Zyra; A Gameplay Update

Stacona··3 votes·1,100 views

I have played quite a bit of Zyra games in the past, mainly as support, but Zyra right now is in an awkward spot of doesn't work out very well do to all the gameplay changes that happened over the months and cannot get buffed because theoretically Zyra is extremely strong at the moment. Which is the awkward point, Zyra cannot get buffed because she is so strong right now, but you want to buff her for she could get played but then that would put her in an overpowered spot [Zyra is the champion that had to get hotfixed massively nerfed in less than 12 hours of her release].

So my ideas will have as few changes as possible to place her in a spot hopefully that is healthy for the game and viable for a very unique and niche role she will provide. Zyra has been always known as a great counter engage champion something I am definitely trying to keep, but something more unique I think Zyra can have is providing a role of anti-mobility and really using the thorns theme she has and strangle her opponents within an area that she controls; this also places her as an immobile control mage which she kind of has this identity now but not fully there (Azir, Viktor, Anivia, Cassiopeia, etc are also control mages).

Any questions and concerns feel free to ask away in the comments section! Even post your own thoughts and ideas!


Basic Attack Range: 575 units Movement Speed: 325 units per second

Rise of the Thorns (Passive): Range: 800 units When Zyra has a seed stored up she can alt + right click at the target location to plant a seed that lasts for up to 30 seconds, plants last for up to 10 seconds when grown, the type of plant is based on what ability was used to grow the seed:

Thorn Spitter: Grows from Deadly Bloom which has an attack range of 750 units and deals 23+6.5 per level magic damage. Acid Spitter: Grows from Suffocating Vines which has an attack range of 550 units and deals 23(+6.5 per level)(+20%AP) magic damage and apply a poison to its target that deals 12(+3.5 per level)(+10%AP) magic damage per second for the next 3 seconds, this poison does not stack. Vine Lasher: Grows from Grasping Roots which has an attack range of 400 units and deals 23+6.5 per level magic damage and slows its target by 30% for 2 seconds.

It takes 20/19/18/17/16/15/14 [based on champion levels 1/3/6/9/12/15/18; lowers with cooldown reduction] seconds to store up a seed holding up to a maximum of 3 seeds at one time.

Additionally, upon taking fatal damage, Zyra returns to her plant form for up to 8 seconds, becoming untargetable. She cannot cast any of her standard abilities while in this state, but can cast Vengeful Thorn using any learned ability after 2 seconds.

Vengeful Thorn: Zyra fires a single piercing thorn in the direction of the cursor, dealing (100 - 440) true damage to every enemy it passes through.


Deadly Bloom (Q): Cooldown: 7/6.5/6/5.5/5 seconds; Cost: 65/70/75/80/85 Mana; Range: 800 units Zyra sprouts thorns at the target location after a brief delay to deal 70/105/140/175/210(+65%AP) magic damage to all enemies struck.


Suffocating Vines (W): Cooldown: 20/18.5/17/15.5/14 seconds; Cost: 80 Mana; Range: 1000 units; Radius: 450 units Zyra instantly grows vines at the target area for 1.5 seconds that slowly suffocate enemies within it to deal 30/40/50/60/70(+20%AP) magic damage per half-second and silence enemies in these vines.


Grasping Roots (E): Cooldown: 12 seconds; Cost: 60/70/80/90/100 Mana; Units to Travel: 1400/1550/1700/1850/2000 units Projectile Speed: 900 units per second, from 1150 units per second

Zyra sends a surge of thorny vines in the target direction that follows your mouse cursor, the vines remain in place for 5 seconds. If the vines initially strike an enemy as they travel then they deal 60/95/130/165/200(+50%AP) magic damage and root the enemies in place for 1/1.2/1.4/1.6/1.8 seconds, enemies can only be rooted by these vines one time per cast. If an enemy moves, dashes, or jumps into these vines then they are stopped and are rooted for the same duration, they do not take the magic damage being rooted in this way.

(NOTE: The vines following the mouse cursor will allow for a semi circle at best in surrounding an area, but the vines cannot take sharp turns; think a little bit like how Sion ultimate feels to control, just slightly better handling than a Sion ultimate because it covers a lot less terrain. So you can surround an area with anti-movement vines on the outside of your placed ultimate to really take control of an area!)


Stranglethorns (R): Cooldown: 130/120/110 seconds; Cost: 100 Mana; Range: 700 units Zyra summons a monstrous thicket at the target location, dealing 180/265/350(+70%AP) magic damage to all enemies in the area as it expands. After 2 seconds, the vines snap upward, knocking up all enemies caught in the thicket for 1 second.

Additionally, plants in the thicket gain 50% increased attack speed.


26 Comments

Lugg1 votes

You do know that she has a big buff on the PBE right?

Stacona1 votes

She has no big buff - and that one aspect to her ultimate is reverted anyways, so no changes

besides any buffs or nerfs will be band aid solutions and not actually fix the problem she has, so just numbers buffs is a completely wrong direction to go in and needs small changes like these

Stiv12341 votes

You mean her plant AI? You cannot call that a "big buff".

Lugg1 votes

You have to be kidding. That has always been the biggest problem with her kit. The plants were doing so well that Riot has already nerfed them.

5050BS1 votes
  1. How is she extremely strong right now? Her pick rate is almost 0. If she was strong let alone extremely strong her pick rate would be a lot more.

  2. on the PBE they nerfed her plants back to live almost. They forget an enemy target after one hit and no mater what only target them again if you AA. You can be getting beat on and they will still target a minion unless you attack the enemy.

When they fixed them she was in a much better place and could handle champs like Zed and Fizz if you were a smart player. Now they just stomp you again.

Stacona1 votes

Pick rate and champions being strong do not go hand in hand, at all-

She is strong right now, but not viable; and so many changes happened in the game that to make her viable without overpowering she needs some small changes - i went with a zone control and anti-mobility change to emphasize these functions she has and allow her to basically counter the direction the game went in, so having an immobile champion to destroy mobility champions will bring Zyra back into a viable state

And then with adding more zone control effects to Zyra she is allowed to get off Q spam damage and plant damage within the area she planned and set up ahead of time; and things are set up so that against the likes of fizz and zed she can ravage on them with her plants, thorns, and vines rather than having a champion only strong against immobility when the game obviously got a lot more mobile and she needs anti-mobility effects to be her effective Zyra self and have a place in the game

Jonesybones1 votes

no. Zyra needs a base health buff, a base amor buff and a base movementspeed bufff. thats it.

Stacona1 votes

which do absolutely nothing, except make a high damage and utility mage into a fast moving PLANT and tank; but her problems are not fixed, she will just get mowed over and not perform the role she is meant to which is be zone control mage and counter engage mage with the delayed knock up and root-- these changes make Zyra more on the lines of zone control and counter engage by wrapping a wall of vines behind the enemy team and throw out knock ups, silences, plant, and thorns to really control an area, make it her's and dish out a lot of damage on top of it all as the enemy team is in her plant trap and they get choked out being inside it- instant silence and dash/jump stop mechanic with a wall of vines preventing an escape(or really good peel protection for support zyra) is what is needed to stop mobility and place mobility in the same spot as immobility which allows Zyra to be viable again to choke the life out of you

TwilightAvalon1 votes

I love the entire concept and do believe that it is something that could work very well. Only issue is I'm not sure that the standing still won't be effective and leave her in sticky situation often. This might counteract the other nice changes to her w that you included and it worries me as her plants play a key role in her kit. Maybe include it within her w in that every time it is used it spawns a plant, giving an opportunity for counter play in the necessity of spamming the spell but still keep her safe enough to utilize her plants ~

Keep up the good work. Zyra Lover, TwilightAvalon Zyra

Stacona1 votes

I was think of Zyra as someone that sets up an area and controls it (so a very powerful area zone control high damage utility mage/support)

Got a good idea there, like if she has a seed currently ready her W could spawn its plant in the middle (obviously the W i came up with since i moved the seeds to the passive, death passive still there, but i feel she can have two passives without being overpowered; especially since her root damage is a lot less reliable here)

avarisce1 votes

Have a problem with the w. Too much utility.

Stacona1 votes

I don't see it being too much since her roots damage is less reliable being significantly slower hence easier to dodge (sure it can turn now and gain range, but it cannot take sharp angles, not even close, so moving off to the side means easier time to dodge the roots and they get used to cut off an area instead) -- i silence stops mobility the most which allows Zyra to be an anti-mobility mage in a mobility world being the slowest champion in the game; the W i made does help her mid laning while still being good for support Zyra

Gigahappytown1 votes

This idea would completely change her playstyle a playstyle that many players enjoy

Shes infamous for having the highest kill potential out of any mid laner as well as having high sustained and burst damage something rare among champions

also "utility" mages are known for being either garbage/outclassedKarma or not being utility mages at allOrianna

Stacona1 votes

Karma and Orianna are utility mages, and they neither outclasses or garbage - Zilean and Lulu are utility mages too

I have played quite a bit of Zyra, and I don't feel I changed her playstyle at all, just emphasized her strengths

Also her damage is still really high, Zyra was never known for burst, just high damage with Q spam and plants

Gigahappytown1 votes

{quoted}

Karma and Orianna are utility mages, and they neither outclasses or garbage - Zilean and Lulu are utility mages too

I have played quite a bit of Zyra, and I don't feel I changed her playstyle at all, just emphasized her strengths

Also her damage is still really high, Zyra was never known for burst, just high damage with Q spam and plants

WHAT q spam is the opposite of what you should be doing it waste mana and forces players out of lane without killing them

Stacona1 votes

EDIT:

Rise of the Thorns: Changed a mechanic to have the seeds planted by alt + right click instead of standing still for a short time and placing a seed 500 units in front of Zyra, seed duration back to 30 seconds from my increase of 45 seconds Has a range of 800 units (the thorn spitting range when Zyra dies is the same as live, this is the seed placement range)

Abyssphere1 votes

There is hardly a single nerf in this, the E change is neutral at worst. That's unacceptable given that you've basically given her a whole new extra ability and in some ways buffed her seeds (max charge increase).

Why even keep the old passive? She has a double passive for absolutely no reason in your rework and her horrendous current passive is in dire need of removal because it's actively un-fun to use. If you're giving her a new passive you remove the old one - not just throw something on in addition to it.

Stacona1 votes

You saying having a second passive that procs off death be overpowered? I like Zyra and I wouldn't want her death passive removed

Besides there is no reason to nerf Zyra at the moment, and to see if she would be overtuned or not needs gameplay testing, if the changes make her E damage so unreliable then her damage output is unchanged so she needs no other compensations

Abyssphere1 votes

{quoted}

You saying having a second passive that procs off death be overpowered? I like Zyra and I wouldn't want her death passive removed

Besides there is no reason to nerf Zyra at the moment, and to see if she would be overtuned or not needs gameplay testing, if the changes make her E damage so unreliable then her damage output is unchanged so she needs no other compensations

The point is that your post begins with a description of why you can't just buff Zyra - because she's already pretty decent. So you talk about wanting to make her more viable without pushing her over the edge, which indicates power shifts and the removal of certain things that may be crippling her. And then the rework is just pretty much a flat buff across the board with basically no trade-offs.

The reason I think you should remove the on-death passive is because something has to go if she's getting an entire new ability and it's by far the least beloved part of her kit - you may like it, but I and a lot of other Zyra players detest it and it is not core to her kit, so why not remove it? If something has to go, it really should be a part of her kit that has no important interactions with the rest of it.

I want Zyra to be better but this thread completely misses the mark. She needs particular issues addressed, not just a massively stronger kit.

Stacona1 votes

Its not massively strong, its stronger in one aspect and weaker in another-- Yea, not simply buff Zyra in terms of numbers and such, but can make changes to her and she becomes viable because of it of course she is stronger in contrast, does not mean it was a buff or nerf

Point is why nerf a champion that isn't really getting played at the moment and without playing testing to see if the idea is balanced- I don't see why removing her death passive would change anything anyways, its an effect that applies on death; you only have an argument if it worked like Karthus' passive

More from Gameplay

More by Stacona