Shen deserves a lot more love, Riot.

Canastus··89 votes·8,595 views

Let's talk about Shen and why he could use a lot more of your attention, Riot.

First of all, he's a ninja. He clearly got a theme going on but what part of his kit really reflects this? In reality there's nothing "ninja" about him, he's simply slow and sluggish. He's a tank gated by high energy costs and lack of escape the second he engages. That makes him very risky to play as since his dash has a very high cooldown along with some crazy energy costs. This makes him quite easy to kite aswell. Other melee range champions have decent movespeed (345-350) whereas he's stuck at 335. Then there's the total lack of mr scaling on him.

Is there a reason why he's a tank who isn't allowed to acquire free magic resistence with each level, despite being a melee champion? I got the feeling you've been putting his scaling into places where it shouldn't be, such as his absolutely pointless ap-ratios for example. Why not give him additional scaling based on his hp or ad at least? Why does it have to be ap? It entirely contradicts his common build-paths.

Then there's his Shadow Dash. His E is the only tool he has to even stick to someone, and that only if you manage to hit the taunt. Too bad it's on a high cooldown and has unreasonably high energy costs which make it very hard to use. Did you ever consider giving it a short stealth effect during his dash-animation? At least it would properly reflect his theme as a ninja and it would be a great way to set up unique plays with him. Just imagine dashing between brushes with him. I don't get why a ninja would even need a taunt, so much for his lore (wasn't he supposed to be emotionless?). Couldn't you come up with something better instead?

Then there's the issue with his ultimate. Yes, you have reduced its cooldown in the most recent patch but besides lategame splitpushing (which he's absolutely horrible at by the way) it's very hard to use without getting punished by it. Your ultimate forces you out of your own lane thus leaving the enemy top laner with an exposed tower which will most likely break or take tons of damage while you're somewhere else trying to get 1-2 assists. All of this doesn't even make up for the amounts of cs you miss out on while you're gone from your lane. There's no real scenario in which Shen actually profits from using his own ultimate, it doesn't even protect him. His kit basically consists of only 3 abilities, that's it.

Shen absolutely lacks any waveclear, even with an item like sunfire cape he still struggles to properly farm compared to other top-laners, especially when you're pushed back to your own tower. He actually plays like a second support since he lacks any real kill-potential and heavily relies on level based scaling instead of gold. Speaking of gold, his income is among the lowest in the game. Just looking at the result-screen of any game tells you everything you need to know. I feel he lacks the proper compensation for all those things he's losing out on just to play the team's meatshield.

I think it's about time you start considering a rework for him.

93 Comments

Hıryu23 votes

i know this sounds stupid.. but am i the only one that notices how stupid he walks when using the normal skin.. like i actually went and bought the samurai shen skin just because the walk animation didnt make me want to head butt a knife. but other than that i think shen should be changed into something more of a tanky ap top similar to maokai. If not i think a slight buff he should get is at least scaling mr.

Terff3 votes

nah the only reason I used to not play him was his walk, eventually I got over it.

bumbertyr3 votes

{quoted}

nah the only reason I used to not play him was his walk, eventually I got over it.

the same magic reason why people dont know about poopy being op af, she's so ugly nobody plays her :)

Ariel the Cruel13 votes

Urgot

Solaxo4 votes

{quoted}

the same magic reason why people dont know about poopy being op af, she's so ugly nobody plays her :)

People keep buying that disgusting Poopstar Ahri skin, so apparently people like playing ugly characters

BlackMagicWilson5 votes

Shen was the first champion I ever bought and my main to this day but when I first saw him walk my initial reaction was "Why does he look like a retard he lacks basic motor skills?"

junglerboy163 votes

he walks like he's bending over to the ground from the waist, and then tucking his knees up into his chest, while insisting on walking sideways at all times.

Arch Mage Magnus9 votes

Truth be told, soon as I saw Shen I was excited " Awesome....a Ninja!" After looking over his abilities however, I realized he has nothing to do with a ninjas kit. He might as well be Chris Farley from Beverly Hills ninja.

Ariel the Cruel4 votes

Well there are 2 types of ninjas.

The proper type that hides in the shadows and kills people in their sleep (or beer stooper). And the media type that walks into broad daylight, massacres armies, and autographs pictures without even wearing a mask.

Shen leans towards the ladder.


Though the real reason for his kit is to counter akali. When released Shen (tank), akali (assassin), and Kennen (mage) were balanced around each other in the holy trinity. Shen beat Akali Akali beat Kennen Kennen beat shen.

Of course, various balance and item changes have disrupted the balance of power (giving birth to Zed). So it no longer applies quite like it used to.

IcyPepper7 votes

I kinda of like him. Makes me feel like the "dad" of the team, knowing I'll be there for my "family" whenever they need me, unlike those other fathers who are too concerned with making big money farming to take care of what's precious.

I mean, there's the "uncle" who goes around and gives gift from time to time, but nothing like big daddy Shen coming to the rescue.

Quort3 votes

Sounds like Sky! :O

GloriousKaiser5 votes

The art though. I like how it homogenizes Zed and Shen's rivalry with their looks too.

Dunkrius2g4 votes

+1 for Zed's mask

Big Bang Bob4 votes

I love Shen's ult. He dominates lane easily against most melees, so I usually have time so save someone with it and summoner 12 back. It definitely should be kept. Despite problems, they managed to build his kit around the ult well, with him having good lane dominance and his passive and Q to get cs easily, making up for his low kill potential.

My main complaint is that his taunt practically silences him when he misses and almost silences him if he doesn't hit more than one champion.

Either way, this dude is my go to top laner. I just need someone to take out those pesky ranged tops.

Jolly Rogered3 votes

They just buffed his ult CD, I didn't even notice it lol! He is still easily outclassed. I will finally agree he needs a rework.

Leti the Yeti2 votes

and i thought to myself that i would finally buy shen

guez not :l

Charmander1123 votes

Im still rather fond of his kit, i just wish it was better and up to snuff with other champs, and you nailed it about his theme and kit being weird and not coinciding. You bring up a lot of valid points, hope a red posts here

ImpossibleGT3 votes

I'm honestly pretty happy with Shen. I think he's in a pretty decent spot as both a jungler and a top laner. If there was one thing I'd like changed about him, its how grossly he's punished for missing his E. Like... you miss E and you're done that fight. That's it. It doesn't help that it has a pretty wonky hitbox where you can visually dash right through people but still miss the actual taunt because of how narrow it is.

Verarticus3 votes

Okay, inc rant from someone who LIKES and plays a decent amount of shen.

Since when is AP a wasted ratio on him? ALL of his skills scale with it, at reasonable rates and guess what there's a good AP MR item that works perfectly with him.item 3001 And sunfire not helping him push? What? With Q spam passive and sunfire (that works nicely with item 3001 ) he can shove lanes super easily, not the best out of everyone but he's meant to be a tank so his damage is more targeted.

No kill potential? Really? I'll grant you that he can't kill everyone but in lane he can easily harrass most champs down and secure a kill with a surprise burst. And the only time I HAVEN'T been able to 1v1 the adc is when they're ahead 5+ kills or they're vayne (the anti-tank adc, and even then I can usually put a good fight at the least)

Shen's ulti isn't for his direct profit really. If you get another lane 1-2 kills they can easily win lane, or you could even get dragon/baron off of it. The point isn't to get Shen fed, it's to deny the enemy a kill/kills and get your team some instead.

Shen can farm EASILY, how in the world do you think he can't farm when his passive and Q make it so easy is beyond me. I mean really, even if you're losing lane you can easy farm with Q from a safe distance.

About the only thing I would want changed on him is Feint because it's not that helpful until late game, and even then it's still a bit lacking.

BastionKross3 votes

Shen's got several problems, both thematically and with his kit.

  1. Ninja and tank, together. Those are not easy concepts to marry in looks or a kit, especially when dodge tanks are not a thing in League for a very good reason.

  2. If all the champions in the game were built for damage (AD, AP, AS, whatever is best) Shen would probably be at the bottom of the list with BraumBard. Shen has trouble dealing significant damage even with things like item 3078 item 3153 backing him up.

  3. His model and animations, at least on the base skin, are horrid to look at next to newer/reworked champs.

werewolvecaster3 votes

Shen needs a rework his kit is just weird he is horrible at everything he does and he has such poor stats.

John Berserk3 votes

If Shen were to get ANYTHING changed in his kit, it should be his Q and W. If not both, then just his W, because really, it's a shield. Thats all it basically is and its sooo boring. D:

But really though I think his R and his E are pretty good, and I think they're somewhat ninja-esque (or at least they can be tweaked to look it more). Its his passive, his Q, and his W that dont really give him much. Yes, they all have some use, but his passive is useless on him (being a tank and all); his Q is kind of interesting with the marking of targets and letting allies heal off of them, but thats literally it; and his W is a shield with no other gameplay or use to it other than to reduce the cooldown of his useless passive.

He's pretty much just another victim of old Champion design, and I agree he needs to be brought back up to speed.

Phife2 votes

To be honest, shens concept of a ninja has no Place in his actual kit. Like you've stated hes a sluggish tank that derps around slapping people for little to no damage.

If shen was to be different he would have to get a whole rework (which tbh isnt really needed). He just needs a good qol vhange on his q or e. Im not sure exactly what but hes in a good spot right now.

Renaille4 votes

{quoted}

To be honest, shens concept of a ninja has no Place in his actual kit. Like you've stated hes a sluggish tank that derps around slapping people for little to no damage.

If shen was to be different he would have to get a whole rework (which tbh isnt really needed). He just needs a good qol vhange on his q or e. Im not sure exactly what but hes in a good spot right now.

Shen's concept is part of a triangle with Akali and Kennan as the core "classes" of the game which shows the basic gameplay pattern. Akali the burster beats kennan the more sustained dps who beats shen the tank who beats akali the burst caster. This is perfectly in line with Shen's lore and represents their Order striving for balance.

Also shen does decent damage and is a strong duelist if you build him to be so.

Best regards: Technically a shen main.

Jolly Rogered4 votes

{quoted}

Shen's concept is part of a triangle with Akali and Kennan as the core "classes" of the game which shows the basic gameplay pattern. Akali the burster beats kennan the more sustained dps who beats shen the tank who beats akali the burst caster. This is perfectly in line with Shen's lore and represents their Order striving for balance.

Also shen does decent damage and is a strong duelist if you build him to be so.

Best regards: Technically a shen main.

Akali beats the hell out of Shen. Akali power-spikes harder than Shen does and Shen has no built-in Mr per level. You might have a slight edge pre-6 after that if you try to tank Akali, she will tear you apart.

I disagree with the claim that Shen is a Duelist. He is just simply a meat bag (Tank). Too many champions out duel him and out sustain him. His sustain is one of the weakest you don't even notice it if your opponent out dmgs you. The only time I notice his sustain is vs jungle monsters.

Shen needs a serious power-shift in his kit. He is outclassed by too many champions.

KaisadiIIa2 votes

If you build properly, Akali can't burst you down unless she's fed.

Terff2 votes

Also you said he was the only tank with no mr scaling and iirc singed doesn't have any either. But yeah I agree he needs an overhaul and some thematic changes definitely.

KaisadiIIa2 votes

A year ago everybody was complaining about Shen being insanely broken. Now he's useless. I can't understand this community sometimes.

Qiyeanu Reeves3 votes

It's mostly because compared to other tanks the way his kit functions is just really clunky and outdated.

KaisadiIIa3 votes

I agree with it. I just want to say that he does not need plain buffs, I'd rather see a visual update to make his spells feel more impactful and fluid, with minor buffs like adding on-hit effects on his Q, a shield scaling off his maximum health and some tweaks to his E, maybe adding a decent AD scaling to reward building a bit of damage or, as the OP said, grant him a short stealth while he's dashing. His R is perfect though, it's a really powerful ability if used correctly.

Visually speaking, he can be a tank-oriented ninja and it can fit thematically, but he needs a visual rework so badly to feel less "clunky".

jv21blU7oD9 votes

Shen was considered OP during S3 so that's two years ago, not one. The game has changed around Shen a lot since then and the unique global map pressure he used to bring from top lane has been replaced by anyone that runs Teleport. He is this awkward mix of a cc tank and a split pusher but he is outclassed in both roles by a lot of champions. What you are failing to understand is how the game itself has changed, it's not about the community here.

KaisadiIIa3 votes

People running TP is not a "change in the game", but a change in the meta instead.

I know how the game changes and how the meta changes too. This time, I think Shen went from OP to "useless" due to meta changes (along with some undeserved nerfs), and a champion should never be balanced based on their performance in the current meta.

I don't want a plain buff for Shen, as I said in another comment:

"I just want to say that he does not need plain buffs, I'd rather see a visual update to make his spells feel more impactful and fluid, with minor buffs like adding on-hit effects on his Q, a shield scaling off his maximum health and some tweaks to his E, maybe adding a decent AD scaling to reward building a bit of damage or, as the OP said, grant him a short stealth while he's dashing. His R is perfect though, it's a really powerful ability if used correctly."

Treyen2 votes

ninja tank that makes jokes about ninja being fast....one of the slowest melee in the game rito logic

NorthernDruid2 votes

I'd love it if his Feint was changed (if only visually) to feel more like it's interpretation in this video.

Stick Figure Spotlight 2 - Twisted Treeline

turkeyBACON2 votes

I'm likely going to downvoted for this but if anyones interested, I made a post a while back with some ability suggestions as part of a series of posts toward a full rework/visual update:

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/cXroak6k-a-modest-proposal-shens-gameplay-update-part-4-of-4

SmknWdl2 votes

He actually plays like a second support since he lacks any real kill-potential and heavily relies on level based scaling instead of gold.

Ok so has anyone actually tried taking him as support? I mean if he plays like a support why don't we try him that way? I haven't ever played shen, so I'm mainly just curious to see if anyone has done this and what the results were.

Nielarken1 votes

Ive tried him as a support and it was rough the main problem is because he has only his taunt and ult to help or save anyone and besides the long cds on both not to mention the low dmg/shield strength because of the lack of ap your ult will be useless till late game if your building full tank and if you dont build full tank you will just be kited to death. His vorpal blade seems like a good idea for a support skill with the healing and all but the regen is so small your adc will have to be able to free farm while you throwing blades on minnions without killing them which just isnt going to happen because you get poked out of lane most of the times. So if you do try it your going to have to play it safe with bush hugging to avoid poke and pray you dont miss a taunt because if you do its gg.

SmknWdl2 votes

I see... ok yeah that makes sense he definitely needs buffs

TheI3igDaddy2 votes

Give Feint a stealth mechanic and either remove the AP scaling or give it a small %health scaling. If he's not in combat, he instantly enters stealth for its duration (3 seconds), which would allow him to roam about around other players ("From the shadows..") periodically and position himself so that he can flank the enemy team with a well-placed Shadow Dash.

....also give him scaling MR and fix the goddamn taunt hitbox already.

Wa-la, he's good again.

DoFr2 votes

holyhell i love that artwork

Canastus2 votes

Let's hope he gets something cool like that when his VU comes.

DoFr1 votes

source? do you have any information regarding that? i'm really interested

Canastus1 votes

This is just some concept artwork from the Riot Polycount art contest 2014, the pic from my starting post is from the same guy as you can see. Sadly his entry didn't win anything, it recieved an honorable mention though.

Steél2 votes

+1 Shen was one of those champions who I almost knew I would love before I even got him. I wasn't disappointed at all when I did get Shen, and he is a lot of fun to play. But yeah, it often feels like Shen just gets outclassed by other champions in what he does, and I sometimes even get the feeling that after I ult into a team fight and use my E, I just sit there being useless in fights. The ult CD buff is great, but I would really love it if Shen got more utility or maybe even a bit more damage. The idea of giving him ability scaling that benefits off of a tanky build path is a really awesome idea, and I'm sure that isn't the only change that could be done to help him out. Shen Still, knowing that Riot hasn't forgotten my favorite ninja makes me pretty happy.

DoFr2 votes

Did he won the contest? Because that splash art is at the level if not better than riots art team

CataclysmCrash2 votes

He has needed a rework for years.

His ult needs to be non-global, and he needs basic stat buffs. Shen should be a tanky bruiser, not a full tank.

Maybe his E can work like a Galio/Zenith blade mashup, where a second cast returns him to the first target taunted and deals a % of the damage Shen received from all taunted enemies.

Q can stay the way it is, but passive and W are really uninspiring. Dunno what they would do with them.

Fix Your Hands2 votes

I've been using Shen since i started playing the game... (not that long ago- December) and he remains my main and favorite champ. However, there are some changes i would like to see.

  1. Remove all AP scaling except from his ult
  2. Make his Q damage scale off of AD, but still do magic damage. The reason for this is because Shen is autoattack based. Also make Shen's autoattacks do 30% amplified damage to a marked target.
  3. Make his W shield and E damage scale off %maximum health, while still doing magic damage
  4. Pressing E once stealths Shen for maybe 5 seconds, pressing it again makes him dash and taunt as normal, with the taunt making him come out of stealth prematurely
  5. Shen's E can hold 3 stacks (like Akali's ulti). He would get 1 every 10 seconds, but can't taunt the same enemy(s) twice within 6 seonds. Champion kills and assists instantly grant him a stack.

This could make a more viable optional AD Bruiser/ Assassin buildpath for Shen other than tank, because his kit isn't good enough for a "pure tank." Focusing on pure AD would allow Shen to dash in, kill, and dashout again. Maybe not the next Katarina, but still optional.

A Bruiser build (what i think Shen's main build should be), would complement Shen by increasing his dueling potential, while also rewarding him for building health.

And going pure tank would still be viable, with the taunt resets/increased CC.

Basically turn Shen into an AD/%health bruiser, but make his passive and abilities continue to do magic damage.

Thoughts on this?

48983507DEL12 votes

I agree with most of what you say, although I don't agree with you when it comes to his ultimate. Starting with that, his ultimate is massively huge, putting a giant shield on a squishy target to either save a teamate from a large burst or stop an engage on him/her all together. Yes, you leave lane for it, but most top laners take teleportsummoner 12 to do that anyway, meaning if he takes teleport he can come back instantly while the opponent will either have to waste his following Shen or let Shen assist the team across the map in the hopes of maybe getting his tower; it applies a ton of global pressure similar to TF, Pantheon, and even Nocturne.

Other than this, however, I mostly agree with you. He needs to have natural MR scalings to compete with almost any other tank or bruiser for that matter, he needs to have more HP scalings or add %HP damage to make building health more worthwhile or effecient him, he needs to have better waveclear and/or be better at splitpushing, and he should definitely have more ninja thematic abilities. Here's a few suggestions:

1: MR per lvl increased from 0 to 1.25 (same as Akali and Zed)

2: Feint (W) shield strength changed from 60/100/140/180/220 (60% AP) to 40/80/120/160/200 (10% max HP)

3a: Ki Strike's cooldown is reduced by .5 seconds when attacking turrets (1 second while Feint holds) and/or 3b: Shadow Dash (E) now does full damage to minions and monsters, but will not taunt them or refund energy

4a: Shadow Dash (E) now stealths Shen during his travel time and/or 4b: Stand United (R) now stealths Shen upon teleporting to his ally for 4 seconds or until he attacks an enemy

I believe these changes will help Shen to become more in comparable to other popular/powerful tanks in the current meta. I see no real problem in his teamplay, being a huge asset to any Protect the Carry based team as well as a simple wombo, but his stats need some tweaking and his identity as a ninja needs to be clarified further. I mean you can say the same for Kennen, who is just a lightning mage with no real ninja aspects, but Shen is a good starting point. If anything, at least add the changes to his MR and W and hopefully his passive, but be sure to at least look into the stealth changes.

Then there's Garen's identity, who requires both heavy tank and heavy AD to be effective, but that's a different story...

Fix Your Hands2 votes

{quoted}

I agree with most of what you say, although I don't agree with you when it comes to his ultimate. Starting with that, his ultimate is massively huge, putting a giant shield on a squishy target to either save a teamate from a large burst or stop an engage on him/her all together. Yes, you leave lane for it, but most top laners take teleportsummoner 12 to do that anyway, meaning if he takes teleport he can come back instantly while the opponent will either have to waste his following Shen or let Shen assist the team across the map in the hopes of maybe getting his tower; it applies a ton of global pressure similar to TF, Pantheon, and even Nocturne.

I don't understand what you disagree about...? Are you saying that the AP scaling should be removed from his ult too? I do like the idea of being stealth during the ult though

Kingsgrave2 votes

Ninja Bodyguard needs a rework. Honestly the only iconic things on his kit are his E and his R. Everything else could be completely removed and something better could be added in their place.

He should remain a Tank/Fighter but should play more like a Ninja Bodyguard rather than just a split pushing meat wall.

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