy team is moderately competent, 6 seconds is plenty to obliterate a fizz.
Fizz basically has two choices in team fight stage, die, or back WAYYYY out of the fight after one spell rotation. His only hope is that after the fight, there are a few low hp enemies to clean up.
Your problem is you want to fight him like a mage when hes an assassin. You're not gonna 1v1 him, but you sure can burn him down easy when he burns his cd's. And if you can't burn him down in 6 seconds, giving his pole an extra 2 second cd probably wont help you much.
Enrovy5 votesFizz is pretty balanced, I play him for his voice.
Fizz Wukong5 votesFizz doesn't build health, armor or magic resist. Even if he builds 
at level 18 his damage resistance is still under 30%
With that said, this post implies that you want 
to become a melee version of 
?
Why not complain about 
she's way more OP than Fizz, with way more burst in her human/spider Q, hard CC in human form and superb sustain in spider form and becomes manaless, has an untargetable and also has mini minions (her spiderlings) that can block skills shots.
both have their jumps. 
has blink.
unless you're going to sacrifice full build for a ward slot?
how about we increase the CD on his shrooms while we're at it.
on an 6 sec CD (normally runs 40% CDR in 
)
But of all champs, you want to pick on Fizz... why man?
Endogenic5 votes[{quoted}](name=Fizz Wukong,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=twRG8yAW,comment-id=000f,timestamp=2016-01-07T01:57:48.328+0000)
But of all champs, you want to pick on Fizz... why man?
the original poster is literally gold 5, zero LP. He knows and understands little more than someone in bronze and silver. A person doesn't truly begin to have a real grasp on the game until they get into high elo.
Even so, there are plenty of high elos who got to where they are by having good mechanics as opposed to having game knowledge.
Also, the original poster probably recently got smashed by a champion that snowballed the game. Instead of complaining to his team for playing poorly, he decided to come onto the boards to get fellow low elo people to circlejerk him.
edit: yep I was right lmao
Fisherman Fízz3 votesIf he uses it there should be a window of opportunity to fight him. Instead 6 seconds later he is using it again and it does a ton of damage. A while ago I made a post about certain op things on certain champions. I laughed when they said garen was immobile so he would keep his silence, or fizz has a long cooldown on his moves. I don't understand how the balence team thinks. It litteraly makes no sense sometimes
Fizz doesn't need nerfs, there are champions that can do his job better right now.
If I were to change anything on Fizz to make him less annoying, id change his E since It's what I see most people complain about him, so instead of being untargetable, he gets damage reduction while in his pole like 50% damage reduction or something.
LordOfTheLeague2 votesI actually think it's the opposite way, even if he is an assassin, he should deals less damage without his ultimate while being mobile and have access to evasion with his E.
He can more or less one shot a carry with his WEQ combo later in the game.
I actually think his E should have a lower cd even early game, cost less mana but should not deals any damage, just slow.
That would make him more playable early game and less frustrating during the game.
Rozair1 votesI like this idea
Fızz1 votesyes because fizz starts at minute 1 with full item... you can't kill someone with just rwq you need the damage of e (unless you'r fed and you are late game, but you can't be fed without e)
if you want to do that, than you should buff w and q cz he is losing his primary source of damage
Azazelhellfire7 votesI actually think it's the opposite way, even if he is an assassin, he should deals less damage without his ultimate while being mobile and have access to evasion with his E.
He can more or less one shot a carry with his WEQ combo later in the game.
I actually think his E should have a lower cd even early game, cost less mana but should not deals any damage, just slow.
That would make him more playable early game and less frustrating during the game.
His E is like half his burst damage...
LordForrest2 voteshe should deals less damage without his ultimate
You realize they did this already, it you use to be much, much worse. Then they nerfed the damage on all of his basic spells, nerfed his core item and change his ult to grant a damage amp so he needed his ult to do his assassination combo, instead of the 1 or 2 Q and a couple of empowered autos from his w.
Fizz is honestly one of the least annoying assassins that are played at the moment. Because if he falls behind, he is pretty much useless against a competent team.
Dracocrash2 votesyou main diana? and you're complaining about fizz? LMFAO
AL0001 votesof course he is very strong against non-cc champions...
Fızz1 votesa good fizz know how to dodge a cc unless he's playing vs players who can communicate with each other and coordinate
A Latte Deaths1 votesIt isn't as though he's like that the entire game. Late game at full build? Sure. Early game? No freaking way.
Early game he just can't afford to spam his E due to its high cooldown and incredibly high mana cost. Even with blue buff I doubt he could spam it without going OoM quickly.
Spoofghoul1 votes
Sure like it will take that long before he gets to his hurr durr troll pole everysecond state
Sozan51 votesMeh, I think the only problem there is with Fizz is his combo with Pole -> Zhonya -> Pole again - but that's a problem with Zhonya rather than Fizz himself.
I believe that Zhonya should freeze cooldowns as well... Alas, right now any more nerfs to mages could be catastrophical, so perhaps some time later (or accompanied with some buffs).
LiziLOL1 votesagree with you op, make his E like yi meditate level cd and should not be affected by cdr, and then you can give him his damage back for compensation, one shot suicide fizz is better than unkillable fizz
Simple Moon1 votesIt seems reasonable and I'm not a huge fan of fizz. But that is where counters can come into play. Have someone with a knock up (Vel'Koz) for example. Wait for him to dodge an ability and place it right under his feet where he lands. Done it plenty of times before and it works. Once he is knocked into the air I land a Q possibly a W and finish it with my ult. All in that time he has no way to escape because he just used his trickster.
TheDiff1 votesThe CD on his E is pretty damn high till he maxes it. It's on like a 13ish second cd rank 1. and around a 8 second CD rank 5.
Endogenic2 votesThe CD on his E is pretty damn high till he maxes it. It's on like a 13ish second cd rank 1. and around a 8 second CD rank 5.
I didn't really remember so I looked it up, but it's 16 seconds so yeah it's pretty high
TheDiff2 votesYeah, I was low balling the cool downs. A 16 second CD at rank 1 is freakin' crazy! If you can't captilize on CD's that is your fault, not the champions.
Ethereal3111 votesThe man criticism I have with Fizz is his ability to E-Zhonya and then E very soon afterwards since it goes down to 4.4 seconds with 40% and that cunning mastery. Increasing the cd to 18-10 from 18-8 is all he needs really to put him in a better spot.
MunchCrunchLunch1 votes75% ap scaling is a lot for an escape ability.
