Infinity Edge has a conflicted purpose.

Slamurai Jack··18 votes·2,723 views

My understanding is that item 3031 is supposed to be what gives adc's their late game scaling, but because the item also has 80 AD (which is the most you can get on 1 item), it's also the optimal first item caster for adc's as well. This creates a rather strange scenario where the most stat reliant class in the game is getting their stats multiplier item first and it makes the adc role as a whole disproportionately snowbally since each subsequent item after IE is worth more due to it's multipliers. It also massively favors auto based adcs over casters since AD casters buy it largely for the AD while auto based adcs benefit far more from the items passive.

I feel like this divided purpose stems from the fact that IE is both the big ticket AD item and te scaling adc item at the same time. I know Riot is already reworking the Marksman role in the offseason but I can't help but feel that IE should be focused more on scaling and bought less because of it's AD. Perhaps a new recipe and cost: item 1038 item 1018 item 1018 3800 gold 50 AD 35% crit chance and keeping the current passive. Obviously PD and Shiv would need to be changed as well to not be so crit heavy themselves, but I honestly feel like they were too strong anyway since they're always paired with IE and they're relatively cheap items with strong build paths.

83 Comments

LaserDeathBlade18 votes

IE isn't that great of a starting item, but ADCs build it anyway because they know they plan on building more crit to make it worth by mid game

You could start BT for a better early game but then all of your mid game would suck because the other guy's critting and you're not. I don't even finish BT until 4th item most of the time because it just doesn't give you the stats you're looking for.

idoki7 votes

Also because most of the time item 3086 into item 3046 / item 3087 is going to be an ADC's second item, so the crit stacks pretty well.

LordGeovanni1 votes

you say better but what i think you mean is safer

thumbnail94 votes

It is the most efficient build path for the majority of ADC's because if you don't crit you actually don't do any damage. By the time your base damage of 300 gets reduced by armor there is practically nothing left.

AD caster's go Tri-force because they put all their eggs in the sheen proc basket and try to win mid game. There damage is pretty high to because lol 200% base damage extra. Late game though if they go full ADC build they lose out on dps every time they throw a skill out.

The only ADC's that don't want to go IE first are: Vayne, EZ, Corki, Ashe (even though Ashe still needs IE first for a good spike).

Hotlin3 Fling1 votes

Forgot twitch Quinn

ModWulf Helhammer1 votes

Why would Quinn not go IE first?

Hotlin3 Fling1 votes

Her ult makes her melee so Bork for sticking power

ModWulf Helhammer1 votes

You already have plenty of sticking power on her ult. 80% out of combat MS buff, with a 30% in combat, all at rank 1. What Quinn does like is the burst crit gives, which allows her to instaburst squishies

ScriptBrand2 votes

IE is only a first buy for like 3 or 4 adcs

Slamurai Jack5 votes

[{quoted}](name=TSM Turt Wildr,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qUFEJo95,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2015-09-28T06:14:33.262+0000)

IE is only a first buy for like 3 or 4 adcs

Ashe Caitlyn Draven Graves Jinx Lucian MissFortune Sivir Tristana Varus

Clint Orris1 votes

Eh Lucian does better with a rushed BT.

Gigahappytown1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Punish This Hole,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qUFEJo95,comment-id=000100000001,timestamp=2015-09-28T06:46:13.551+0000)

Eh Lucian does better with a rushed BT.

no he doesn't lmfao

BakedLotion1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Punish This Hole,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qUFEJo95,comment-id=000100000001,timestamp=2015-09-28T06:46:13.551+0000)

Eh Lucian does better with a rushed BT.

Totally. Not like he can double IE crit or anything.

ModWulf Helhammer1 votes

The only ADCs that don't build it first are Vayne Twitch Urgot KogMaw Corki Kalista

ScriptBrand2 votes

BT>IE the only time i would buy ie over BT is when im behind or you play jinx or trist

ModWulf Helhammer1 votes

Remind me to never have you on my team playing ADC. Literally the only ADC you could consider buying BT first on would be Kalista

Rain NT4 votes

Or Draven, but to me those two are the only exception because Draven Q is basically crit, and the LS plus Shield help him just never die and just continue to stack his passive.

Fiveofswords6 votes

actually its like the exact opposite. the only time i would consider getting bt first is if i got insanely fed...that way i also get sustain and its real hard to outplay an adc thats always at full health.

Sire Hippington1 votes

isn't he saying more or less the same? Rushing IE only if behind is more or less like rushing BT only if ahead, both consider IE to be a better choice from behind and Bt if ahead, just the centerline is different...

JedenVojak3 votes

{quoted}

The only ADCs that don't build it first are Vayne Twitch Urgot KogMaw Corki Kalista

You forgot Ezreal

Gunslinger7441 votes

And Draven And Lucian

SecretAgentHulk2 votes

What do build first on Lucian? I always thought it was IE.

Gunslinger7441 votes

I always build Triforce first with a vamp sceptre in there for BT second item. Then I build (bear with me) Ninja Tabi or CDR boots depending on the situation. Tabi if I find myself dueling a lot, CDR when I'm ahead. After that I get some crit chance (PD, shiv) and then I get IE. My winrate skyrocketed after I stopped rushing IE.

XIII Vanitas1 votes

Triforce is a lot of wasted gold, if you know how to use your W.

Gunslinger7441 votes

Between the mana cost, cast time and cooldown of Ardent Blaze I couldn't agree less. And that's not even taking the rest of Triforce's stats into consideration. I'm an adc that's constantly looking for fights and harrass, the slew of stats from Triforce and the sustain from Vamp sceptre allows me to do that way more than an IE would ever let me.

XIII Vanitas1 votes

The cast time is 0 if you cancel it with your E. You can also manage the cd if you don't waste your abilities when you don't need them. The rest of Triforce's stats are just worse than their counterparts in other items: the zeal part is laughable compared to PD or SS, the sheen part doesn't amplify your damage as much as just buying AD does.

If you want a mid game powerspike because you're winning hard, Triforce is an ok item, but in the majority of the cases is just garbage, since crits work incredibly well with Lucian's passive.

Gunslinger7441 votes

Zeal is a disgustingly bad item, I'll give you that. But I still disagree, in my opinion crits don't synergise all that well with his passive because the second shot only does 50% damage to champions which causes some strange crit calculations. Then again I don't like building IE first on any adc except Caitlyn and I guess Jinx if I played her, generally because I find it unreliable. With Triforce and Vamp Sceptre I know I can duel the enemy adc that has IE and a Vamp, because the damage from Sheen, health and movespeed from Phage and... mediocreness of Zeal combines into a very nasty combination that doesn't rely almost solely on 25% chance to do huge damage.

XIII Vanitas1 votes

60% damage, the passive got buffed. Anyways, just consider the fact that crits affects both shots, while spellblade effects only affect the first one. The more crits and AD you have, the more damage you do. You may be stronger in early/mid game (I'll give you that, because I don't want to do te math right now), but your damage is going to fall off pretty quickly as the game carries on.

Gunslinger7441 votes

Triforce damage definitely will fall off as the game continues, but when you take the full build into consideration which goes in this order: Triforce > BT > Boots > PD/Shiv > IE > LW if necesary, otherwise something defensive.

Triforce takes care of the early game dueling and snowballing into PD and IE for lategame teamfighting. It's a fairly well-rounded build in my opinion, no real powerspikes but no falloff either.

XIII Vanitas1 votes

At the end of the day it's based on your personal preference. I'd rather sacrifice some power in early/mid game to have my late game powerspike sooner.

ModWulf Helhammer1 votes

He can sometimes build it first, if he is playing just a normal straight ADC bot

Westonbirt1 votes

Urgot is not an ADC.

ModWulf Helhammer1 votes

He technically counts. He was played there for awhile this season

Anidan1 votes

He's an anti-carry, which is why he's played in bot lane sometimes. Not what most people would actually consider to be an ADC.

Sire Hippington1 votes

EzrealQuinn , actually leaving Tristana Varus MissFortuneSivir Lucian Jinx Graves Caitlyn Ashe as IE rushers, so 8 without and 9 with IE rush, actually not an overhelming majority, and for most IE-champs it is rather debatable if IE rush is the suprtior way...

ModWulf Helhammer1 votes

I'm a bit confused from your list, especially because Quinn goes IE first

disregardable1 votes

Uhm item 3089 ?

Slamurai Jack18 votes

[{quoted}](name=Very Toxic Jinx,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qUFEJo95,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-09-28T06:12:45.763+0000)

Uhm item 3089 ?

How many people do you see rushing Deathcap first item because they want more AP early?

IcyPepper6 votes

I thought most people went for item 3157 item 3116 item 3285 item 3027 item 3070 item 3040 when AP?

disregardable3 votes

It'd be a lot more common if item 3027 didn't exist.

Actually, that brings up a pretty interesting idea. A rod of ages for marksmen that would stall that power spike like it does for AP mages.

I can't think of one that would work is the issue.

LordGeovanni2 votes

except adcs dont want more hp or mana and regain hp through life steal and have pretty decent mana regen and mana costs compared to any other set of champions besides manaless ones

disregardable5 votes

that's why the item needs to be "for marksmen" and not "for AP mages".

50000000000000001 votes

Something like gaining AD, lifesteal, and crit chance over time?

Sire Hippington1 votes

though he's not totally wrong, Deathcap is both the stat multiplier and the highest raw ap item(ignoreing AA here) The main difference is that IE also multiplies base stats(base AD and base AS), while Deathcap only works with bonusstats. This makes IE pretty self-suficient, while DC relys more on other items to be worth the gold. Also, most ap-champs have manaproblems that demand fixing. I haven't seen an IE rush on Ez or Varus if focused on caster, they also first fix their mana...

There is a bit more to it than just IE being both the highest AD item and a multiplier...

LadyRenly2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Very Toxic Jinx,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qUFEJo95,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-09-28T06:12:45.763+0000)

Uhm item 3089 ?

I never see anyone rush deathcap early. It's just as silly as rushing manamune/archangels staff. It's better to wait.

Westonbirt2 votes

Urgot Yorick

LadyRenly1 votes

{quoted}

Urgot Yorick

I play Urgot a bit, and always wait until tear is nearly stacked before buying it. I'd rather just rush tear, then rush either Cleaver for damage, or defense to survive

Westonbirt1 votes

If I may say so myself, it's a lot better to rush Manamura. Phage cost about as much as Tear > Manamura (1350 v 1480), but one allows you to get good damage early. And it's not just a matter of building damage ; it also stacks faster and Urgot's main early issue is crippling mana costs. Cleaver is always (almost) my second build though because CDR and passives. But I only start building it after Manamura is complete otherwise I will spend entire minutes with very low damage (Phage is only +20, Cleaver +40 - for 3000 of investment, that's still below unstacked Manamura at 45).

Gigahappytown1 votes

um ie has the same ad as essence reaver blood thirster...

JustMyBassCannon3 votes

That's not the point.

The point is that it's meant to be a late-game scalar for AD champions--particularly focused on basic attacks--but it's also a powerful first pick because of how much AD it has.

This is actually a pretty similar issue to older iterations of Rabadon's Deathcap. In the past, other AP options had gimped AP compared to it, so you would only pick them up if you weren't able to farm in the lane up to NLR, Wand and eventually Cap. Now, AP itemization is a little more equalized; Rabadon's is still powerful early-game or late-game, but not to the degree that someone starting with Rylai's, Liandry's or even Morellonomicon is so severely outclassed that they're pretty much guaranteed to lose trades.

Infinity Edge having the same AD as Bloodthirster, Essence Reaver and Mercurial Scimitar, but also having the highest DPS multiplier due to Crit Chance and Crit Damage means that it's tipping the scales very much like old Rabadon's.

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