Should hyper carries even exist?

Lugg··4 votes·1,806 views

Serious thread here, even though I know it will get downvoted without even being read.

I just wanted to post the question to the community on whether hyper carries should even exist. Champions that are nigh impossible to deal with late game are pretty toxic just by their nature. Added to the fact that most hypers don't have a weak enough early game to balance out their insane late games just makes this worse. Here are a few examples:

Jinx. Yes, she has no escape, but her kit makes that a completely mute point. She has very long range with her rockets and zap, her chompers cut off pretty much any chance of chasing her down, and her ult is global. Vayne can easily tumble away from trouble or knockback (and stun) opponents, so she is very safe early. Kog has no escapes, and is vulnerable in the early laning phase, but is still relatively safe thanks to the range increase on his W, long range on his Q, and his ooze being an AoE slow. This is more than made up by his late game where he can pretty much trade without any retaliation. A pretty well balanced hyper is Twitch. His early game is weak, but his late game, while very strong, has counterplay if your team invests in pink wards and uses them effectively.

Any ADC in the game can carry a game pretty easy. Even early game bullies like Graves are still very effective late game without being hyper carries. So nerfing the hyper carry late games will still make them valuable. The only real drawback I personally see is that games might go on longer.

Looking forward to hearing CONSTRUCTIVE replies.

23 Comments

BluePolarizer3 votes

Absolutely no problem with hypercarries as long as they aren't also lane bullies. Jinx and Vayne are lane bullying hypercarries. Vayne is dangerous starting at level 2-3. You have to play with extreme care to not get out-traded by her. But guess what - you have to play with extreme care against lane bullies too. So Vayne is basically a lane bully hypercarry. Same with Jinx. That was also the problem with Tristana - she was a lane bully hypercarry.

In fact Twitch and Kog are the only AD hypercarries that are also not lane bullies.

The AP hypercarries are much less problematic. Nobody is scared of early game Karthus or Azir. The biggest problem is Cassiopeia who is a hypercarry you have to shut down but you can't shut down since she's a lane bully.

This, IMO, is a HUGE flaw in league of legends. Early game, champions are more or less similar in their base stats though not kit. Meanwhile, late game, champions are different by alot. This means that AD hypercarries can also be lane bullies and are unique in this aspect. They don't really need any special scaling; they outscale their lane bully ADC counterparts at any point of the game outside laning phase.

There is an easy way to balance them: give all AD hypercarries the lowest base ADs, HP, armor and MS in the game, not just Twitch. Make them have to actually farm and spend gold to reach hypercarry status.

Yosuke Apperu1 votes

Trynd and yas are also hyper carries though lol.

BluePolarizer1 votes

Yas is a hypercarry. Trynd isn't. His teamfight is mediocre.

Lugg2 votes

Both are. Trynd can penta probably as well as any champ in the game.

Lugg1 votes

Great post. I really love your solution in your last paragraph.

36949613_DEL1 votes

Definitely not adc main.

TL&DR gtfo

Lugg1 votes

Give me ONE good reason why hyper carries shouldn't be weak early?

36949613_DEL1 votes

Because there is no hypercarry role in this game , some champions can (if played properly) realy brake game(hypercarry).Cause no matter what Vayne will hypercarry , go ahead low her base stats , ill hypercarry those all scums all over the board.

BluePolarizer2 votes

Vayne's base AD is ludicrous. She has the 3rd highest base AD out of all ADCs; only Graves and Kalista are higher. Why does a late game hypercarry have HIGHER base damage than champs that are weaker early game?

Speaking of base ADs, Kalista has higher base AD than Darius, Vi, Riven, Gangplank, J4 and Pantheon.

Bistrus2 votes

Hyper carry should exist. But they should be more like Vlad/karthus, not so good in early, decent/good in mid and hyper in late. The problem is what was already said: the hyper carry who start to be hyper at lvl 2 - 3, wich isn't healthy for lol

36949613_DEL1 votes

Excuse me Vayne is hyper carry , and she is (by my thinking) the only adc that can brake this JUGGERNAUT meta.

Yosuke Apperu1 votes

Just play ashe and kite the juggernauts literally forever. They took away almost all of their mobility. Except skarner but I was assuming your problem was with Garen and Darius. Juggernauts are still in a healthier spot than vayne IMO. Vayne has always been good against literally everything. Ap mage might take her out.

36949613_DEL1 votes

You new here what?

Vayne is borderline , ashe is killable.

Lugg1 votes

Kog is better against bruisers and tanks than Vayne. His W will melt anyone.

Stacona1 votes

Vayne isn't a hyper, she just scales well

36949613_DEL1 votes

Vayne have %HP true dmg on every third auto atack , and BOTRK exists.

More like viper.

Stacona1 votes

yes, hyper mages, hyper marksmen, hyper tanks are fine, there is no problem with them as long as the are balanced with weak early games

Lugg1 votes

That's the problem, about half of them DON'T have weak early games.

Stacona1 votes

Mundo Maokai Sion Darius post changes Skarner with % health shield I feel is a hyper, he is also slightly over tuned and will receive nerfs next patch

Kog'Maw AP Anivia Karthus Vladimir Cassiopeia Viktor Azir

Kog'Maw AD Twitch Jinx Ashe

Rebonack1 votes

Koggy's win-rate curve doesn't reflect a hyper-carry.

His has a strong spike mid/late, but he falls off pretty hard in the deep late-game.

Lugg1 votes

I have never seen Kog fall off at all late game. Once he gets Ludens, he can poke out anyone.

MLDzXnRRR1 votes

Yi and Kata are the only true hypercarries that can 1v5. Maybe Kayle with ult...

Mecha MaIphite1 votes

Hypercarry does not mean 1v5. No champ can 1v5 against a half-decent team, not even Nasus.

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