If Critical CHANCE is going to forever be a thing

Tentakill Myself··9 votes·891 views

Why can't we have Dodge CHANCE back to counter it (max 50% dodge or something idk)?

Thoughts?

21 Comments

Teridax684 votes

Dodge used to exist back in the early stages of League, but got removed due to how the combination of its random nature and complete negation of damage made it a) not really fun to have around, even for champions who successfully dodged attacks, and b) broken on champions who could stack it to high amounts, particularly back when random mechanics were truly random, and not pseudorandom as they are now (Jax, especially, could 1v5 the entire enemy team under the nexus obelisk).

To be fair, critical chance has some similar issues, and its dependence on RNG makes it sometimes feel unfair for both parties involved, as well as seriously unhealthy at low amounts (1% crit rune setups should, by all rights, not exist). It's not nearly as bad as dodge, but it does eventually need to change in order to carry genuine gameplay of its own. It's bad for a game that prides itself on its competitive scene and player skill-centric gameplay to have such a core mechanic (and, by extension, an entire class) rely so heavily on dumb luck, but it's also equally terrible that said mechanic brings massive amounts of power without any real gameplay of its own. I don't think it should just be removed, as it has the potential to be truly interesting and allows autoattackers to become uniquely powerful over time, but I really want the mechanic to end up being non-random, while also capable of producing original and fun gameplay.

Saianna1 votes

What you've said at the beginning was Riots reason behind removing dodge.

Unhealthy Unfun OP on certain champions (Jax)

Dodge was removed, Jax, Sivir, PD changed

Yet Everything that made dodge bad is still in Crit mechanic. But lets be honest, they won't remove or rework it any time soon.

rampaging poet1 votes

Not everything. Dodge was also bad because it has anti-synergy with other defensive stats. Because dodge negated attacks entirely your armour and health were worth less the more dodge chance you had. Crit chance, on the other hand, is better the more AD you have.

Saianna1 votes

Yea.. True.

But I still believe removing it was bad idea.

It could be reworked it something fitting LoL.

Teridax681 votes

I'm hopeful that crit will get a pass in the upcoming marksman update, since it's pretty much the stat defining ADCs and their power. Rito's had trouble finding a proper alternative for years, but the addition of new mechanics, as well as the expansion of older ones, means there are a lot of potential avenues now, with three-strike effects being a likely candidate, imo. For example, if, instead of randomly dealing bonus damage on every auto, every third auto instead counted as a crit, and let you soup up that moment via abilities and items (and not just with damage, either), you could end up with power that would be very similar to crit while carrying a lot more gameplay, with the potential to expand in effects (so you could have crits provide CC or utility of some kind, and thereby tone down marksmen as pure late-game DPS pumps) and classes who'd benefit from it (AP crit could actually make sense, particularly on autoattack-based AP champions).

Cowgirl Ed3 votes

Critical is retarded it's good in rpg's and other games like those, but this is an arena multiplayer game no sense in it (unless you use a counter to it)

Stars Shaper2 votes

Items/masteries that reduce crit damage are enough imo.

Shroom Junkie3 votes

Eh, 10% less damage for at least 13 points in Defense isn't very good... especially since they can get runes for more crit damage and Infinity Edge. AA's doing 500+ damage at 1.5 AS is kinda hardcore considering they don't end...

EK Kimozzi2 votes

{quoted}

Eh, 10% less damage for at least 13 points in Defense isn't very good... especially since they can get runes for more crit damage and Infinity Edge. AA's doing 500+ damage at 1.5 AS is kinda hardcore considering they don't end...

so far i saw nobody using crit damage runes unless they are pulling off 5 ie gp or something.

Dar Raksada1 votes

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so far i saw nobody using crit damage runes unless they are pulling off 5 ie gp or something.

I've seen ashe use it, iirc it's more damage starting at +- 80 ad (and some crit chance)

Stars Shaper1 votes

There is always space for more items with focus on crit damage reduction anyway.

Shroom Junkie1 votes

Only Randuin's Omen, and that might only multiply rather than add(not sure). So 20% or less crit reduct vs 50% or more extra crit damage, it helps a lot but not enough to be too prominent as they still burst you down a lot. And then there's armor obviously but that's with all physical damage(and same with MR for magic damage).

Stars Shaper1 votes

I mean that I'm not against the introduction of more items with focus on crit defense

Shroom Junkie1 votes

Oohhh, I see. Sorry, I misunderstood you. And yeah, I think if they're going to keep crit reduction they should put in more crit defense as well.

Stars Shaper1 votes

Np I got that :P

From what I see Riot is trying to make critical hit chance less canon by giving other mechanics to champions (see Ashe) or making it less of a chance (see Yasuo).

Shroom Junkie1 votes

I don't think they should add Dodge Chance back as its kinda OP and might break Jax... but its definitely a good example of why crit chance shouldn't be here either.

Dar Raksada1 votes

If they're going to keep crit randomness in I'd like dodge randomness back.

Embertine1 votes

I've had 10% crit chance and crit 3 times in a row. 50% dodge chance is op as fuck.

IcyPepper1 votes

I don't think dodge really counters critical chance specifically, it would counter aa in general. Anyone who autos but can't afford purchasing enough crit to matter will be hurt more than ranged carries who can afford crit, specifically bruisers.

Instead of dodge, I like the idea of item 3143. I feel like there should be at least one more item with anti-crit defense.

Narasimha1 votes

Theres a major difference.

Crit only adds to your damage. No matter what, theres still a minimum amount of damage you are doing if you don't crit. But dodge meant you took NO damage at all. It completely negated an attack. It would be frustrating to lose because your opponent got a critical hit, but its far worse to lose because you couldn't get a hit at all.

BenParadox1 votes

Because Dodge chance is unfair. I do not really like critical chance for the same reason. It does appear to be the dodge stats counterpart.

I'd rather get rid of Critical Chance. However, this would require a lot of changes to champs and masteries. It would also involve refunding Critical Chance runes hopefully. Tryndamere, Ashe, and Yasuo have critical chance as important parts of their kits. Granted, Ashe could substitute something else for the damage cit chance adds to Frost Shot, and Yasuo could be compensated in some other way. As for Tryn, he needs a rework.

That does not mean Crit Chance has to be removed though, as it is not as bad as dodge. I just wouldn't mind if it disappeared, especially since it would increase marksman build diversity, since most marksman would no longer rush IE.

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