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Countering Yasuo as an immobile mage (not complaining, asking for an advise)

SSShutTheDuckUp··4 votes·1,099 views

Hello community! Sorry to bother you with another Yasuo discussion, but hey! I am not gonna complain about him. Majority of people, complaining about him are silver/gold player, who pretty much suck at game. So, i am silver, and i know and admit it - i DO suck at this game.

I have a simple question. I took immobile mage at mid (not Annie or Malzahar , who are considered counters). Enemy midlaner picks Yasuo. So? What shall I do? Could you give me some useful tips when laning against him? How to bait his wall? How to avoid his engage? Should i push, should i freeze? In what position he is vulnerable to skillshots, and how to get him there. When is the good time to roam, how to prevent him roaming, etc. In short - you have the unfavorable matchup. How to deal with it?

I would like answers from both mage-players and Yasuo players. I would like also some more In-depth tips, beside "stay away from minions and ask for a gank".

Thank you very much for taking time reading and answering my silly post. Have a wonderful day!

19 Comments

Aeolian Melodies2 votes

The 2 you named actually aren't half bad vs Yasuo.

Annie W and R aren't projectiles and Yasuo is a squishy target, she can wombo him. Nothing that Malzahar does is a projectile, aids pushes Yasuo into his tower and will likely stick on him a few times, and his ult just yells GO FUCK YOURSELF if Yasuo wants to dive him.

warpenguin5552 votes

I used to play Gragas into him (yes ik hes not immobile, but the yasuo wont take you seriously) wait for him to ult you, then right away ult him into your tower and use e and q to keep him there. Feels great

TehNACHO2 votes

Realize your throwaway ability. Most mid laners max their Q first, for example, and most experienced Yasuo players know to specifically save their Wind Wall for those hard hitting maxed first abilities.

Let's use Xerath for example, his Q and E are extremely powerful tools for blasting Yasuo upfront in trades. However, his W is both cheaper than his Q and can't be blocked by Yasuo. You can mess with Yasuo in this way, intentionally using your W to poke away while saving your Q and E for when he messes up. Other champions' throwaway abilities are even projectiles, so it's even possible to force Yasuo into an inefficient Wind Wall on your throwaway projectile.

EDIT: My mind switched between champions when writing those last two examples. The message should still be the same but don't read into it.

Stand to the side of your minions, warding the bush you are closest to. This gives you an okay CSing and poking angle of attack, while still forcing Yasuo to take minion harass if he leads with his Q, along with forcing Yasuo into inefficient escapes if he initiates with his E (since he'd mostly now be E'ing perpendicular to the lane due to your placement).

Always freeze if you can. Pushing gives you the minion advantage but also gives Yasuo the mobility advantage. Pushing only works if you're (for example) a Fighter that can simply stat check Yasuo, but as an immobile mage, you can't handle giving Yasuo that leverage. Freezing will keep you in the game without putting yourself at risk of Yasuo's offensive.

As a melee champ, he has really obvious csing patterns (ex. If he's far behind his minion wave, he'll noticeably start moving forward when he needs to CS). You can figure out how to poke him once you figure out his movements.

As for roaming, I've personally found it best when an enemy laner leaves lane for me (Yasuo) to farm by myself. CSing leads to gold leads leads to those AD items that Yasuo can and will abuse, so...

Aeszarck1 votes

As a Xerath player, I'd like to correct you on one thing: Arcanopulse (Q) is NOT a projectile and it is not blocked by Wind Wall. (You never specifically stated that it wasn't, but judging from your suggestion to use Eye of Destruction as your primary poking ability while still maxing Arcanopulse, I think you have the assumption that Arcanopulse is blocked. Also, don't feel bad about saying this; I've seen many Yasuos try to Wind Wall my Q.) As Xerath against Yasuo, I recommend poking with your Q and W. However, your suggestion to hold Shocking Orb (E) until he messes up is correct. With Shocking Orb on cooldown (because you tried to hit Yasuo and failed), you can do little if Yasuo dashes to you and begins chunking you besides fire off Q, W, and slowly float away. Also, your Shocking Orb and auto attacks are the only things that can be blocked by Wind Wall, so Yasuo will be specifically saving his Wind Wall for your Shocking Orb. Now, I recently picked up Xerath and would not say that I'm extremely knowledgeable with him, but I've gone up against a fair amount of Yasuos with him, given Yasuo's popularity. I first thought I would be destroyed in lane because I was playing an immobile high cost skillshot reliant squishy slow champion against an extremely mobile champion melee champion. Also, having played matches against other champions, I had noticed that Xerath does extremely well against short ranged champions (like Lissandra) and medium ranged champions (like Ahri) and has a pretty even matchup against long ranged champions (Varus, Lux), but is destroyed by most assassin melees(, and also assassin rangeds, I guess). So I was pleasantly surprised when I saw how much Yasuo struggled against me in my first game against him. He also struggled in subsequent matches, and I think I can say that Xerath is actually quite good against Yasuo. His absurd ranges and lack of projectile-based poking skills allows him to play extremely safely against Yasuo and still chunk him and get CS at the samse time. Xerath's passive also has an odd synergy with Yasuo's passive, in that Xerath wants to poke champions with auto-attacks to get extra mana, and Xerath also wants to poke Yasuo with auto-attacks to break his shield. (You <also> want to poke him with autos to get Thunderlords Decree procs, since you likely won't be getting three spell combos off often. Xerath loves auto-attacks.) Also, if you manage to bring Yasuo down to low hp, low enough to kill with Rite of the Arcane, he'll probably run away. This probably puts him far enough away from minions for him not to be able to dash and dodge, and if you're good with your skillshots you should be able to kill him. I'd really recommend trying Xerath mid against Yasuo because you can play so safely and still bully him. However, you need to learn how Xerath's skills work first, and you also need to know how to play safely. Xerath's skills aren't especially complicated, but they're hard to hit and it takes a couple games to learn how to predict enemy movement and how to land your skills accordingly. It also took a couple games for me to learn just how far back I needed to be in order to be safe. Also, one more thing. Xerath is a really good counterganker if he has his ult. You could win your bot lane a 3v2 or your top lane a 2v1 if you manage to hit all three Rite of the Arcane shots (which should be easy, because the opposing ganker and laner will be focused on killing the ally laner and will not be expecting your ultimate, and they may not even try to dodge the shots while trying to kill your laner). Your roaming will be decent, but you don't exactly have the "jump in and destroy you" skillset that many junglers and some mids have, and your ganks won't be as good as a result. Also, if you don't hit your Shocking Orb, the only thing you can really do it hit the enemy laner[s] with a Q and a W and just walk back to mid lane, because you aren't really much with your spells on cooldown.

TehNACHO2 votes

Ahh, oops. When I wrote the first paragraph I was thinking Ahri, but then I switched to Xerath for the second example because...well I don't know, my brain must've thought Xerath is pretty cool to talk about.

Aeszarck1 votes

Xerath is awesome to talk about! One thing I still don't understand about him is why more people don't play him. His spells are ridiculously long ranged and deal huge amounts of damage, and aren't super contrived to use. He dominates most lane matchups, and he wins teamfights before they happen with his insane poke. He can half-health squishy people with a Q if he gets moderately fed, which is pretty easy given how much kill potential he has in lane. I know that his spells require forethought before use and have very high mana costs (though he can mitigate those costs with his passive, at least during the laning phase), and he's also got no escapes, but I feel like his strengths far outweigh his weaknesses. (I guess I am kinda biased though because I own him and I love all the champions that I own. However, out of all my mid laners, I've probably had the most consistent success with him once I learned him.)

Also, back to the topic at hand. I feel like Ahri is in a much, much worse spot against Yasuo than Xerath is. I believe that all of her abilities count as projectiles, and though you can "bait" out the Wind Wall with an Orb of Deception (so that you can unleash a full combo once your Q comes back up), the mana cost of the ability makes it an unfavorable trade for you, especially considering that Ahri runs out of mana quite quickly, and there are no guarantees that you'll be able to land a Charm between the time that your Orb of Deception comes back up and the time that Yasuo's Wind Wall comes back up. I think that Ahri's medium range also makes her much more vulnerable to Yasuo's tornado as well as him dashing up to her and chunking her health. Her squishiness also makes it so that getting caught by a tornado post-six is likely death if she is below half-health. Xerath doesn't really have that weakness considering the fact that Yasuo will not be able to damage Xerath much in order to get him to half-health and Xerath will also have more time to react to tornados. Also, Xerath will either be packing Heal or Barrier, whereas Ahri will most likely be packing Ignite. This is all from personal experience, by the way. I don't know whether Ahri is actually good against Yasuo and I'm just bad at her, or whether Xerath is bad at fighting Yasuo and I just got matched up against poor Yasuos. Or maybe they just didn't know how to play against Xerath.

Slamurai Jack2 votes

I wrote an essay about how to deal with Yasuo about 6 months ago, and lots of people found it helpful so I'll use it again here.

The key to beating a Yasuo in lane is proper minion management, and proper management is different depending on whether you're a ranged or melee champion. As a ranged champion, you want to keep the wave in 1 of 2 places depending on Yasuo's health relative to yours. If Yasuo is ahead or even, you want to keep the wave frozen a bit outside of your own tower, so that he has to go into tower range to order to hit you. You can basically do whatever you want to him if the wave is in this spot because you can simply retreat into tower range if he tries to go onto you. However, if you're ahead of him in health, you want to start a slow push, so you can poke him whenever he tries to CS and you'll have a buffer of minion support if he tries to all in you. In this case, he can't do much either.

For a melee champion, you want to slow push pretty much all the time. Yasuo is extremely vulnerable to being all inned by melee champions when he's trying to CS, and a good Yasuo will try to do a slow push of his own to discourage his opponent from attacking him. One important thing to understand is that while enemy minions are oftentimes Yasuo's best friends since he uses them to dash, they are also one of his biggest weaknesses since he's required to tank them in order to trade. If you can bait him into tanking alot of minions with some kind of defensive ability like an ori shield, you can very easily come out ahead in trades, provided you don't panic, keep autoing, and hit some extra free damage on him when he tries to get out.

Generally speaking, a Yasuo will always want the wave in 1 of 2 places. He either wants a slight minion advantage on his side so he can get free opportunities to poke with Q, but not so many more minions that the wave gets frozen outside the enemy tower. A good Yasuo will bait you into hitting minions with AOE abilities to push the wave back towards him if it starts to get too close to tower, allowing him to be aggressive again. The other position is for when Yasuo has a lead on his opponent; he will want to freeze outside of his tower, leaving a long trail of minions to dash through so he can all in you if you try to walk up to CS. The key to beating Yasuo is to keep the wave where you want it to be rather than the way he wants it to be, or there's not a whole lot you can do as alot of champions.

Other general tips for beating Yasuo include: Ask for ganks, an aggressive Yasuo player is very easy to bait and kill if he isn't strong enough to 1v2 already. Take exhaust as a combat summoner if your kill pressure on him is low, its a great way to neutralize his aggression in lane as well as neuter him in teamfights. If Yasuo misses his tornado, that is the time to be aggressive. His Q is on CD, he has no CC for a while, and his ult, by extension, is unavailable. And if Yasuo gets too aggressive in lane and messes up when trying to trade, all in him right then and there. If you get a lead against Yasuo, most champions will be able to zone him out heavily since he's a squishy melee only champion with no escape and no natural sustain.

And 1 final tip that almost no one knows about. Yasuo's ult is a suspension and not a knockup, which means it can be removed with QSS, Mikaels, Cleanse, Gangplanks orange, and Olaf's and Alistars ult. If you remove it, you can move immediately and will take no damage, but Yasuo will still be stuck in his ult animation until it is finished.

Hyppocritamus2 votes

ok, here's my 2 cents as a newbie Lux player. Use or discard - I don't even know if she's considered "immobile".

I dance around minions and poke. I try to not stay on the same side of the minion bundle as the Yasuo in question. I also ward the bushes to protect myself from inevitable gank attempts.

Every once in a while, I'll throw out a W as a feint - some players see an animation and reflexively throw out a wind wall. I don't mind not getting back my baton in a pinch, especially if it means I keep my Q and E.

I'll then use my E agressively, and my Q defensively (read: escaping). If they're agressive, which newbies tend to be, sometimes I can trap one under a turret with my Q, and net a kill.

All in all, I don't have any troubles with Yasuo sofar, though I look forward to seeing him in higher level play.

Essentially, I find that the best way is to keep him off-balance, and take advantage of him being a melee champ.

MunchCrunchLunch1 votes

malzahar would be better vs yasuo because of his minions. a good way to poke his shield off. but still. they are not counters imo. yasuo is really hard to counter and annoying to play against as he has hide damage. range. and sustain and al il tanky because of his shield

Boomerangbro1 votes

Ziggs. Just lay down your hextech mines where the minion waves meet and watch as he triggers them all trying to dash through your minions. If he doesnt hes zoned and you can farm in peace/poke with Q. Abuse your long attack range to trigger his passive without taking damage. Ult isnt a projectile and cant be blocked (i dont think). Use your W to escape from tornado's that would spell your doom/knock him away from dash distance.

Its All Skillzz1 votes

i ban him. thats only way i counter him. if he does get picked and im playing ap ezreal i just aa his shield and E when he dashes to me an just farm with Q. i ban him cause he wins lane just by being yasuo and im forced to play complete pussman mode to stay even in lane.

Yma S1 votes

auto attack him to get rid of shield

kek

NazZomLord1 votes

Viktor Setup W on yourself Q into his face and E poke.

Xilixer1 votes

as a vel'koz and malz player one of the best ways ive found to deal with him is to keep at your max range as always. only go in if you want to use your auto attack to make him waste his passive shield. after wasting it return to your max range of your pokes and continue to poke him. never ever let him get close and keep an eye on him when he can use his whirlwind as it leads to his ult. if you can dodge that he has no ult.

Squidblimp1 votes

I main Vel'Koz. I hate laning against yasuo, but here is my advice:

(1) Auto attack his shield to break it before harassing him with spells. This way you don't waste mana doing no damage to him.

(2) Treat your own minions as Yasuo's gapcloser to your face. Don't auto attack him if there are a ton of your own minions still in the lane.

(3) If he pushes like crazy (which he usually does) and causes you to run out of mana because you have to waveclear constantly, well, instead of doing that, ask for a gank. Yasuo is super easy to gank, and even easier when he's pushed up. If he isn't aggressively pushing at you, he shouldn't be too much of an issue to deal with, as a passive yasuo is useless.

(4) Bait his windwall. Don't use high mana cost abilities when his windwall is up.

(5) Save your CC spell for when he engages towards you so you can peel backwards. Don't use it to try and harass him, unless you have an HP advantage and you know you can hit him, or your jungler is ganking.

(6) Back off when he has his tornado up, and try to juke his tornado by walking sideways. Also, don't stand behind the minions when he has tornado so he cant gapclose onto you and use it, or waveclear with the tornado while also hitting you.

(7) Grab an early Seeker's Armguard for the extra armor.

Wimbledofy1 votes

This really depends on the mage you are playing. As a very long range mage like lux you want to stay very far from yasuo and poke him with e. When he gets close use your cc on him before or as he dashes to you. If you still have your tower, you should be close or under tower when this happens. After having cc'd him use full combo on him and kill him if you can, or back off. As a midrange mage like ahri/syndra/veigar it is pretty similar. Poke with q and use cc when you can, or save it if you feel like you need to instead. When you land cc try to combo your abilities on him.

Also during the early laning phase try to auto him to pop his shield before using abilities on him. Try to land cc on him while his shield is down so your combo does more damage. When yasuo uses windwall hold onto your cc before it ends and back away. Also some more general tips: -Don't stand to close to your minions, he can engage on you easily by dashing through them. -When his tornado is up, stand far enough away so he can't EQ you. If he does E to you, walk towards/through him instead of away, this will cause his q knockup to miss if done correctly since yasuo's dash distance is always the same. -Bait out his windwall before engaging.

Vincent Lucius1 votes

He's melee, so poke with autos when you're not farming. Poke is poke, and it adds up. Eventually you'll be able to kill him with a combo, and a good one will know it and try to either play safe or kill you/scare you. Watch for how they play and if they get aggressive just try to bait a fight. Have your CC ready and depending on what you're playing you can wait until he's right on top of you to lock him down and burst him.

The wall is something that you'll have to take into account, some of them use it whenever they think you're going to combo them, others actually wait for your animation to start. If you've got a stun it doesn't really matter as long as you get projectiles out before he can move again, but if you've only got something like a snare then you really need to learn to bait the wall with autos or fake aggression.

TeemoXNidalee1 votes

Annie: Spam Q, if he uses the wall, wait then faceroll to win. Malzahar: permapush the lane pre-6 level 6 just QEWR for a kill.

Blazing Tenshi1 votes

Know his harassment pattern, which is simply when a new minion wave arrives because this gives him the most targets to dash onto you and then out.

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