i guess junglers have to wait till season 10 to get any good changes?

lolipopevelynn·Feb 9, 2019·40 votes·28,738 views

i get it, season 8 junglers were too strong. well right now the jungle feels bad to farm for ALOT of champs. junglers that need to wait till 6 to do anything of use get crapped on by junglers that just level 2 or lvl 3 gank all day. But that isnt even the main issue, the main issue is that the jungle itself is so boring and lifeless. Counter jgling is not a thing except for a few odd cases, camps no longer give cool buffs because of plants (which i personally still dont like except river plants), and scuttles is just a turtle.

please help the jungle

61 Comments

kurufalFeb 9, 201934 votes

In Season 10 JG camps are going to farm you.

hrooza dota Feb 9, 20197 votes

they already do that in low elo

[slayer-jinx-wink]

rtbf221651412Feb 12, 20192 votes

{quoted}

In Season 10 JG camps are going to farm you.

Season 10, jungle camps do true damage and attack 2x faster and do 1.5x more damage.

Moody PFeb 9, 201919 votes

when is riot gonna revert jungle to season 4

Bears Dont CareFeb 12, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Moody P,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qEOHlyRd,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-02-09T16:52:53.482+0000)

when is riot gonna revert jungle to season 4

Then we can complain about Lee Sin early ganks.

SaiannaFeb 12, 20191 votes

Like we didn't complain about those in S 5-6-7-8...

Bears Dont CareFeb 13, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Like we didn't complain about those in S 5-6-7-8...

Most people didn't complain as heavily as they do now.

SaiannaFeb 13, 20191 votes

back then every 3rd forum thread was about Lee Sin and his BS jungling... back then forum was several times more active...

Slythrin UmbreonFeb 9, 201917 votes

Changes? Always. Good changes? No.

GlaricionFeb 10, 201913 votes

"Change is inherently good, therefore you's wrong." - Rito Game

rtbf221651412Feb 12, 20194 votes

{quoted}

"Change is inherently good, therefore you's wrong." - Rito Game

As balance dictates: Said the champion made by Rito that hasn't ever been successfully balanced. Akali

ﬂooFeb 12, 20193 votes

We just gotta change it back again!

koshkyraFeb 10, 201915 votes

Riot be like "We nerfed farming because ganking was outshining it."

boricCentaur1Feb 9, 201910 votes

Idk why riot doesn't just increase the amount of time camps take to do and increase the amount of xp they give like that would solve basically every problem compared to nerfing the xp.

I also don't know why they changed jungle in season 7 like plants are cool but the rest was just bad and who was comparing about jungle back then and the amount of people complaining had just gone way up since then and yeah it is also fucking boring like most junglers take very little damage and have ok clear speeds.

SociaI JusticeFeb 10, 20193 votes

dk why riot doesn't just increase the amount of time camps take to do and increase the amount of xp they give like that would solve basically every problem compared to nerfing the xp.

this would further favor fast clearing junglers, lets say it takes 2 seconds for graves to clear a camp while it takes seju 5 seconds, now if camps took 5x longer to clear graves would have to only spend 10 seconds clearing the camp compared to sejus 25.

TheSingularityFeb 11, 20191 votes

However if we bought back smite buffs, it would favor slow clearers significantly due to diminishing time returns (if you already clear fast you gain fk all from dealing dot when hit)

OgScFeb 12, 20191 votes

They did something similar to that with an old jungle item that was an aoe smite. Its intention was help weaker clearers get on par w faster clearers. However, the faster clearers took it anyway and made their clearing even faster. The faster clearers would still abuse ur idea.

TheSingularityFeb 12, 20191 votes

They wouldn't, because they didn't There were more optimal choices (see season 4 smite buffs) Smite gromp: DOT when attacked (even more diminishing returns if you clear fast, less uptime, less damage dealt over time) Birds: duskblade passive without the insta ward kill wolf: passive sentry that follows invaders Krugs: stun monsters every X attacks.

Purple smite was taken because it was blatantly better than blue or red. We saw the same thing with green smite. Blue and red simply don't mean anything in comparison.

EonslegacyApr 16, 20191 votes

Make it scale off of the hp of the user then. BAM smite now gains 30% total health scaling tanks now gain more smitterinos

Fear the KaynFeb 9, 20199 votes

It's ridiculous that Riot thinks its ok for Junglers to be 2-3 levels behind for 80% of the game.

Exin0Feb 10, 20192 votes

[{quoted}](name=Fear the Kayn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qEOHlyRd,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2019-02-09T20:44:23.656+0000)

It's ridiculous that Riot thinks its ok for Junglers to be 2-3 levels behind for 80% of the game.

i understand but what about times when they were 2-3 levels ahead and camping in brushes for eternity?

LTK KoRoFeb 11, 20191 votes

They couldn't do both at once, before xp nerfs it was either being ahead in lvls or camping in bushes for 1 minute

mikemcpartyFeb 12, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Fear the Kayn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qEOHlyRd,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2019-02-09T20:44:23.656+0000)

It's ridiculous that Riot thinks its ok for Junglers to be 2-3 levels behind for 80% of the game.

Why? They are already impactful enough... A good jungle player has the ability to snowball lanes while being 1-2 levels back.

Fear the KaynFeb 13, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Why? They are already impactful enough... A good jungle player has the ability to snowball lanes while being 1-2 levels back.

Because the counter to junglers is proper ward coverage, not forcing them to be lower level and behind in items than everyone else

KynamiFeb 13, 20191 votes

Good luck getting proper ward coverage back in yolo queue with Duskblade, Vision plants, upgraded sweeper, and more all contributing to making the ahead team the only one that can afford good vision because pinks and blues get cleared fast if you don't have priority. Totem wards and poro in a bush have significantly limited placement and charges to play with. No way to buy extra yellow wards pretty much leaves extended pushes only where the support has pushed vision on the current back with any degree of safety. And even THAT doesn't kick in until laning phase is close to ending since the wards are quest locked anymore.

All of which contributes to top and mid bitching up a storm about getting camped to hell because the vision they have access to is really limited. One pink, one totem, and one poro is about as far as you can push the vision game without sightstone. That is somewhat enough for top until it gets cleared. But mid? With walls meaning almost nothing to half the viable gank happy junglers there is over six ways they can come screw you over.

With snowballing and damage the way they are jungle should actually deal with being a 2nd tier citizen in the game again for a change. Able to impact lanes but not auto-win just because they snowballed out of control within the space of two ganks.

mikemcpartyFeb 14, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Fear the Kayn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qEOHlyRd,comment-id=000500010000,timestamp=2019-02-13T06:24:11.539+0000)

Because the counter to junglers is proper ward coverage, not forcing them to be lower level and behind in items than everyone else

Oh come on now. Proper ward coverage. If you are "properly warding" to prevent invades, then your wards aren't available to prevent the level 2 ganks from our favorite junglers. You are expecting everyone to play at an LCS level in regards to warding when solo queue still results in people double warding and not wanting to ward because "it's the support's job." We don't need jungles at the same level to make their early/mid game ganks even more destructive. They scale fine into late game. This isn't a problem needing to be addressed atm.

NaalithFeb 9, 20197 votes

At least our biannual fucking happened in January this year, so it'll be at least 6 months before we get fucked again.

3TWarriorFeb 10, 20192 votes

they did it at least 4 times last year...is this year safe? or are you speaking only of jungle changes?

HügöFeb 10, 20196 votes

Wow wow wow mate, you wanna tell me permanent recieving nerfs aren't good changes?

ChiefDaysFeb 10, 20195 votes

Was playing on my smurf, I had 200CS and the enemy jungler only 120 at around 25 mins mark and they were still 1 LEVEL HIGHER than me.

Just shows how good jungle clear pathing doesn't reward you anymore.

SuffocateMeDaddyFeb 11, 20194 votes

Jungle still needs nerfs what the fuck? Lvl 2 gank when im lvl 1 on solo lane by minute 50 seconds is not okay. Its time to finally decrease exp from jungle camps and increase frequency of their respawns.

LagorFeb 13, 20191 votes

This. I recently started playing again, was formerly a jungler, and I can't jungle today. Even before they nerfed xp, the camps felt like they were never back up and if you got something like birds counter jungled from you it was an insane punishment.

You dont even have to know how to farm efficiently to get levels, unlike back in s3/4/5

Not HeIping YouFeb 10, 20193 votes

maybe not, they will probably revert the changes or buff them again right before worlds so junglers are useful in worlds games.

yung swisherFeb 9, 20192 votes

yep

AetherArisingFeb 10, 20192 votes

Just played a game against a Kindred. At like 20 mins, both of us had almost the EXACT SAME amount of farm. She had 2 whole minions less than me I was 2 levels above her.

At the same time, if junglers DO have crazy powerfarm kits, like Graves, they can get like 4 levels up on you stupid fast. I had a khazix game where i was 3/1, graves was 1/3. I had isolation on him, i had duskblade, but he had almost 70 farm up on me because i was pressuring objectives and helping the team. I tried 1v1ing him and he 2shot me because he had PD and warrior.

fun

There's some major major problems with jg, but if you read meddler's game thoughts, he's like "Huuu jungle's totally fine everyone loves it lalala cant hear you we might nerf some too-strong champs but EEEVEERYTHINGS FIIIIINE"

RustypugFeb 12, 20192 votes

i love when im chillin in my jungle early game and your local lee sin and udyr main comes sliding into my jungler at lightspeed to clap my cheeks and touch my toad

SaiannaFeb 12, 20192 votes

Anyone else misses old times of S2-3 jungle? Where you weren't afraid of jungle mobs actually killing you, so you had more options what to pick? Also jungle items like lizard heart (true dmg dot, fun ARAM times)...

Eh...

ShakeNBakeUKFeb 10, 20191 votes

{quoted}

i get it, season 8 junglers were too strong. well right now the jungle feels bad to farm for ALOT of champs. junglers that need to wait till 6 to do anything of use get crapped on by junglers that just level 2 or lvl 3 gank all day. But that isnt even the main issue, the main issue is that the jungle itself is so boring and lifeless. Counter jgling is not a thing except for a few odd cases, camps no longer give cool buffs because of plants (which i personally still dont like except river plants), and scuttles is just a turtle.

please help the jungle

have fun for the next 8 months regards, adcs

LTK KoRoFeb 11, 20193 votes

there's a difference between junglers and adcs

adcs were OP for 7 and half of the season, in 8.11 they got nerfed to be on par with rest of the classes, suddenly the biggest whining in lol history started, and now we're back to "better bot wins" meta.

junglers were op for half of the s8, otherwise they fluctuate between a second support and a mediocre carry role. Jungle usually is getting the nerfbat twice per season, while whiny ADCs get buffs more than twice per year

Sir SaltarinFeb 11, 20191 votes

Now that Camille Jng has 45% winrate nerf Xin Zao and we gucci

LTK KoRoFeb 12, 20191 votes

i don't care about xin, buff gragas ap ratios pls (and predators CD), i need to oneshot adcs through pd shield

DrippyBrownHoleFeb 11, 20191 votes

Just abandon the jungle and do duo top. You can team up to get important stuff from the jungle and return to lane

TheSingularityFeb 11, 20191 votes

Revert all jungle changes to match season 4 jungle

FixHealsRemoveGWFeb 12, 20191 votes

I think the crabs are a huge issue and that camping isn't punishing enough if you don't get much out of it. The crabs completely changed jungle pathing in a way that draws jungler out of their own jungle and rewards them for it, so they are more likely to invade or gank early which basically created vertical jungling. There was a time when crossing the river would be a meaningful time loss or doing suboptimal early camping would actually make you fall behind so much that you risk losing the game or that you are even to weak to clear your jungle efficiently fast. lul Nowadays you actually can just spam gank, like 1 camp, 1 gank, crab, another gank... it's really crazy. Compare that to how much laners lose when they roam and it doesn't quite work out.

The thigh guyFeb 12, 20191 votes

Like I keep saying. Jungle is dead atm. You’re better off giving the adc and top laners smite and having the “jungler” be a support for toplane. More gold on roles that can carry.

xAcidikFeb 12, 20191 votes

Yeah, these changes did nothing but make powerfarming junglers rather weak, while making early ganking and tank junglers even more mandatory.

LanesAreForN00bsFeb 13, 20191 votes

Just need tracker's knife back to make the game snowball slower.

MoonscourgeFeb 13, 20191 votes

I guess junglers were overpowered for 4 seasons now and they finally got nerfed and jungle mains aren't happy with it??

Deliberate InterFeb 13, 20191 votes

{quoted}

i get it, season 8 junglers were too strong. well right now the jungle feels bad to farm for ALOT of champs. junglers that need to wait till 6 to do anything of use get crapped on by junglers that just level 2 or lvl 3 gank all day. But that isnt even the main issue, the main issue is that the jungle itself is so boring and lifeless. Counter jgling is not a thing except for a few odd cases, camps no longer give cool buffs because of plants (which i personally still dont like except river plants), and scuttles is just a turtle.

please help the jungle

Jungle is great right now but not all junglers are good. (the players not the champions)

EonslegacyApr 16, 20191 votes

The main problem im noticing isnt gank or no gank junglers. its duelists or no duelist junglers. If your jungler cant duel there jungler, then the entire jungle is the enemies because in a league of 1 shots, even if your allie rotates faster to help you, and you guys kill the enemy that invaded, you will BOTH die to the mid/top/bot that rotated slightly behind you. Now the dueler jungler once again invades, and if you try once again to counter it, you both die again, and MAYBE their jungler MIGHT die, that is if your mid feels like taking that risk again. Things like Lee or shaco go to gank, if you have a voli bear or ww, all thats gonna happen is your bot is dead in 1 frame, and the next your running for your life. Insta gibs on everyone just makes the jungle impossible to balance it seems.