Reworked malzahar vs pre-rework malzahar

Paroe··13 votes·5,895 views

Pre: Passive voidlings did 1.5 total AD with 2.0 attack speed (when frenzied). 1.0 total AD and 1.25 when not frenzied. Ultimate did 550+1.3AP at level 18. E did 320+0.8AP at rank 5 Q did 300+0.8AP at rank 5

In lane, you would generally have one voidling OR one frenzied voidling and one fresh voidling. Malzahars "DoT burst" was; 550+320+300 (1170) +1.3+1.6 ( 2.9) for a total of 1170 base damage plus 2.9AP of guaranteed damage.

As a laner, this meant that malzahar had a great deal of "Anti assassin" owing to his immobility; if he was jumped, he had the tools to greatly damage his opponent and make them leave or outright burst squishies who tried to pick him off. In the rework, malzahar lost over 50% of his damage in exchange for jungle power.

Post: Q does 230+0.7 W voidlings deal 0.4AD at max rank E does 220+0.7 R does 25%

Guaranteed damage with post rework malzahar is 25% max health +1.4AP +450 base damage. It takes more than TWO voidlings to equal the damage of one non-frenzied pre-rework voidling. Malzahar lost over half his damage to become an objective focused, "enabler" jungle who works well taking objectives quickly and safely, and whose ganks lack power on their own but enable the ally laner to unload in the hopes for a kill. Ganks will never create more than 3 voidlings, and voidlings will never get more than 5 hits in due to the duration of his E and voidlings no longer attacking based on malzahars target.

Changes id like to see: E giving you kill gold if an enemy minion dies AND spreads malefic visions. Voidlings being able to use spell effects (like raylais, black cleaver). Ultimate doing 200/250/300 base damage in addition to the pool.

TL;DR Malzahar lost slightly over 50% of his base damage and scaling in exchange for his voidlings becoming a very powerful jungle tool, which refocused the kit from "anti assassin" into "objective jungler" in one of the strangest reworks of the patch; very little of the original playstyle was preserved as voidlings in the lane are weak and easily killed by any champion with AoEs while containing a majority of malzahars power budget, more or less forcing malzahar into an AD or hybrid jungle position instead of his previous niche as an anti-assassin mid laner.

21 Comments

Christ Superstar6 votes

As a Malz main, all I can say I really fucking miss the old Malzahar. :/ Only positive is new Q is much easier to hit (which I'm not that sure is actually a good thing), and this kit is more fun in the jungle, alas, I'm a midlaner. :P I'll give it a few weeks before officially hating the rework, though, so here's me hoping I'll unlock the new Malzahars secret power! ;)

Paroe1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Christ Superstar,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=pEpTVBzc,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2016-05-04T21:48:31.784+0000)

As a Malz main, all I can say I really fucking miss the old Malzahar. :/ Only positive is new Q is much easier to hit (which I'm not that sure is actually a good thing), and this kit is more fun in the jungle, alas, I'm a midlaner. :P I'll give it a few weeks before officially hating the rework, though, so here's me hoping I'll unlock the new Malzahars secret power! ;)

Try him in the jungle or top lane. Unfortunately he lacks damage to mid properly now =/

Nilok1 votes

Amen to that.

Vistha Kai5 votes

Welcome to Season 6, where nobody knows what the fuck is going on.

Shen Whose lane is it anyway?

Paroe3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Vistha Kai,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=pEpTVBzc,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2016-05-04T21:04:57.024+0000)

Welcome to Season 6, where nobody knows what the fuck is going on.

Shen Whose lane is it anyway?

Indeed... whose lane is it anyway, lol. I hope people get over this wierd blind hate for malzahar. He probably received some of the worst lane nerfs since nasus was nerfed into a top tier jungler.

Now dont get me wrong, new malz and old malz are two different champions. The point of this thread isnt to say "old malz was better" only to point out the MASSIVE differences between the two and just how much malzahar lost in the rework.

New malz is a ridiculously fun jungler, whom im quite smitten with... as a jungler. He needs a few changes to be able to lane, but thats even assuming riot wants him to capable of laning. The only change i feel he needs regardless is base damage on his R; thats it. the other changes are only to help lane malzahar post re-work, as hes very lackluster due to how easily his voidlings are killed and how integral they are to his kit.

Stevev455 votes

He can't stomp marksman in a 1vs1 duel any more. I'm pretty sure all the mage reworks were about achieving that goal.

Paroe5 votes

{quoted}

He can't stomp marksman in a 1vs1 duel any more. I'm pretty sure all the mage reworks were about achieving that goal.

Btand probably came out the best of all the mage reworks. He got a net posotive instead of a net negative.

General Levi2 votes

But at the cost of why his mains played him.

Paroe1 votes

[{quoted}](name=General Levi,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=pEpTVBzc,comment-id=000300000000,timestamp=2016-07-18T00:15:21.647+0000)

But at the cost of why his mains played him.

He still came out very similar to how he played before. With the recent nerfs, malzahar has lost even more in exchange for... nothing. hes still unable to make plays by himself and hes still incredibly passive with no real niche to fill except objective focused farm jungling. He cant even push as well as others anymore.

Raeyxx2 votes

Uh... did you actually play him?

I just got out of a game with him where I can now solo the dragon. AND don't even get my started about what I did to my laning opponent.

I'm expecting a nerf with that round of damage.

Paroe4 votes

{quoted}

Uh... did you actually play him?

I just got out of a game with him where I can now solo the dragon. AND don't even get my started about what I did to my laning opponent.

I'm expecting a nerf with that round of damage.

Been playing him since he went to PBE. Played him a few times now that its live since he got some nerfs (voidlings lost 0.1AD at rank 5).

Who were you playing against? Someone slow, who just stood there and tried to ignore the voidlings? AoE mages absolutely wreck malzahar unless he gets ahead, and even if he gets ahead its very easy for him to fall back behind.

Also, did you miss where i said new malz is very good at controlling objectives? ^^' If voidlings are allowed to stack up they can do some good damage, but any competent mid laner will just break them before you can stack them. especially if you dont get some kind of zoning advantage early on.

Limbo Pete1 votes

Excellent post. You summed it all up very nicely, sir. Unfortunately, since the world is shitting its pants over him being able to eat objectives, what we are going to get is nerfs to his jungle viability without few or no corresponding buffs to his now feeble laning potential.

Paroe1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Limbo Pete,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=pEpTVBzc,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2016-05-05T20:37:30.706+0000)

Excellent post. You summed it all up very nicely, sir. Unfortunately, since the world is shitting its pants over him being able to eat objectives, what we are going to get is nerfs to his jungle viability without few or no corresponding buffs to his now feeble laning potential.

Hes the first AP jungler in recent memory who has really good clearspeed and is relatively safe. Unfortunately, thats all he brings to the table.

Once the meta solidfies, malzahar will primariy be a jungler (assuming he doesnt get nerfed in the mean time.... if he does, he will be mostly unplayable; jungle - farming the jungle and taking objectives - is his one saving grace). there are other champions who are far, far, far better at objective control with these changes than malzahar who ALSO have good ganks and who ALSO have good 1v1 potential. Malzahar has none of that unless you try to counter jungle him and catch him at the end of a camp when he has 5+ voidlings.

deadlychuck1 votes

Honestly, i'd rather just not see this new kit. It doesn't feel very satisfying to play, and due to the way the voidlings function it seems they will either always be broken or worthless, and he completely lost his ability to shred towers.

The W is so automated that you don't feel like you actually do anything. When you do well it feels like it's the champion automatically winning, and when you're doing poorly it feels like you're handicapped by the lack of actual range of potential.

F031 votes

As someone who played against malzahar alot.

his voidling wasn't shit

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

Meh just want Q to EXTEND duration of E instead of reset, W's FIRST voidling take takes 55/60/65/70/75% reduced damage from turrets and W scales per level instead of rank which would fix jungle malz immensely.

I wish the ulti had a passive where on killing units malz summons a "mini"(1/4th or 1/8th size) null zone in that area for half the duration of ulti's.

Paroe1 votes

{quoted}

Meh just want Q to EXTEND duration of E instead of reset, W take takes 20/25/30/35/40% reduced damage from turrets and W scales per level instead of rank which would fix jungle malz immensely.

Or we could move the suppression to a long-CD 120 mana non-ultimate, and move the voidlings TO his ultimate and make them a companion. easier to balance and moves malzahar back into the lane.

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

Meh wouldn't be as an immediate fix cause that's a full blown rework although it does make sense I'd rather them do what they can do immediately for now.

Paroe1 votes

{quoted}

Meh wouldn't be as an immediate fix cause that's a full blown rework although it does make sense I'd rather them do what they can do immediately for now.

Immediately they can revert the rewowrk and replace his old W with his new W and old passive with new passive.

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

Main thing I like about new malz is the current passive if they brought that onto old malz <3

But since riot won't revert it I'd rather continue asking them to properly change malz in a quick way instead of abandoning all hope.

Paroe1 votes

{quoted}

Main thing I like about new malz is the current passive if they brought that onto old malz <3

But since riot won't revert it I'd rather continue asking them to properly change malz in a quick way instead of abandoning all hope.

Fair enough =/ People didnt like the pool to begin with.

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