I think we should revert the gromp nerfs

chide da jungler·Sep 4, 2015·159 votes·4,305 views

Gromp was nerfed when cinderhulk/thornmail was strong. Well... cinderhulk got nerfed and thornmail is horrible now. I think it would be nice for tank champs if we could buff gromp again.

59 Comments

TurquoiseYoshiSep 4, 201547 votes

I hate it when Riot nerfs something due to its synergy with something else, then nerfs the something else and doesn't revert the first nerf.

Laustin SpaceSep 4, 20159 votes

This seems to be a sad reoccurring mistake Riot has been making for a while now. :/

FistOfSharkieshaSep 5, 201530 votes

Kassadin Veigar So do we.

TurquoiseYoshiSep 5, 201524 votes

Sejuani

WutsKrakenSep 5, 201519 votes

Warwick

TurquoiseYoshiSep 5, 20153 votes

Well, WW got a big buff from Sated being introduced. Back before then, yeah, you're right.

DeusVultSep 5, 20155 votes

He has less to do with sated than most others because it doesnt work with his ult

TurquoiseYoshiSep 5, 20151 votes

Anyone who can use Sated in any way, should. It's really useful. Hell, I've seen a Sated Trundle, just because his kit works with BotRK. And he didn't lose us the game.

FistOfSharkieshaSep 6, 20151 votes

If you buy bork at all you should go sated. Udyr's building cinderhulk and warrior are just ridiculous. His clear speed is already so good you might as well sate. Works magic with wit's end as well.

TurquoiseYoshiSep 6, 20151 votes

Honestly, BotRK is way too powerful currently. It has synergy with basically everything powerful currently.

FistOfSharkieshaSep 6, 20151 votes

Yeah slap it on a champion that is building otherwise 100% tanky and they can wear the enemies hp down and let assassins clean up.

BeoridasSep 5, 20151 votes

to be fair--she was buffed at the same time as cinder came in.

TurquoiseYoshiSep 5, 20151 votes

True, but she got nerfed multiple times along with Cinderhulk without compensation.

BeoridasSep 5, 20151 votes

that depends how riot wants her to be. if she was weaker than before her buffs then id agree. but cinder is much better than wtv stuff was in before. I dont have an opinion on it other that Riot needs to show how they want the meta to be.

TurquoiseYoshiSep 5, 20151 votes

It isn't that she's weaker than before, it's that she isn't viable. At all. There is literally no reason to play Sejuani anymore when her niche is filled by so many better picks (Gragas, Amumu).

BeoridasSep 5, 20151 votes

now that i think of it. The only thing that comes to mind that does make her weaker than before is her ult nerfs. She would be fine otherwise but shes actually weaker than pre buff state.

TurquoiseYoshiSep 5, 20151 votes

The thing is, she seemed to have been nerfed to be equal to her pre-buff, pre-Cinderhulk state, but everyone else that could use CInderhulk was helped out by it, making her just worse than that.

BeoridasSep 5, 20151 votes

i dont see how tbh. Not many uses cinderhulk anyway and the users were moved to support or top role instead.

So who to compare it to? cinderhulk isnt that bad. just less dmg (health is similar, someone did the math) But her ult nerfs were massive tho. You should check them out.

TurquoiseYoshiSep 5, 20151 votes

Which jungler was moved from the jungle to top or support after cinderhulk came out?

Cinderhulk got a direct nerf, then a nerf to its late game, then the most recent change which was generally similar.

BeoridasSep 6, 20151 votes

nautilus, trundle and shen went to support professionally. (nautilus being moved to top aswell) Sej also was played mid too (not professionally tho)

Also, someone made the math about the changes made to cinder (health) and the difference was laughably small late game. Its really more of a buff to the early mid game and a slight slight tiny nerf to the late game. Very worth imo. You can try the math urself if you dont believe me.

TurquoiseYoshiSep 6, 20151 votes

Cinderhulk was added in 5.6, nerfed in 5.7, nerfed in 5.9, and got it's recent change in 5.16.

BeoridasSep 6, 20151 votes

so i guess that means no?

old cinder: 300+25% bonus health= 2k bonus= total of 800 from item New cinder: 400+15% bonus health= 2k bonus = total of 700 from item.

nothing to significant when ur 4k hp. very small nerf to late but a decent early game buff.

the nerf was also more to the dmg it provided. nothing significant.

TurquoiseYoshiSep 6, 20151 votes

In 5.7, it got a 50 HP nerf, as well as an added 50 gold to the build.

BeoridasSep 5, 20151 votes

that couldnt be any truer.

Joe DreddSep 5, 20153 votes

i hate when people even act like veigar needed dfg

FistOfSharkieshaSep 5, 20151 votes

He didn't need it to function but it was certainly a core buy for him. It's the fact that they nerfed the fuck out of them when they should have been compensating him.

Joe DreddSep 5, 20151 votes

My friend's go to mid was veigar season four and he never built dfg. He had a 70% win rate with him.

HandheldBrandonSep 5, 20159 votes

Remember when Akali Was OP but instead they nerfed item 3146 Which made Jax Kayle Mordekaiser Really really weak and then they turned around and nerfed Akali after but left Jax Kayle in a poor state until.

Then they buffed Jax Too much but left Kayle Mordekaiser in a poor spot then had to nerf Jax Because he was too ridiculous.

All that could have been avoided if they had just fucking nerfed Akali in the first place.

DownfallSep 5, 20152 votes

Kayle? Really weak?? Not trying to be rude or anything but she WAS one of the most popular devourer junglers, which the community flagged as broken and OP.

FistOfSharkieshaSep 5, 20151 votes

She was weak before devourer. They buffed Kayle massively when they introduced devourer so it was a double whammy. They increased her scaling while introducing an item that allowed her to be op as fuck. She's still weak in lane.

I think you're getting your timelines confused.

DesideriumSep 5, 20151 votes

It's part of their tactic to give their game more longevity. Make sideways, turn-around balance decisions, then EVENTUALLY make the right choice after undoing all the wrong ones. If Riot really wanted to keep their game balanced, it already would be.

OyddAWqJ5rSep 5, 20151 votes

Maybe we should spam the forums to get their attention the next time they forget to do this.

YfrappefortSep 5, 20153 votes

{quoted}

I hate it when Riot nerfs something due to its synergy with something else, then nerfs the something else and doesn't revert the first nerf.

You mean like they did to Sejuani ? Nerf to Gromp. Nerf to her damage. Nerf to her utility. Nerf to Cinderhulk. Nerf to Thornmail (and armor items overall).

Meta shift. No compensation buffs given back. Story of pretty much all tanks.

TurquoiseYoshiSep 5, 20151 votes

Exactly. And with Warrior. And with DFG.

Dr PoroSep 4, 201512 votes

+1 Funny that Riot said in this patch that they regularly revert changes. Yet, there are so many changes that could be reverted and make the game more balanced. (Kassadin's Mr/lvl, Warrior's 5 AD)

DemaciaClownSep 4, 20156 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dr Poro,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=rG7cuJvV,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-09-04T17:01:20.012+0000)

+1 Funny that Riot said in this patch that they regularly revert changes. Yet, there are so many changes that could be reverted and make the game more balanced. (Kassadin's Mr/lvl)

FTFY

Warrior got 5 ad back on the PBE.

Laustin SpaceSep 4, 20153 votes

Took them a few patch's to realize it needed to happen when it should've been obvious. xD

I GANK LANESSep 5, 20152 votes

shittt... 5 ad. it needs an actual buff

CubedJusticeSep 5, 20152 votes

I also think we should buff gromp. I want gromp to become another epic monster, you need a four man leash to kill it.

TotalJerkSep 5, 20151 votes

They've made tanks more focused on health stacking than resistance. That means most tanks will have more health to factor into Gromp's damage

MaikalSep 5, 20151 votes

They should buff gromp buff so that it's good on ALL champions. Not just tank junglers. It feels really underwhelming to smite it even before the nerfs for non-tanks.

Joe DreddSep 5, 20151 votes

Thornmail Horrible pick one