Meanwhile Lee Sin pretty much single-handedly defines a meta and has for years, and he barely gets touched. Sounds about accurate for Riot Game. I guess Kat just doesn't make #LCSBIGPLAYS.
MyrddinDark7 votes70% ban rate in korea 58+ win rate from diamond upwards
yadda yadda yadda it's been like that for a few months now. nerfs warranted
Lee sin has a garbage win rate, has for years, just saying.
chumbler1 votes70% ban rate in korea 58+ win rate from diamond upwards
yadda yadda yadda it's been like that for a few months now. nerfs warranted
Lee sin has a garbage win rate, has for years, just saying.
Implying win rates are useful for anything balance related.
Done252 votes70% ban rate in korea 58+ win rate from diamond upwards
yadda yadda yadda it's been like that for a few months now. nerfs warranted
Lee sin has a garbage win rate, has for years, just saying.
Implying win rates are useful for anything balance related.
A 52% win rate implies nothing. A 60%+ winrate however, is a much different story.
chumbler1 votes70% ban rate in korea 58+ win rate from diamond upwards
yadda yadda yadda it's been like that for a few months now. nerfs warranted
Lee sin has a garbage win rate, has for years, just saying.
Implying win rates are useful for anything balance related.
A 52% win rate implies nothing. A 60%+ winrate however, is a much different story.
Not if it's solo queue.
Sailor Mint1 votesA high SoloQ implies that it's easy to be successful on that champion.
She's not getting nerfed because she has a high soloQ win rate. She's getting nerfed because it's too easy to snowball early.
MyrddinDark1 votes70% ban rate in korea 58+ win rate from diamond upwards
yadda yadda yadda it's been like that for a few months now. nerfs warranted
Lee sin has a garbage win rate, has for years, just saying.
Implying win rates are useful for anything balance related.
they are, you and random people can keep saying they are not, but having anything over a 52% win rate for a long period of time would indicate something wrong with the champion in the current meta, so something would have to be done to either shift the meta as a whole or reduce that champions impact upon it.
there is no other reason for there to be such a high deviation in their rate of winning a game. Given that her win percentage remained consistently over 55% with over 200k matches played, there is a problem with her.
The Storm Dragon5 votesThen you realize that people running scripts have been utterly ravaging ranked for weeks with Kat. Also, have you noticed that Kat single handedly breaks almost every special game mode by herself? Poor design.
chumbler5 votesThen you realize that people running scripts have been utterly ravaging ranked for weeks with Kat. Also, have you noticed that Kat single handedly breaks almost every special game mode by herself? Poor design.
Scripters and special game modes should not be determining balance decisions. Especially when said balance decisions are just dumpstering a champion without actually doing anything to resolve the scripting issue.
On the plus side, maybe if scripters start using Lee Sin Riot will actually delete him. Wait who am I kidding, they'd probably buff him if that happened.
wolfax2 votesToo bad Lee Sin is not easy to use, and thus will probably never be scripted.
ModUlanopo3 votesKat has been underperforming in recent featured game modes. The only one where she was powerful was URF. Regardless, they specifically mentioned that they don't balance aroound FGMs.
EndlessSorcerer2 votesI've honestly not heard about Katarina breaking any of the recent game mode. Most often, it's Yorick who introduces some game breaking bug for new game modes or champions.
yellowbricks2 votesThen you realize that people running scripts have been utterly ravaging ranked for weeks with Kat. Also, have you noticed that Kat single handedly breaks almost every special game mode by herself? Poor design.
Poor design is "herp we can't be added to actually fix the scripter problem so we'll just shit hellfire on any champ who gets scripts". It happened to cass, it's gonna happen to Kat. I don't condone cheating, but I hope every champ gets a script soon so riot can wake the fuck up. Aw who am I kidding, they'll probably just ignore it at that point like they do the bots.
Rinky Dinky3 votesKatarina should not be able to ult twice in a teamfight at level 6. I have personally seen a kat ult three times in one minute at level 6. That is ridiculous. So they stopped her from doing so. Not even that big of a nerf. She has the same power she did in the lategame, and will still destroy in teamfights. She just wont say "hahaha you're all dead".
"Hefty" is very dramatic. Wanna know what could be considered a "Hefty" nerf? Removing a champs only way of engaging safely with no compensation. Rest in piece Talon.
This is one of the few nerfs I think riot got right. Normally they would 100% gut the champ (Ex: Skarner after rework. Got one week, then was dumpstered)
Riot needs to stop worshipping their few chosen champs and actually be fair. What they did to Olaf was not fair. What they did to Talon was not fair. What they just recently did to Zilean was not fair.
I know this is gonna piss people off, but Dota 2 doesnt have these problems. On the competitive level, every single hero is played. In one of their worlds series, only 7 were not played. Compare that to league where only 50% were picked/banned, and out of that, only 20% were played repeatedly.
And no, im not gonna go play Dota, as i personally just dont enjoy that game as much as league, and I enjoy leagues aesthetics more, and find leagues champs more interesting.
Yep, rant confirmed.
chumbler3 votesKatarina should not be able to ult twice in a teamfight at level 6. I have personally seen a kat ult three times in one minute at level 6. That is ridiculous. So they stopped her from doing so. Not even that big of a nerf. She has the same power she did in the lategame, and will still destroy in teamfights. She just wont say "hahaha you're all dead".
"Hefty" is very dramatic. Wanna know what could be considered a "Hefty" nerf? Removing a champs only way of engaging safely with no compensation. Rest in piece Talon.
This is one of the few nerfs I think riot got right. Normally they would 100% gut the champ (Ex: Skarner after rework. Got one week, then was dumpstered)
Riot needs to stop worshipping their few chosen champs and actually be fair. What they did to Olaf was not fair. What they did to Talon was not fair. What they just recently did to Zilean was not fair.
I know this is gonna piss people off, but Dota 2 doesnt have these problems. On the competitive level, every single hero is played. In one of their worlds series, only 7 were not played. Compare that to league where only 50% were picked/banned, and out of that, only 20% were played repeatedly.
And no, im not gonna go play Dota, as i personally just dont enjoy that game as much as league, and I enjoy leagues aesthetics more, and find leagues champs more interesting.
Yep, rant confirmed.
The problem is damage is literally the only thing she does, and if she can't do it, especially early, there's no reason to ever use her. And they're dumping on her damage without doing anything to still keep her in the game. But yeah, as you say, she's just not one of the Chosen champions and thus has no protection.
And yes, dota 2 is a much better game, because it's actually developed by people with a clue (and doesn't have a business model that is a giant middle finger to its players).
Ninpire1 votesAnd yes, dota 2 is a much better game, because it's actually developed by people with a clue (and doesn't have a business model that is a giant middle finger to its players).
im so tempted to just go to dota forums if they exist and look for a post that says league is better
AmightyT1 votesMaybe we'd ask too much of Riot to match Valve's perfectionism, but you're right this is total crap.
Star Warden3 votesKatarina has that "Fiora Effect" (a term I first heard used by Gbay99, but very relevant)
She does nothing but mass amounts of dps, she has no real source of cc, but this makes her perfect for carrying solo queue. If other people can do just a minor amount of cc, the fed, raw dps champs, can easily come in and clean house.
The problem is that snowballing is a mid-late game feature which is meant to share your feed with your team. You become unstoppable, and make sure you win every fight, so your team can then take objectives. The problem is in the application of snowballing, where you see people become unstoppable with no counterplay. A level 6 ultimate that can be used 3 times in one minute is stupidly strong. Even if you deny the full ultimate, it hemorrhages damage making it impossible to keep her pinned for long.
I honestly wish that players would think before they complain. You are comparing a champion (lee sin) who's only good at forcing a snowball on either himself or others in the early/mid game. To a champion meant to nuke people at all stages of the game post level 6. Their purposes are completely different and they should be treated as such.
Another player mentioned a 70% ban rate in Korea. A lot of people in the NA server think Ezreal sucks, but he is one of the safest and easiest marksmen to win bot lane with, and the Koreans can prove that one. Look at Korean stats before you complain. If they are winning 60% of the time or more with just one champion, it needs to be looked at to see if it is op, or the players have found some mechanic that makes it op.
A Rusty Venture2 votesOh no!Increased cooldowns on an assassin who can probably get a triple by facerolling the keyboard??AND less damage on an already high scaling ulti??WHATEVER WILL WE DO?!?!? Seriously,though I understand what you're saying cause Lee Sin has avoided nerfs like he avoids,well pretty much everything else in game.Pretty sure he'll get his ass handed to him in the new Jungle but we'll wait and see.On another note:Kat needed this nerf,Seeing a Kat in Hexakill was basically GG even with all the CC in the world and seeing her in normals are almost as bad cause if you're not a someone who has good poke/disengage/etc you're gonna get all in'd Level 4.Especially if she has jungle help.So yeah,these nerfs are justified.
chumbler2 votesOr it could be that people haven't worked out the right counters to her yet, or that Riot has been steadily nerfing the things that counter her (silences, hard ccs) because they're "anti-fun", or that Riot has never actually done anything to address snowballing that isn't just nerfing numbers.
Nah, clearly the better solution is to just knee jerk nerf, because that has always worked beautifully in the past.
shaex1 votesWHAT IS HER NERF?!
Matthevv1 votesThe difference being the difficulty for playing as and against these champions. Lee Sin takes a good amount of skill to really utilize him to the point that he is too strong and he can be just as easily outplayed.
Katarina on the other hand, if she is big, you are dead.
Or it could be that people haven't worked out the right counters to her yet, or that Riot has been steadily nerfing the things that counter her (silences, hard ccs) because they're "anti-fun", or that Riot has never actually done anything to address snowballing that isn't just nerfing numbers.
Nah, clearly the better solution is to just knee jerk nerf, because that has always worked beautifully in the past.
Katarina is a beta champion, believe me when I tell you her counters have been worked out a long long time ago.
chumbler2 votesThe difference being the difficulty for playing as and against these champions. Lee Sin takes a good amount of skill to really utilize him to the point that he is too strong and he can be just as easily outplayed.
Katarina on the other hand, if she is big, you are dead.
Or it could be that people haven't worked out the right counters to her yet, or that Riot has been steadily nerfing the things that counter her (silences, hard ccs) because they're "anti-fun", or that Riot has never actually done anything to address snowballing that isn't just nerfing numbers.
Nah, clearly the better solution is to just knee jerk nerf, because that has always worked beautifully in the past.
Katarina is a beta champion, believe me when I tell you her counters have been worked out a long long time ago.
Apparently people forgot those counters since then. Also you seem to have missed that the comment about Lee Sin was that he on his own dictated the jungle for an entire season (arguably more) and has no real weaknesses, and next season's jungle is looking like a giant buff to him, while Kat has clear weaknesses, does literally one thing for a team, and has come back into play only because everyone else got nerfed. Yet only one of the two gets the nerf bat. Hint: It's the one that isn't one of Riot's favored champions.
Knee jerk nerfing Kat is stupid, but then stupid is the Riot's balance MO.