He has the power to one shot you while having an out at any time as well as a 500-1k shield late game and a giant AOE stun.
This champion just has way to much utility and defensive tools to be a balanced assassin in the game, he has to commit nothing to All in's cause he has a way out with his ult.
I would take Tank ekko not doing half of someone's hp with an E that is 2 dashes and on a low cooldown
Revali9 voteshe has to commit nothing to All in's cause he has a way out with his ult.
150 / 300 / 450 (+ 150% AP) sure is nothing to lose at all.
Ekko is the 'defensive' assassin of choice, think about it, every assassin goes ham, ekko prefers to set it up for his team and take out the targets that don't think are his actual target. while they take care of the people who got caught by a 3 second telegraphed zone.
Doseqis6 votesExcept ekko can randomly just E onto you with no prep and Q auto you for a one shot late game and have his ult for an out.
the fact his W gives him a reward for missing it is pretty stupid and he already has enough free tankyness already
Divewing9 votesIt's all fair considering he completely oozes counterplay and warning. Literally everything about Ekko is telegraphed. Q has a delay before returning, W has a travel time and warning indicator, E has a "cast time", and his R literally tells you where he will end up.
Compare that to Tank Ekko who spams Es beating you over the head with endless slows thanks to IBG, I'd take getting 1 shot because I was either outplayed or stupid any day.
freeloader255 votestelegraphed? yes, no doubt.
counterplay? well... maybe if his w wouldnt work as huge zoning tool from 1600 range away. am i supposed to run around the whole thing if he throws it behind me? because otherwise i get slowed or stunned and run down. why does it slow me for 40% if he isnt even close? its incredible easy for ekko to close a gap and all he needs to kill a squishy is e-first q-auto-auto (and maybe second q) which is basically undeniable once he closed the gap. and if he throws it from fog of war...well... i have 0.5 seconds to see the thing and react to it :D the stun isnt even hard to hit in a lot of situations with this small of a time window for the enemy to react
and if he uses it correct in trades he doesnt even have to stun the enemy in order to make trading back impossible due to this bullshit shield that scales with 150% ap.
if a champion is so extremely overloaded his numbers need to be trash in order to be balanced, but when ekko kills squishies with 2 abilities i kinda doubt this is the case.
I'd be fine with ekko being able to play this effective in offense if he lacked defense, but i doubt theres any assasin that has more ways to leave a fight even if the engage didnt kill the target. w, retarded high ms boost on passive, ulti. just compare this to akali, rengar, khazix...
i agree with op, the first thing they need to get rid off is rewarding him in several ways for missing his w. giving an assasin such a great zoning tool is the worst idea possible, just look at rengar.
Divewing2 votesTotally would be fine with removing shield UNLESS he stuns a champion.
The other thing i forgot to mention is that unlike tank ekko, ap ekko dies fast as you can blink (see Jensen game 5 finals)
DarkHeadgear1 votestelegraphed? yes, no doubt.
counterplay? well... maybe if his w wouldnt work as huge zoning tool from 1600 range away. am i supposed to run around the whole thing if he throws it behind me? because otherwise i get slowed or stunned and run down. why does it slow me for 40% if he isnt even close? its incredible easy for ekko to close a gap and all he needs to kill a squishy is e-first q-auto-auto (and maybe second q) which is basically undeniable once he closed the gap. and if he throws it from fog of war...well... i have 0.5 seconds to see the thing and react to it :D the stun isnt even hard to hit in a lot of situations with this small of a time window for the enemy to react
and if he uses it correct in trades he doesnt even have to stun the enemy in order to make trading back impossible due to this bullshit shield that scales with 150% ap.
if a champion is so extremely overloaded his numbers need to be trash in order to be balanced, but when ekko kills squishies with 2 abilities i kinda doubt this is the case.
I'd be fine with ekko being able to play this effective in offense if he lacked defense, but i doubt theres any assasin that has more ways to leave a fight even if the engage didnt kill the target. w, retarded high ms boost on passive, ulti. just compare this to akali, rengar, khazix...
i agree with op, the first thing they need to get rid off is rewarding him in several ways for missing his w. giving an assasin such a great zoning tool is the worst idea possible, just look at rengar.
It's not like there's a big animation ekko performs and sound that happens and any kind of prediction possible to dodge his impending AoE skillshot along with a fade-in of the location.
Oh wait--
Zerenza1 votesEkko's E has a dash then a blink, the dash is meant to give you an indication that he's coming, it makes it easy to land CC on him such as lux Q. His E+Q Combo will not one shot anyone late game unless they are SEVERELY behind or ekko is REALLY FAR ahead, it just doesn't do enough damage once everyone bought their items. It's a great way to trade in lane though if the person isn't smart enough to tell what's happening. Also last time i checked his W only gives him a shield if he steps inside it, which means that you know where he's most likely going to be during the time that it's up, it also has a 2 second delay before dropping and can only stun if he's inside or ults through it, not to mention the stun isn't very long compared to many other stuns in the game since it was nerfed.
His ultimate is not the best way to escape a fight, when i use ekko i use it to go back in with W to get a big stun and heal so i can fight somemore. Not to mention having to keep track of where you were 4 seconds ago at all times is pretty difficult and can get you into a lot of trouble if your not careful with ekko.
Edit: "Every champion needs something about them that makes them strong or feels broken to use, if they didn't the game would be boring."- Riot Meddler 2016
freeloader251 votes210% ap, 500 base dmg, ~15% missing hp dmg, 2 autos, thunderlords, lichbane procc from lvl 13 on. this indeed can kill a squishy.
if someone gets hit by ekkos ultimate in his w, he is completely stupid. that gotta be the easiest to evade move in the entire game. so against anyone with even the slightest idea of positioning, using his ultimate this way wont work and most likely lead to your own death.
1.75 seconds aoe stun on an assasin isnt very long? thats more than syndra and annie (pre11) offer for example.
and yes, every champion needs something to feel strong, thats not the problem. the problem is that ekko is way too hard to punish for poorly engaging and messing up because his kit is poorly balanced between offensive and defensive use.
ChaddyFantome1 votesEkko's E has a dash then a blink, the dash is meant to give you an indication that he's coming, it makes it easy to land CC on him such as lux Q.
Except the blink will allow him to dodge Lux Q.
Sohleks2 votes'Defensive' assassin is whats pushing him to be arguably 'unhealthy'
Not just by his fight skills it extends to his laning phase too, that by giving him a great primary waveclear spell on a kit with such wonderful tools he's a very consistent assassin that's absolutely gonna be relevant at the high level if any good at all.
Ekko isn't actually expected to always land his stun or his ult damage. He wins without that. It's usually one of the other or a very clean pick on a squishy target. He has multiple different win conditions as a champion and this freedom and power does make him fun to play I admit.
AP Ekko was never actually weak when tank Ekko was busted. Pretty balanced actually. He's probably overbuffed now.
On an unrelated note he ironically has one of the coolest tank skills as far as gameplay goes: his W. Most tanks just do simple direct no thinking stuff. But with his W he can peel melee off himself to reduce damage or combo it aggressively or try to sneak it unto enemies.
hhaavviikk9 votesif anything I find ekko a healthier assassin than most assassins, he has to stay in range and AA you unless you manage to somehow get hit by his Q on the way back
Doseqis1 votesAn assassin that can get out of almost any situation, has permaslow and giant AOE cc and he still gets a reward even when he misses it?
Zed is by far the model for assassins, high skill cap and floor and can one shot people and get out but has clear weaknesses such as his waveclear is lacklustre and energy. Ekko just has no commitment in his kit, he can mess up majorly and still get out scott free
Zerenza1 votesIn the midlane i most play assassins, Katarina is my favorite personally but what the hell are you talking about zed having a clear weakness with his waveclear and energy. That's zed's main strength in lane, he can outsustain someone who has mana for example and that can litterally win a game in of itself, his waveclear is incredible, i have never had that good CS on an assassin except with zed, he's so easy to farm with, his passive is litterally for last hitting minions, that's it.
Ekko does have to commit, not only is there a sound that you can hear when he cast's his W, it also has a visual indicator up to 2 seconds before he casts it because, newsflash, he has to predict 2 seconds ahead to hit his stun. His Q is his only good trading tool with any competent midlaner who knows how to punish a melee champion well, his E is nice for him but it makes him easy to hit with say, a lux snare? His R isn't meant to be an escape tool, a good ekko will use it for it's damage not for the escape unless he absolutely has to get out, even then it might not save him because he has to constantly remember where he was 4 seconds ago.
MysterQ1 votesHis R is not an escape tool... unless you are every Ekko anywhere, including LCS.
ChaddyFantome3 votesWhile i agree with your points about Ekko, i long since disagree with your points about Zed.
Zed in terms of his assassination pattern might be healthy, but his laning phase is aids.
He is basically a resourceless AD mage that can choose to become an assassin at any point he chooses. In terms of overall health, that honor I feel goes to Talon currently, as he has to commit to some degree to get any meaningful damage off , even in simple trades, is mana gated and has more telegraphed and limited options in terms of lane power.
Also, Zed can pretty much do what Ekko does by pressing R again after he ultis.
MysterQ1 votesHe would be healthy, if his ultimate wasn't a reset button. Seriously he dives then resets and heals and does damage. Change his ultimate and he is fine. But then I'm not sure what it would be.unless you want to say his ultimate requires skill.
Hello I am Bird1 votesTo prevent his heal, use grievous wounds or don't burst him, instead favoring long trades Don't go near his ult clone to dodge the damage from his ult
MysterQ1 votesSo don't fight him. Don't fight him. Just stay back. +Don't hurt him.
Hello I am Bird1 votesUhm, to inflict grievous wounds you have to actively fight him??? Also dodging his ult clone in 90% of cases doesn't require not fighting him, just fighting around him Extended fight ≠ don't hurt him
You're just trying to phrase everything I say just to prove your point despite the fact that all of your generalizations are completely opposite of my point. Besides stay back, which isn't always a terribly option. You don't have to be ham 100% of the time
MysterQ1 votesWas in response to your new reply and an earlier replay from someone else.
"He has 2 skillshots, and his ultimate can't hurt you if you aren't fighting. In the most non-toxic way I can say this, I think you're just not good enough. Walk besides his circle, avoid his dash range, dodge his AoE stun, and don't fight him around his ult if you can't kill him."
The issue isn't just his healing, but that he gets in and out without risk. Grievous wounds won't help when he is too far to catch. I can hardly recall his ult ever being used as a damage source, I am more annoyed by it being a get out of jail free card. What does an extended fight solve. Unless I can reengage on him after he backs out with his ult, it doesn't matter if I hurt him slowly or quickly. The only help is if you aren't burst at least you can continue to poke him instead of waiting for CDs. Or maybe you can tank so you don't get deleted.
I am sure I can improve in my play vs him. But that doesn't make his non-commitment diving any less of a problem.
Hello I am Bird1 votesWhile I'll agree that his get out of jail free ult is annoying, don't complain about other factors of the ult when they aren't a problem The mobility is the problem, not the heal or damage. The heal and damage being tacked onto the mobility doesn't inherently make it bad, because there are ways to play against both of them.
MysterQ1 votesI don't think I ever complained about the damage myself. I could care less about the damage, because again I never ever see it used for damage. Maybe once and that seemed more like it was by chance than purposeful.
The heal is an issue though. So I will mention it. Going from 10% health deep under turret to hundred of units away (at the instant click of a button) + a heal which means your entire damage was negated it just a stupid mechanic. What is it promoting.
MysterQ4 votes
I'm about to get nerfed.
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.
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Psyche, ulted out.
Seriously annoying champion. But most champions with excessive mobility have issues imo.
undesirable team2 votes
Seriously annoying champion. But most champions with excessive mobility have issues imo.
*all champions with excessive mobility
Xavanic2 votesYou forgot 
and 
there bud, maybe a bit of 
aswell, top that off with a nice 
and 
and you cant ever forget to include and i guess 
undesirable team1 votesYou forgot
forgot 
Glîtchy1 votes*all champions with excessive mobility
Ahri is probably the only one even close to balanced in that list, because she devours mana INSANELY fast
DarkHeadgear1 votesAhri is probably the only one even close to balanced in that list, because she devours mana INSANELY fast
You are silver 5. What are you basing your assertions off of?
Glîtchy1 votesYou are silver 5. What are you basing your assertions off of?
Here's what she doesn't have that those have:
Fizz: has invulnerability every 6 seconds and scales with 75% of his current AP
Yasuo: Wind wall that blocks ALL projectiles and gets a shield by just walking around which will fully negate the next source of damage.
Shaco: Invisibility that cannot be unveiled, crits every 5 or so seconds, and a dupe.
Katarina: passive the resets cooldown and doesn't need mana to use abilities.
Talon: endless jumps
Ekko: able to go tank OR AP and still be strong either way.
Kass: impossible to gank and has 5 teleports that go as far as Ahri's dashes.
Zed: gets a "haha fuck you!" If his ult's initial hit didn't kill you.
Vayne: true damage every 3rd hit.
Lucian: various builds that make you wish you could delete him from league
DarkHeadgear1 votes*all champions with excessive mobility
Yes, this is correct. I don't know why you are being downvoted. I completely agree with you. People will whine about mobile champions because it doesn't seem "fair" to them. It completely is fair, they just don't understand how to counter such champions.
PhDs Nuts2 votesHis ult isn't an out "at any time", just ask Jensen.
ChaddyFantome1 votesFinally! Someone else agrees!
DarkHeadgear1 votesHe has 2 skillshots, and his ultimate can't hurt you if you aren't fighting. In the most non-toxic way I can say this, I think you're just not good enough. Walk besides his circle, avoid his dash range, dodge his AoE stun, and don't fight him around his ult if you can't kill him.
MysterQ2 votesDon't fight him. Don't fight him. Just stay back.
Sounds healthy and fun. And the problem at least in my ELO isn't his Ult doing damage. It is him diving recklessly then ulting out to not only avoid death but to also heal.
DarkHeadgear1 votesDon't fight him. Don't fight him. Just stay back.
Sounds healthy and fun. And the problem at least in my ELO isn't his Ult doing damage. It is him diving recklessly then ulting out to not only avoid death but to also heal.
If he doesn't ult to engage and you still die you are just bad. He isn't fast without his ultimate, you need to be cognizant of Yi's location. If you are, how can you ever die to him if you are keeping track of him? Spam ping your team to fall back if he's fed, if not, flash/heal/cc/dash/focus_him to safety. And win the teamfight because Yi is useless. No doubt, both of his know his gameplay is linear. Turn on ult, run into the enemies, use Q to engage and avoid damage, auto and kill then get extended ult, auto kill reset, auto kill reset, get out and W the last tower shot or biggest point of burst in the teamfight. If you CC him at all in that process and/or avoid his damage by positioning or reacting better, congrats, you beat Yi.
Doseqis1 votesHis E Q auto does a crapton of damage it has a 80% ratio on passive 90% of Q that is near impossible to dodge with the slow and his E has a 40% ratio so 210% ap ratio all together i'm pretty sure thats enough to kill someone especially with protobelt lich bane and base damage ontop of that
DarkHeadgear1 votes[{quoted}](name=Le Shenpai,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=rvdl0wKj,comment-id=0004000000000000,timestamp=2017-05-04T07:09:38.295+0000)
His E Q auto does a crapton of damage it has a 80% ratio on passive 90% of Q that is near impossible to dodge with the slow and his E has a 40% ratio so 210% ap ratio all together i'm pretty sure thats enough to kill someone especially with protobelt lich bane and base damage ontop of that
Ekko is good at killing you no doubt, so don't be killed by him. It's simple. Two of his spells are null in combat, and 2 of them are all he has.
If you are getting beat by a champion only using 2 spells, I feel sorry for you.
Best princess EU1 votesNo