Tired of hypocrites, I want to ask support mains one question.

Hallbuster··1 votes·812 views

I spend a good team reading the boards and have seen a consensus, supports have the smallest impact on the game. I've heard everything from a Leona who claimed she was the second most important role because she set up the engages and picked off poorly positioned enemies.

So just answer one simple question.

Can you actually carry more than 90 percent of your games? If the answer is no, why do I keep getting down voted for saying the truth, that support mains can't always carry the game by themselves. That it's the hardest role to climb with, and generally, the role nobody wants! I'm not speaking out The other end, I had a friend who maimed support, Elisabet, who started playing support since season 3 all the way to season 7. Since then she's moved from bronze 5 to bronze 2. After taking a break from normals, I climbed from bronze 3 to 1 in less than 20 games playing Vladimir, when it took her what, 200?

51 Comments

Sir Yamazuki9 votes

You won't carry 90% of the time in another role either. You only 'carry' that often when you out skill your tier. I can win a majority of games from bronze up to plat 5 even as a support, as I'm not good enough to carry through plat unfortunately. I've won games even with unconventional supports, and even lane swapped where I 1v2ed as Garen against a Lucian+Braum while winning.

The issue with supports is the idea of "carrying", the idea of 1v5ing and winning. If you want to win as a non-mage support start by actually supporting your team hard enough to get them an advantage. A lot of supports play rather selfishly even if they're Janna. You don't have to be very good individually, I personally don't see myself as mechanically skilled, but I just play around my team as often as I can.

Çhåryzård6 votes

The reason people think supports can't carry is because they don't know what a support carrying looks like and don't recognize it when it's happening

chipndip12 votes

This

CannonLordFreed5 votes

Tired of the bitching, I want to ask Hallbuster one question.

I spend way too much time on your threads and I've seen a consensus, you are kind of an asshole. I've heard everything from ADCs should be able to pick a supports champ to supports are the most useless role.

So I will just ask you one thing:

Who hurt you? What is so wrong with your life that you feel like it's okay to come onto boards and berate people who are trying to play and enjoy the game? Why do you think it's fine if you act like an ass to people who play the game, try and enjoy the game, and if they're playing their role properly, are actively trying to help you? The thought process makes absolutely zero sense to me.

Hallbuster1 votes

In the past, I always played support to try and climb. That's 200 ranked games wasted for nothing until I started playing actual carries such as Annie and Vladimir.

Now the issue with the present, my normal MMR fell because I got last pick in blind pick. If I didn't carry every other lane wouldwould feed and there would be absolutely nothing I could do. There 2 good reasons.

Paquay1 votes

You suck at support; ergo the support role is the most useless role? lulz

Hallbuster1 votes

There has to be a role that had far less impact. If you want to ask me what I consider the most important roles to the least. It would be ADC --> Mid --> Top --> Jungle --> Support.

MohawkBird4 votes

[deleted]

Lyndris1 votes

depending on the comp, the order could be anything, nothing like a good ol' protect the raka comp. But i agree Jungle 4? dah hell?

ImTheSideKick2 votes

in this meta? ha... try jungle > support > mid > top > adc least till late game and then its still support > jungle > adc > mid > top

wards and unwarding are key to winning. not to mention keeping your team alive. naw bro. supports are top tier. ADC mains get the glory but in truth they only succeed because of their support

Paquay3 votes

Wait a second. So you think that the role responsible for keeping the most important role safe and alive is the least impactful? Also, jungle the 4th most important in this early game meta of constant ganks?

I've changed my opinion of you. You're not a shitposting troll. You're just straight up delusional.

CannonLordFreed3 votes

That wasn't my question. I asked why you felt it was okay to be rude to people just because they played support. Or are you just an actual dick who's rude to everyone?

Hallbuster1 votes

Surely opinions cannot be that offensive.

Ralanr1 votes

You're incorrect by a longshot.

chipndip11 votes

Alex Jones thinks Sandy Hook was a scam...so they can be offensive...

The Fuzzy 0ne2 votes

maybe your playstyle is just better suited for carries then... it took me 200 games last season to get from b5 to g5 and maybe 100 games to get from s5 to g5 this season only playing support

Hallbuster1 votes

That is fast :/.

Killed Inaction2 votes

Your friend is playing poorly, I would assume. I'm a support main, and I placed into Gold V this season, and while it's true I haven't moved up, I think that says something to the person who is playing a "carry" but is still Bronze I, yes?

Also, it's as NGNL Asian said, most of us play support because we like the role. I can turn the tides of a teamfight as support, which is more than I can say when I'm the ADC who gets bursted down in .3 seconds due to not having a good support to peel.

Sir Fuzzi2 votes

Every role is useless alone, numbnuts. Supports are mad because a great carry can deal with a shitty support, but a great support is pretty much bunk if their carry is garbage, which earns them smack talk too. Besides that, most people who snap at supports are just trying to pawn off their own garbage plays. That's pretty much why anyone talks hard shit in League-- to try and make someone else look worse.

Also, who cares about someone else's progress? So they're not a great player, or bad in competitive situations, or picking the wrong role, or don't play the game all the time, or a million other reasons. Your progress is the only relevant progress to your stance, since if support was so easy you'd go do it your damn self.

The job's rewarding, not easy. And you-- people like you, who just have to make it about what someone's doing wrong every single time-- you take even that away from supports, so they're just item backpacks for thankless ingrates who refuse to admit to their own mistakes (and God knows you make them). Sure, it's 'stand in the back' or 'peel for your carry' and 'nothing else.'

But, you know, support can't do a god damn thing if their carry is ass. They can try all they want but a bad carry is an easy target and an enemy with some braincells will pretty much exploit it to hell. Asking JG to babysit just gives their JG free reign on 'literally anything but bot lane' and once you start favouring a lane, an enemy with any braincells will pretty much exploit that weakness to the max. (Mid stalls for ganks, top pushes to grab jg attention, bot plays defensive) Meanwhile, a crappy support will just end up making a good carry have to play careful and the JG will have to set one or two good pushes up, which I admit would be garbage if the JG wasn't a pick conducive to that. Even still, support holds so little influence that even when it's good, even when it's great, it's still really only as good-- or maybe a little better-- than their carry. They can't do things alone, and most supports that build mage are just sitting ducks under CC, while most support tanks can't ramp quickly enough-- Nautilus might pull it off though-- to start making up for the damage lost by an easy target of an ADC.

You don't understand that the road goes two ways. The moment you start sucking, we have to be on fleek with the perfect picks or we're just as badly off because the picks can only really preserve an ally-- they're not often slated to killing enemies very effectively. That's why Brand and Malzahar made it into support picks, because when all else fails, they can back onto something like a Luden's to hit a damage spike and start the carry train. I've even heard of Ashe supports (Stoneborn Pact can be used to proc Ardent Censer, since Ashe's autos and Ws apply a slow) which is just telling me-- maybe if carries are inching in on support territory, the champions actually fit to the role are beginning to feel like ass.

Now there's changes on PBE that look tight as hell but we're going to have to see, projection does not always match the practice. I remember when people said Ivern was a garbage jungle because he was too easy to counter-jungle.

Hallbuster1 votes

This is relevant and true, there's too much risk involved when you play a traditional support. I haven't seen Soraka in my games in ages!

Mysticman892 votes

I don't think any role can carry more than 90% of their games. Heck, many people would suggest that you only have the opportunity to be the carrying force in like 10% of games (with 45% of them being ones where your team just stomps and carries you regardless of your performance, and 45% being ones where your team gets stomped so hard you can't carry, leaving only that last 10% for you to really be the deciding factor).

Climbing is a game of statistics though, and you only need >50% overall winrate to climb, so you just need to be able to step up enough on those few occasions to bias things above 50%.

In the support role, your kit by it's very nature doesn't require gold/levels to be useful (assuming a conventional support), so even if laning phase is a disaster (maybe your adc is trash, maybe the enemy is a smurf or otherwise simply better, maybe you got camped) and you're way behind, you can still step up and empower/peel whoever is doing well and try to turn things into a 2v8 carry fest. By contrast, with every other role, if you're stuck way behind for whatever reason then you're probably going to be stuck being entirely useless, since you needed that gold/xp to come online, and even if you do stomp, it can boil down to a 1v9 scenario instead of the 2v8's that a good support should be able to produce.

Ralanr2 votes

Support is not a carry role, that by no means makes the role unimportant. The role of support is to make the carries able to actually carry. They're the people who keep Twitch/Vayne safe early game as they farm up. They're the people who're the first to peel off Nocturne from his target when he ults.

As for ranked, I have no idea for previous seasons, but ever since autofill was introduced the support role has been easier to win with for two simple reasons if you're capable of playing support.

  1. The enemy support is autofilled and doesn't know how to support.
  2. Everyone else on your team is more likely in their main role so they will perform at their best.
Hallbuster1 votes

Definitely a good analysis.

Ralanr2 votes

If I have the choice, I will choose to be the weakest link in the chain. That's the most important link.

Tranoze2 votes

In silver -, support cant carry the game because your team doesnt know how to receive what support can provide, and, make impact from them. But starting from gold and higher, support make more impact in the game than you can imagine, in fact, support in higher elo carry 100% of the games. A team has a support main and a team have an auto fill as support have a huge different to be honest. Why? because support is hardest role in the game if we not count CS, support has to control visions, by control visions, you can win 80% of the teamfights. Support doesnt make sure you win the game, Support make sure you doesnt loose the game by control the outcome of every teamfight by visions, and the 90% the outcome of bot laning phase, which, is the most impact lane to the game. Support cant 1 v 5 penta kill, but support can make sure to 5 v 1 five time to aces enemies. Support cant solo baron, or dragon, but support can make sure enemy have to pay a price if they dare to come there, or atleast, make sure your jungle have an easy time to take them.

So, as you are a bronze, you are new to the game, you should learn other roles than support and play them until you understand the strategy of this game, and until then, you shouldnt play support. Support is a strategic role, gameplay role, non CS role. You always have to fight enemy with higher stats and level than you, that make it the hardest.

But can you climb elo with support? The answer is yes, and it is much easier to climb as support than any other roles in gold -> diamonds. You never got auto fill, and 80% of the game, you will face an auto-fill support, which likely wont do the warding, and IF A TEAM DOESNT DO THE WARDING, THEY WILL LOOSE 80% THE GAME. (http://www.leagueofgraphs.com/rankings/warding) that why you climb so easy in higher elo since not so much people play support there.

MrHaZeYo1 votes

Support can indeed impact games. Good supports at least.

Hallbuster1 votes

Alright here's a better question for the 2 comments to the top, would it generally take longer to climb as a support than any other given role. Even if you could maintain a positive winrate of 70 percent, would it all be a good role to climb if it took more than 100 games than other roles to reach a consistent percentage?

MrHaZeYo1 votes

I'd say it's harder to climb in brz/silver as a support because you do need to rely on your teammates. Like even if you get them fed, if they don't know what to do from there it doesn't matter much.

Once you're G+ I'd say it easier to climb as a support because your teammates know what to do with leads better. Supports though can very well dictate the flow of the game though, just need to know what you're doing and when and how to roam.

Hallbuster1 votes

Finally, an answer I wanted to hear. I was right, climbing in low bronze and silver is NOT effective when playing support.

Unless it's "carry" supports that aren't real supports at all.

MrHaZeYo1 votes

Lol ya, brand is pretty much the best low elo support because you build him with the ap sightstone and straight ap

Subject 51 votes

{quoted}

Finally, an answer I wanted to hear. I was right, climbing in low bronze and silver is NOT effective when playing support.

Unless it's "carry" supports that aren't real supports at all.

Finally an answer you wanted to hear? You were right because you got an answer that you specifically wanted out of the boards? Holy shit. This guy. I feel like this guy would just be a disaster to hang out with in the mall or something. You say like one thing he disagrees with and BAM

"Dude I like these shoes."

"THEY AREN'T AS GOOD AS NIKES THOUGH"

"Yeah but-"

"THEY AREN'T AS GOOD AS NIKES THOUGH"

"I mean I guess they're alright . . ."

"Finally, an answer I wanted to hear. I was right, climbing in mountains and forest is NOT effective when using Rebox Sneakers."

Hallbuster1 votes

Too much hyperbole.

oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votes

how bout you try this... get a flex queue team i know you cant do 5 but 4 ... have 1 person be a support and just aft in base not do anything in game and see how many games you win with out the support

Hallbuster1 votes

I'm not arguing they're completely useless but just want people to admit that support is not a good role for climbing.

As for the bottom comment.

You said you went to gold, but never specified the time it took. Players who played for years should all have more than a 55 percent winrate.

oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votes

where did i say i was gold ? and where did my win % come into this ?

Escheton1 votes

{quoted}

I'm not arguing they're completely useless but just want people to admit that support is not a good role for climbing.

As for the bottom comment.

You said you went to gold, but never specified the time it took. Players who played for years should all have more than a 55 percent winrate.

Actually, it's the best role for climbing. You have 2 whole champions to farm kills off. And you don't even have to bother with cs'ing. You just buy a support item with free wards and your income is taken care of.

And players who play for years will likely have a 50% winrate. Because by then you should have settled somewhere you "belong".

Vapor Wave Vibes1 votes

Supports can do a lot depending their team and the support you're playing. Supports like brandBrand do a lot of dmg and can carry throughout all elos, while someone who mains jannaJanna will have a lot harder time trying to carry in bronze than in diamond regardless of that persons individual skill. Most supports aren't supposed to hard carry of course because they're supports, but put their team in the best position possible. Coming from a talon main supports can have a big impact

Lothàrs Edge1 votes

< support main

Don't even bother going utility support in bronze/silver... but get use to knowing how to use that build when you reach mid gold/plat

Expect a 50-55% WR, 60-65% if you're ahead of your division.

Hallbuster1 votes

That's what I'm saying, the winrate is way too low! Players shouldn't have to grind for years if they want to get out of bronze playing support.

Lothàrs Edge1 votes

That winrate is about average across all champs for all players.

Just don't play support in bronze, problem solved.

If you're actually better than those in your elo bracket, then play a role that has more of an impact.

Play Jungle/Mid.

SwiftKitten881 votes

unless your on a champ that can 1v5 your NEVER going to carry 90% of your games... im sorry its not going to happen

and there are almost zero supports that can do this. (IMO there ARE zero, but u can argue some off meta picks can)

i mean if you put FAKER in bronze 5 and give him Braumevery time, i don't think HE is going to win 90% of his games..

give him RyzeAhri Syndra Anivia Riven Orianna MasterYi .. then sure..

Micbran1 votes

Lol 90%. Good luck dude.

Paquay1 votes

{quoted}

I spend a good team reading the boards and have seen a consensus

As have I. The consensus is that 95% of your posts are trolling shitposts. The other 5% are usually asking dumb questions.

SparksFFF1 votes

supports like leona my main can have a huge impact on the game. but with the current system there in a bad spot..but with the support item changes and now the add to cc on the core board they are making a better stronger impact. and being shown for more

GankedByWindows1 votes

You can watch my smurf account. Your ranting about support has inspired me to see. So far i'm 2/0 with Karma with tier 2 runes. Going to one trick Karma.

Account name is TheGrouch1. You can track its progress, still in placements.

Hallbuster1 votes

Alright let me take a look.....

MohawkBird1 votes

[deleted]

Hallbuster1 votes

Honest answer!

Linna Excel1 votes

Can you actually carry more than 90 percent of your games?

I don't think anyone in challenger can carry 90% of their games.

Hallbuster1 votes

Maybe with Duo Queue?

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