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As much as I hate playing against simple ADCs like kogmaw when they're strong

Tychusfindlay918··70 votes·16,581 views

Unlike this little bitch Kaisa at least kogmaw doesn't have a tool FOR EVERY FUCKING SITUATION KNOWN TO MANKIND.

It's like this fucking champion needed to be mechanically overloaded on top of doing the most random and non-sensical shit (like changing her pose every time she autos) so that people can buy her and riot can feel like they've made the money to justify creating her in the first place. Meanwhile for a gigantic chunk of the playerbase the kaisa release, like most other recent releases, has just been a ball of fucking cancer that sucks whatever little fucking fun there is in the game out.

Hell, I can pull in a vayne and still somewhat maybe be able to do something. I can pull in a kaisa and she'll just murder my team or do some stupid insta dash to the other side of my team or just invis + massive MS to relocate. It's like, fuck, can she have a niche and not be this fucking monster that has a PERFECT tool for EVERY situation?

99 Comments

Acheron1623 votes

The new circlejerk begins.

Sex With Annie22 votes

Release: "This champ is ass LMAO who would EVER pick this trash?"

After 50 range increase: "This champ does EVERYTHING, RIOT HELLO??"

Coo1breeze3 votes

Lol I think every new champ gets shit on after release.

Pre-Game: "Top why tf are you picking NewChampHere? Are you trolling???" -> Whole team agrees and peer pressures Top

OverpoweredSoap10 votes

[{quoted}](name=Lewd Ripe Trap,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=sofmYuBY,comment-id=000f0000,timestamp=2018-06-10T00:47:46.808+0000)

Release: "This champ is ass LMAO who would EVER pick this trash?"

After 50 range increase: "This champ does EVERYTHING, RIOT HELLO??"

50 range is important though, especially on an ADC.

Kai Sa just has a lot in her kit, which is probably why she had 500 range in the first place.

I'm not saying she's completely overpowered and that she is a travesty of a champion but she is not fun to place against in the same way Vayne isn't fun to place against.

The main thing that annoys me about Kai Sa is her ult though, like, shield stacking was sort of an issue (and again not fun to play against) and then they gave a shield to an ADC.... Which is odd and the shield is fucking massive.

She's a blast to play though, so there's that.

Acheron162 votes

{quoted} I'm not saying she's completely overpowered and that she is a travesty of a champion but she is not fun to place against in the same way Vayne isn't fun to place against.

Why wouldn't anyone find it fun to face Vayne? She's so easy to kill that she's easily my favourite champ to face.

Strawberrycocoa4 votes

Personally, I find Vayne not fun to play against because she's one of those champs that requires constant fucking attention. If you leave her alone to farm safely for even a few minutes, she comes back with a massive power spike.

Acheron161 votes

I never really feel that, umless I'm playing someone that doesn't go damage like a pure tank or an enchanter.

Kaìju1 votes

It was only 25, and the problem isn't range. Kai'Sa should have 550 range and her execute should be removed or heavily nerfed. Her issue is having a 17 to 20% execute at level one that scales heavily on AP. Her being a viable AP building ADC was theme enough as a gameplay niche. Right now she is straight up a better Vayne. Kai'Sa needs to be much more AP DPS and much less assassin.

Salson17 votes

Making a champion with little to no utility tends to cause problems. I'm actually surprised they did it, knowing how much Yi, Vayne, Kat, Tryn and others are hated.

She's fun though, really damn fun. Gotta give them that.

sutora37 votes

for the people that play her and not for the enemy

HeimerLmao8 votes

This, so much this. It's the same for Zoe. Even if she is fun, getting oneshot from one screen away is not. Seriously, fck Zoe.

Cait Main2 votes

I don't mind zoe 1 shotting from a screen away honestly. She can easily miss that q since the position is predetermined like nearly a full sec in advance. Its annoying that going for that playstyle is significantly less rewarding than maxing w, grabbing ignite, and waiting for a summ to drop so she can just run at you with little to no interactive gameplay.

Long range burst like xerath is only hard to deal with when the other player is better.

HeimerLmao1 votes

But then there's her e and she no longer has a problem with missing her Q.

Cait Main1 votes

She has to hit the e first though and there are many ways to play around it. Allies can body block or you can just get closer to reduce q damage. If you lane against her you can get tenacity from boots and runes or take cleanse. Would you rather her just miss her q and e and 1 shot you because she has lich bane and picked up a heal or be required to hit you with an actual skill shot to one shot you?

HeimerLmao1 votes

I play mostly normals, cleanse isn't an option. I've never met the w maxing strategy down there in silver, but trust me, in a game, she will hit that e sometime. And then you're fucked.

Strawberrycocoa3 votes

Riot doesn't have a very good history of considering the enemy player experience when making kit and balance decisions. Something has to be absolutely fucking ridiculous before they'll admit it's "too oppressive".

Matt52115 votes

[deleted]

gabetheguy16 votes

{quoted}

Dear Riots Dumbass Balance Team, Remove guinsoos you fucking morons its killing your game.

iirc everything has been killing this game since circa 2013. game's not dying anytime soon. get over it lmao

SwiftKitten882 votes

{quoted}

Dear Riots Dumbass Balance Team, Remove guinsoos you fucking morons its killing your game.

i have played since patch 3.6.. i cannot remember a single patch where this item wasn't broken or worthless.

yet riot removes things like trackers knife and sightstone... so now instead of being able to properly ward for my brainless allies i cant stop them from facechecking every bush.

AirKingNeo2 votes

Patches from the start to middle of season 6? The item was balanced then.

SwiftKitten881 votes

{quoted}

Patches from the start to middle of season 6? The item was balanced then.

i know your an troll but i wrote PATCH 3.6 THREE POINT SIX

AirKingNeo2 votes

That means your range of time frame for the item being "broken or worthless" is 3.6 to LIVE (8.11). I said that it was balanced during the first half of Season 6 (6.1 to 6.11 or so).

DragonShea5 votes

{quoted}

Dear Riots Dumbass Balance Team, Remove guinsoos you fucking morons its killing your game.

item 3124 has "rage" in it because it pisses off people.

VoraciousX2 votes

{quoted}

Dear Riots Dumbass Balance Team, Revert guinsoos you fucking morons its killing your game.

FTFY

AirKingNeo2 votes

"Guinsoo's is the problem"

meanwhile every champion but Kai'Sa who builds rageblade is below a 50% winrate

SithesisLord1 votes

They should honestly remove all AP scalings from her passive.

AP Kai'Sa should be a sup-optimal build, not her goddamn go-to build.

Same for Varus.

Cait Main2 votes

I mean I don't see how her being ap is toxic. Honestly its good that adc players have an option to pick some magic damage when the rest of their team opts to go yasuo mid, yi jg, darius top, and pyke supp.

I'm glad that I have some control over how bad my team comp is rather than be 1 of 20 different champions who just builds ad and autos the tank for 0 damage.

SithesisLord1 votes

Except you already have that control.

Even without the 3.75% per 100 AP scaling, it´s still %HP magic damage she's dealing. 15 to 20% max HP, no less.

Couple hat with the fact that she can easily reach 500 AP with Nashor's, Guinsoo's and Rabadon's, the default AP build, we´re looking at a total of 40% max HP damage.

The only other champion to deal a lot of %HP magic damage is a W max TK, which deals 32% with Devour. However, his is much less reliable.

Now consider that her passive doesn´t realistically have a cooldown and it starts to become a problem.

Giving her passive cooldowns on enemy champions or just removing the 3.75% per 100 AP scaling should solve the problem.

Lest we forget, people aren´t building AP for the sick montage W one-shots. They´re building it for the bullshit shredding of everyone on the enemy team. By a champion who also gets stealth that can have its CD reduced and a gets a shield.

The problem with Kai'Sa is definitely Kai'Sa, not Guinsoo's.

Cait Main1 votes

I never said Kai'Sa wasn't overpowered but making her build AD would remove originality from the role. Her passive isn't max health damage its MISSING health damage which means her magic damage is directly affected by her previous damage. If I'm hitting a Malphite for 20% of his missing health and he is at 80% then he is taking 4% of his hp before resistances as damage. She would still have to rely on her team mates to do damage while the enemy could pick up 1 mr item and her magic damage deemed useless.

When you also consider that her passive is 5 hits to proc its not like its proc'd every other auto unless your team has a lot of cc. She is very strong atm and arguably the strongest adc because of guinsoo's and rabaddons giving like 170% ap but that shouldn't mean that she should be built ad. When building her AD was the most meta option no one complained even though she still was over powered as the only ad who could do anything without a support.

I wouldn't mind her passive losing some ap scaling but if she is forced into building ad by removing her ap scaling then that's taking away from the champion itself.

Infernape13 votes

She was made by Camille's champ designer, what did you expect?

Ratpie4 votes

{quoted}

She was made by Camille's champ designer, what did you expect?

Too bad I can only upvote this once....

bbQsauçe7 votes

[deleted]

AirKingNeo4 votes

Camille can be beaten by pretty much every bruiser in lane, but her kit is the only kit that let's bruisers fight Teemo, Kennen, and Gnar.

PhDs Nuts2 votes

{quoted}

Camille can be beaten by pretty much every bruiser in lane, but her kit is the only kit that let's bruisers fight Teemo, Kennen, and Gnar.

What? Bruisers completely ignore Teemo until level 6 and then he doesn't get to play the game anymore.

AirKingNeo3 votes

Have you played top lane?

VICHEL CHAOS2 votes

"Bruisers completely ignore Teemo until level 6". You asked the question, I give you the information to draw your conclusion XD

PhDs Nuts3 votes

{quoted}

Have you played top lane?

Have you? All a bruiser has to do against Teemo is have Second Wind + Bone Plating and start with Doran's Shield. They're now free to play safe until they get to level 6 and have any MR at all. If Teemo uses his blind, they can run him down. Works on literally any bruiser.

I'm a top lane main that plays against plat/low diamond. That's how any lane against Teemo goes for me. Mundo, Trundle, Darius, Jax, Renekton, even Malphite.

Beacon Academy1 votes

Bone Plating Second Wind item 1054 item 3211 item 3194 If you really wanna say fu

same concept for champs like Rumble, where you just walk up and touch the edge of his flamethrower and move back.

Except in teemo's case, his dot comes from aa and so your minions will attack him and get pushed to your tower by enemy minions. Congrats you're now sustaining through his damage and have easy access to farm plus jungle ganks.

AirKingNeo1 votes

great you built Cowl/Adaptive, now you paid a massive gold tax and are now useless to your team unless you picked a tank.

PhDs Nuts1 votes

{quoted}

great you built Cowl/Adaptive, now you paid a massive gold tax and are now useless to your team unless you picked a tank.

It's not a tax if it lets you run down your enemy laner with complete impunity. You don't seem to understand that Teemo isn't allowed to even farm anymore.

Trundle item 3047 item 3194 //item 3065 item 3153 item 3748 item 3143 item 3742 So useless =(

AirKingNeo1 votes

No, you won't be able to kill Teemo because he's Teemo still and he gets to use his gold to do whatever when you're suck buying defensive.

PhDs Nuts1 votes

{quoted}

No, you won't be able to kill Teemo because he's Teemo still and he gets to use his gold to do whatever when you're suck buying defensive.

lol ok pal.

"You can't kill Teemo because he's Teemo." SOLID ARGUMENT

"He gets to use his gold to do whatever" Yeah, he can use his ambient gold income to finish his Liandry's at 20 minutes when I'm at 2.5 items and pushing towards his inhib turret with Rift Herald.

Alex h87213 votes

Cam is so disgusting, w/ 3-4 items her 2nd Q can do 1k true damage, in one bloody auto.

Colton14710 votes

Kaisa is a very mechanically intensive champion and has a high skill ceiling.

34112354565217 votes

{quoted}

Kaisa is a very mechanically intensive champion and has a high skill ceiling.

colton is the best troll

Daddy Ants10 votes

{quoted}

Kaisa is a very mechanically intensive champion and has a high skill ceiling.

No she isn't.

EinarUlfar5 votes

https://images.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fi.imgflip.com%2Fidn78.jpg&f=1

PhDs Nuts6 votes

Change the champion name and the different auto positions and the entire OP could have also been about Irelia. Replace "go invis" with "uninterruptedly become a pre-nerf banner minion".

Velasan5 votes

Using vulgarity paired with hyperbole doesn't make your point stronger.

Kaisa is still probably a little too powerful, but she has two big weaknesses: She can be all in'ed very easily by most fighters and more than a couple of juggernauts, her range is still pretty low.

She has the tools available to her because if she didn't Kaisa would just be a worse version of Vayne.

Still think she's probably slightly too strong, but let's not act like Kaisa is pick or ban right now. Haven't reached that stage.

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