-[Removed] reset mechanic -Cooldown lowered from 80/65/60 to 80/60/40 -AP ratio increased from 75% to 100%
Lux is one of the strongest supports in the game with aftershock. You're increasing her Q CD. That's very good. You're reducing the power of her shield. These two changes will put her in a balanced spot...
BUT THEN YOU INCREASE HER ULT AP RATIO FROM 75% TO 100%. She simply doesn't need this.
boricCentaur16 votesSoooooooo how does this has ANYTHING TO DO WITH SUPPORT LUX? This is for mid lane lux who is currently fine and doesn't need nerfs. They're trying to nerf support lux without hurting mid lux.
This buff doesn't do anything for support lux since she doesn't build a lot of ap.
Ayzev1 votesThis is for mid lane lux who is currently fine and doesn't need nerfs. They're trying to nerf support lux without hurting mid lux.
https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/builds/lux/middle https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/builds/lux/support She's too strong in both.
Yordle Xayah5 votesThey're hitting Supp Lux really hard while not murdering Mid Lux. I don't see the problem.
Ayzev1 votesMid Lux doesn't need the compensation either. https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/builds/lux/middle
hrooza dota 4 votesshe falls off the higher you in play rate that noone plays her
https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/builds/lux/middle/master
Yordle Xayah1 votesMid Lux doesn't need the compensation either. https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/builds/lux/middle
How is this useful to assess post nerf Lux? How can you know that Mid Lux won't need compensation without data from that point in time? You know, I got to 30 back in 2012 playing almost nothing more than Mid Lux. Back in the day all you had to do was camp her a bit with a Lee or play an assassin into her and she explodes in 0.003 seconds. Then she got the shield stack and that is what I feel is pushing her over the top. Nerfs aren't about destroying characters but about bringing them in line. Lux has been trash for years. The nerf will most def remove her from Pro Play and will hurt her win/play ratio. There's no way the compensation equals what she has now.
Ayzev2 votesHow is this useful to assess post nerf Lux? How can you know that Mid Lux won't need compensation without data from that point in time?
53% win rate is pretty damn substantial. It's rather rare that a champion can go from that to needing buffs in a single nerf. Though I guess Riot have been jumping to extremes with numbers more often recently. But I'd prefer they stop being extreme rather than compensating one extreme with another.
Nerfs aren't about destroying characters but about bringing them in line.
I never said or even implied I wanted her destroyed.
Lux has been trash for years.
And now you lost me.
Yordle Xayah1 votes53% win rate is pretty damn substantial. It's rather rare that a champion can go from that to needing buffs in a single nerf. Though I guess Riot have been jumping to extremes with numbers more often recently. But I'd prefer they stop being extreme rather than compensating one extreme with another.
You're using pre-nerf data to attempt to justify your anger towards post-nerf compensations. This data is useless and irrelevant for that end.
I never said or even implied I wanted her destroyed.
Then get back down to Earth and wait for the changes to occur before whining about changes that you don't know the results of.
And now you lost me.
You're lost yourself. Lux was just not good enough for a very long time. What do you think exactly triggered the 7.15, 7.22, 8.7 and 8.9 buffs? Did you even remember those and why they happened? The game has changed since those patches and the buffs that came back then have become too powerful in the Support role specifically, which is the target of the nerfs. Current "broken" Lux has a really low pick rate for Mid, yet you pretend to judge the entire performance of a champion based on a single role that is nothing more than the current flavor of the month. If you can't even identify such simple things, then it's no wonder you're lost, and it has nothing to do with me.
Ayzev1 votesYou're using pre-nerf data to attempt to justify your anger towards post-nerf compensations. This data is useless and irrelevant for that end.
How do you know, without post-nerf data, that the compensation is necessary?
And I ain't angry, by the way. I actually like Lux, probably one of my 10 most played champions, if that means anything.
wait for the changes to occur before whining about changes that you don't know the results of.
I'm not whining. I just think that, based on how strong Lux is right now, it seems unlikely that a single nerf will weaken her so much she'll need to be buffed back up.
Lux was just not good enough for a very long time. What do you think exactly triggered the 7.15, 7.22, 8.7 and 8.9 buffs?
You're implying that if a champion gets buffs, it's because they need those buffs. There's been a good number of cases showing that to not necessarily be true.
Current "broken" Lux...
I didn't call her broken, just too strong.
...has a really low pick rate for Mid...
6% at the time when I'm typing this. That's barely below average.
...yet you pretend to judge the entire performance of a champion based on a single role that is nothing more than the current flavor of the month.
I'm not judging the state of Lux mid based on Lux support. Mid Lux has a barely below average pickrate, but significantly above average win rate. She really does seem strong there.
Well, except in Master+, as hrooza pointed out to me. But when I have used Master+ data in other threads, I had people tell me that I shouldn't use Master+ data because of small sample sizes, so I honestly don't know what people want anymore. I don't even know why I keep having these arguments when all that ever happens is either people shifting the goal post around like that, or getting all emotional like you clearly did, or whatever else that in the end accomplishes nothing.
Yordle Xayah1 votesHow do you know, without post-nerf data, that the compensation is necessary?
I don't, but I'm not the one demanding a nerf/buff based on data I don't have.
I'm not whining. I just think that, based on how strong Lux is right now, it seems unlikely that a single nerf will weaken her so much she'll need to be buffed back up.
Wait for results of the change.
Ayzev1 votesI don't, but I'm not the one demanding a nerf/buff based on data I don't have.
You're adamant about defending a buff that you don't have relevant data for.
By the way, the time it took you to respond, the shortness of your response compared to my comment and the instant downvote really go to show you sure are worth talking to.
Yordle Xayah1 votesYou're adamant about defending a buff.
My original post was "They're hitting Supp Lux really hard while not murdering Mid Lux. I don't see the problem." No idea why this triggers you so badly.
Now, let's break it down for you:
First: This is not a buff, it's an adjustment. A buff is strictly a shift towards increasing power. In this particular instance, the change is a weaker compensation for the nerf that is being put in place and I wanna believe that you understand at least as much. So, This is in fact not a buff. Please get your concepts straight first.
Second: I'm defending this adjustment based on the fact that the nerf by itself is harsh, and it's very specifically intended for the bottom lane. The intention of the adjustment is very clearly to prevent Mid Lux from becoming too weak.
Third: You said you don't want the character murdered, yet it triggers you that they're compensating for what you know very well is a harsh nerf. So from that there's only two options: You actually want the character murdered and you lied to me, or you just don't understand how harsh the nerf is and are attempting to build an argument based on a flawed perception of the situation. So you're either a lair or are clueless about the harshness of the nerfs.
Fourth: I'm not shifting any "goal post", and again: It's not my problem that you're this lost. My core argument remains the same it has been since my first post: They're hitting Supp Lux really hard while not murdering Mid Lux. I don't see the problem. If after the change she remains at 54% (or God forbid goes higher) then OF COURSE she should be nerfed again. The subject here is that they're implementing a compensation which objectively still leaves Lux in a weaker state prior to the nerf. Look at OP's score. Most people understand this compensation isn't going too far and that it's only a safety net.
I've stated my case to exhaustion so I'm out. If me leaving the convo makes you feel like you've won or whatever I'm fine with it. Take care.
Ayzev1 votesthe change is a weaker compensation for the nerf that is being put in place the nerf by itself is harsh, and it's very specifically intended for the bottom lane. The intention of the adjustment is very clearly to prevent Mid Lux from becoming too weak. they're compensating for what you know very well is a harsh nerf.
To support Lux it sure is harsh. But mid Lux gets practically no survivability - doesn't max W, doesn't use Aftershock, doesn't build anything with shield strength or healing, only Zhonya, and even then in Master+ she dares to go fucking Mejai's of all things about half as often as Zhonya. It really seems like she doesn't actually care about how much damage she can or cannot take. She just wants to deal damage from far enough away that she doesn't get hit back. So they're making her less able to survive taking damage, when she already avoids that like a pest anyway, but giving her a big chunk of damage to supposedly just compensate. Take away something that doesn't matter, add something that does matter - sounds a lot like a net buff to me.
I'm not shifting any "goal post",
I didn't mean to say that you personally move goal posts, but rather the boards in general can't seem to agree on whether high elo data should be used or not. Though I guess it could help to know your stance on whether or not the game should be balanced primarily around the very best players.
If after the change she remains at 54% (or God forbid goes higher) then OF COURSE she should be nerfed again.
Question is though - will she?
How long has Morde been sitting on a >50% ban rate? How long was Riven dominating top before she got a shield nerf, that was compensated with that Q cooldown buff, resulting in her still dominating top? How long has Karthus been half-healthing entire teams at the press of a button from half the map away?
Riot is so slow about fixing whatever they overtune I can't help but wish they they'd just stop risking overtuning.
Woodakoodashooda2 votesLux can stay in ban land as far as I'm concerned. Nothing Riot does to her will change my mind.
hrooza dota 2 votessupport after shock does not build ap, this is for midlane lux or full ap lux who still get harmed by Q/W changes
2Charmnot2Charm1 votesLux is one of the strongest supports in the game with aftershock.
Someone forgot Mid Lux is a thing.
Also that ap ratio buff is so scary on a support that doesn't build much ap /s
chipndip11 votesAs many have said: Mid lane Lux needs compensation. Support Lux doesn't. So they gave her scaling buffs and knocked her base values out.
