I can't remember the last time I saw anyone play Zac. Riot has nerfed his AP ratios significantly since his release (because apparently tanks aren't allowed to do damage), and a lot of the items he uses (spirit visage) have also been nerfed. If health regen is toxic to this game so be it, but please buff his base health/health per level and health regen. I love this champ but there is absolutely no reason to play him in his current state.
ProfDrDeath8 votesRiot has nerfed his AP ratios significantly since his release (because apparently tanks aren't allowed to do damage)
Wrong. His AP ratios were never touched.
He could use a buff, though.
Vertanium4 votesAP ratios on basic skills no, his ult (arguably one of the most vital parts on his kit) Had a whole slew of nerfs, along with his blobs (another vital aspect) its like Hecarim really, he saw competitive play, and riot being massive hypocrites decided to nerf him, even though he was exactly what LCS teams wanted/ needed (he has awesome teamfighting and his godly initiation range is easy to coordinate) He could be fixed in a variety of ways like making his costs flat, Abilites that scale off of HP, give him his tenacity back and making blobs more reliable to name a few.
Rew7111 votesI miss his old Ult and that passive needs to be sped up a little.
Vertanium2 votesexactly what I was saying, give him tenacity back, and make his blobs better/more reliable. really hope we gets some red posts here. I love to play zac.
doubleguac1 votesits like Hecarim really, he saw competitive play, and riot being massive hypocrites decided to nerf him
Hecarim didn't see all that much competitive play. He was nerfed more for dominating solo queue than dominating competitive play.
I'm not sure how nerfing Zac makes Riot hypocritical. He was grossly overpowered on release, and deserved nerfs (though he definitely eventually got overnerfed). How were the nerfs hypocritical?
Vertanium1 votesHec got played once by saint before nerfs even then he didn't do that well, The itemization killed him. Zac was pretty heavily picked, but riot talks about diversity, and then every time you see an LCS player bust out the Lux, or generally make the casters go "wow haven't seen that since season X" It either fails, works by being highly situational, or it works and then it gets nerfed patches later. Riot hates the idea of power creep (olaf for example) so they refuse to just revert nerfs that were a problem before you had X champion that does X thing to counter X thing.
Bassoonist2 votesI would honestly disagree with this.
Zac suffers from not a week kit, but weak itemization. I have played alot of him in the past through a range of ELO's and his kit is actually very impactful and does promote a tanky play-style, however because of AD Fighter Jungler's ability to have amazing itemization, they generally outclass the weak itemization of tanky junglers, and are still able to be tanky into the late game.
With buffs to Randuins, upcoming tank Jungle Item Buffs, and what I suspect to be an upcoming Spirit Visage buff, Zac should come back into play in the preseason.
If Zac was to receive buffs, he would be put into the same situation as Rumble. If you can remember, Rumble received a few unnecessary buffs this summer in 4.10 (Correct me if I'm wrong) and went from stable and consistent play, to being a pick/ban top laner. I dont think Zac needs buffs.
AnomalousChimera3 votesSpirit Visage would have to be buffed significantly...
Because of the way Riot is changing items to give percentage of base HP/5 vs flat amounts, Spirit Visage will be weaker on Zac at all levels.
I suspect that one thing that benefits Zac in comparison to other junglers in the Season 5 jungle is that his sustain from the passive will make his early clears less difficult compared to other ones since Riot is increasing the base stats of the monsters in the jungle.
BakugoBestBoy1 votesZac's Passive doesn't provide any sustain, it just refunds the cost of his abilities. His early clear will be even MORE painful now and may be completely unviable.
AnomalousChimera1 votesHis passive gives him back 4% of his maximum while his abilities cost 4% of his current health, so his passive does result in a net gain in health (excluding damage from enemies) if he picks up all blobs.
And I was also speaking relatively compared to the rest of the roster because every champion will have a rougher time in the jungle. In no way am I suggesting that he'll have an easier time compared to before.
BakugoBestBoy1 votesYou just did me some learnin!
Sightless661 votesRumble was in a situation where he had one of the highest winrates in the game, and while he wasn't played much, he was significantly above the playrates of most "low-tier" champions. That's not really comparable to where Zac is right now. I do agree waiting is a good idea, but I wouldn't be surprised if he wasn't helped very much.
masterdragon4812 votesEven if the new jungle items in season 5 favor tank champions more, Zac still won't be played because he doesn't bring anything good to the team that another champion doesn't.
The only unique thing about him is his E, because it allows him to gank from unexpected places. But if the opponent can see Zac channeling this ability, the charge up time and travel time create a situation where Zac should never be able to land the ability. In addition, the channeling nature of the ability makes it useless when trying to run away. It also can't really be used to chase for the same reason; the amount of time it takes to charge the ability negates the distance Zac crosses.
Previously, the good thing about his ultimate was the damage and the fact that any CC you aimed at him was ignored. Now it does no damage, and since he can be CC'd normally during the ability, this move doesn't really do anything special. His ultimate is out done by naut's ulti, sion's ulti (and sorta Q), sej ulti, ammu ulti.....the list goes on. This ability in its current state does nothing. Oh, wait, the only thing it does is create a lot of blobs to pick up, but thats about it.
I actually don't mind the fact that he uses his health, it actually baits a lot of people into trying to finish off Zac and the healing he does get, especially with SV, is pretty good.
They need to get rid of his AP scalings and have him scale off health. I think it would be very interesting to have % current health scalings. Similar to his appearance, he would deal more damage the higher health he had. it sorta fits, a giant blob is hitting you, its gonna hurt more if he is giant than if he isn't. In the worst case, he would be doing the same amount of damage he does now (because no one builds AP on him) and he would be able to deal tons of damage at high health, but since his abilities cost his health, he would lower his damage in the process, unless he went around collecting his passive.
DaCush1 votesI agree that I wish he was viable but lets wait for these preseason jungle changes first. If it doesn't work the way it's supposed to then he would be my first champ I would want buffed into viability.
Champion Skin1 votesZac can be decent top Though his blobs can be hard to manage against ranged champions and such as they often end up in places you would take too much harass to pick them up Though if he gets a little ahead and gets a quick haunting guise the low cooldown on his Q and the high base damage on it when you get some points in it is pretty good
Solidair31 votesI'm hoping that the new jungle changes for preseason will make tanky junglers viable again.
Yoella1 votesI've not played Zac but I have seen some lately. From what I can tell AP Zac seems to be pretty crappy in general but AD Zac was doing phenomenal. I'm sure there was a difference in skill too, but I've played with both godly Zacs and really awful ones. It seems he can be really good if played smart and on a team that compliments his kit, but is a poor choice outside of those conditions.
If I were Riot I'd give Zac a lower CD on his passive but also make the blobs weaker to promote him in teamfights, and also enhance his slingshot attack. Because to me what makes Zac Zac is his passive and his ability to leap over a wall onto the enemy ADC or Mage and go "BOOM! TANK IS IN DA HOUSE!".
BakugoBestBoy1 votesI've not played Zac but I have seen some lately. From what I can tell AP Zac seems to be pretty crappy in general but AD Zac was doing phenomenal. I'm sure there was a difference in skill too, but I've played with both godly Zacs and really awful ones. It seems he can be really good if played smart and on a team that compliments his kit, but is a poor choice outside of those conditions.
If I were Riot I'd give Zac a lower CD on his passive but also make the blobs weaker to promote him in teamfights, and also enhance his slingshot attack. Because to me what makes Zac Zac is his passive and his ability to leap over a wall onto the enemy ADC or Mage and go "BOOM! TANK IS IN DA HOUSE!".
But see therein lies the problem. His slingshot is great, especially for a tanky style champion. But he can't do anything meaningful once he's in the action. His slow is ok for... ganking maybe? Definitely not any better than just having red buff which is available to any jungler. His W is... useless? I guess is the right word, mediocre damage that costs him health <-- his only valuable resource as a "tank." Whoever at Riot was thinking "man you know what would be a great idea for a tank? we should make one that slowly kills itself if it doesn't awkwardly meander around a teamfight picking itself up 1 piece at a time" is an idiot. Tanks have one thing going for them, their HP bar, as soon as it's lower than half they get focused/ignored/kited/destroyed. Zac's ult is comepletely useless because unless he's full AP it's nothing more than a cute looking tickle mid/lategame. Put simply, a tank without meaningful CC is useless in the current meta. And that describes Zac perfectly. I'm not saying you can't/don't do well with him he just doesn't make any sense and you'd be better off with any other tanky jungler (ie Rammus, Amumu, Sejuani, heck even Udyr at least has a spammable stun).
Rito fix pls, ty
Xonra1 votesI can't remember the last time I saw anyone play Zac. Riot has nerfed his AP ratios significantly since his release (because apparently tanks aren't allowed to do damage), and a lot of the items he uses (spirit visage) have also been nerfed. If health regen is toxic to this game so be it, but please buff his base health/health per level and health regen. I love this champ but there is absolutely no reason to play him in his current state.
It isn't the problem with HIS current state, it is the problem with so many other champs that outshine him in THEIR current states.
He was a jungler but the problem is slow clear speed junglers are just not great right now and are VERY easy to counter jungle with what is the currently popular batch of junglers. Other problem is the top lane meta features people like Rumble and Ryze, and Zac just can't stand up to that. Mundo is super tanky but he is the one of the few full on tanks outside of I guess Mao that can do top lane well.
Zac isn't bad, he never was, but he got a few "nerfs" here and there, but the problem is others got buffed and the shift in the Meta was VERY unfavorable.
Cloud2731 votesI can't remember the last time I saw anyone play Zac. Riot has nerfed his AP ratios significantly since his release (because apparently tanks aren't allowed to do damage), and a lot of the items he uses (spirit visage) have also been nerfed. If health regen is toxic to this game so be it, but please buff his base health/health per level and health regen. I love this champ but there is absolutely no reason to play him in his current state.
It isn't the problem with HIS current state, it is the problem with so many other champs that outshine him in THEIR current states.
He was a jungler but the problem is slow clear speed junglers are just not great right now and are VERY easy to counter jungle with what is the currently popular batch of junglers. Other problem is the top lane meta features people like Rumble and Ryze, and Zac just can't stand up to that. Mundo is super tanky but he is the one of the few full on tanks outside of I guess Mao that can do top lane well.
Zac isn't bad, he never was, but he got a few "nerfs" here and there, but the problem is others got buffed and the shift in the Meta was VERY unfavorable.
If he can't stand up to popular junglers and/or top lane threats his current state IS the problem. He needs buffs so he can keep up with the meta. And btw all tanks are garbage. This whole "health regen/passive play and lifesteal is toxic" needs to stop. ALL champions and ALL strategies should be viable in this game. Not just the ones Riot wants to see (or doesn't want to see) in LCS.
MrSexyHobo1 votesim pretty sure riot just decided to shoebox this guy for good. there is no point in the game (even when fed) where i feel stronger than my opponent.
Endarius1 votesIt's the same syndrome as Hecarim. Back when junglers were finding their place in the meta everyone freaked out and nerfed all the top tier junglers. Problem is the ones that are mechanically busted were still good (i.e. Lee Sinn) but those that actually had drawbacks in the first place became unplayable. In his current state Zac cannot secure a kill and needs to spend a large amount of time micromanaging his blobs just to stay alive. Hecarim cannot even clear his first 3 camps and then gank, as he ends up below half health and is squishy as balls without items. I'm hoping some of these champs get tuning passes when the new jungle rolls out, as any champ that has a sustain mechanic that is defined as a primary role jungler should like, actually be viable.
Cloud2731 votesBump for awareness. I admit I was wrong about the AP ratios, but let's not argue semantics here. Zac has been nerfed many times, just like many other tanks (champs played as tanks). Tanks are an interesting part of this game, and they deserve to be viable just like any other champ.
Meep Man1 votesSeason 5 should actually give Zac a big buff with itemization. They buffed Warmog's a lot and he is one of the few junglers who can do really well pre-first back due to his passive.
Wehrmacht Bunny1 votesZac does needs some buffs, but I can imagine it very hard to balance him due to his passive. If he's in a team fight or even supported by 1 player his passive always gives him a second life. However, Zac can never hold his own against anyone and his constant losing health when he uses abilities is stupid in my opinion.
He needs a buff in his base health + Scale Health by level, and he also needs a damage buff. He pretty much suicides himself with his R but it does little damage. Give it way more damage for the last pounce. "Each bounce deals 140/210/280 " I mean really? That is just garbage. Give him something like this, Each bounce deals 180/350/480. Like I said, he pretty much kills himself when he uses R, so make it worth while.
Cloud2731 votesNo matter how much they buff him (if they choose to), I believe Zac will always be balanced due to his slingshot. It has a very long charge time, and when you get to higher levels of play people are smart and will not group up. And even if someone does get caught they can easily flash out of his ult. With proper vision most teams shouldn't have much of a problem with Zac.