He's the only top laner in this game with ZERO counterplay that never receives any meaningful nerfs. Almost every other top laner has at least one ability that can be dodged/avoided. Let's all keep complaining about Irelia and Aatrox though. Champions who have always been perfectly healthy and had tons of counterplay before and after their reworks.
Makarakarn4 votesChampion: Is strong Boards: OMG RIOT IS SO BIASED REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
ChaosReyn2 votesIrelia: jumps 14 times in 2s, getting a 1v5 pentakill on literal accident...yep...perfectly balanced.
I agree on Aatrox, he's really only good if the player is good...but seriously, I can play Irelia freakin blindfolded and still have positive KDA, cs advantage, and probably take 2-3 people with me by mid game with minimal effort on my part. >.>
Jax is easy to counterplay: if he starts his E, walk away, then poke at him for the next literal eternity it's on cooldown.
The Highest Noon1 votesA decent Jax player never runs in with E. That's goddamn stupid.
ChaosReyn1 votesand if he leapstrikes in, there's a delay before he can reactivate it, so you can still easily back out.
let's not start nitpicking.
The Highest Noon1 votesEver time I see a Jax player run in with helicopter dick, they usually end up feeding the game lol
Cloud2731 votesIrelia: jumps 14 times in 2s, getting a 1v5 pentakill on literal accident...yep...perfectly balanced.
I agree on Aatrox, he's really only good if the player is good...but seriously, I can play Irelia freakin blindfolded and still have positive KDA, cs advantage, and probably take 2-3 people with me by mid game with minimal effort on my part. >.>
Jax is easy to counterplay: if he starts his E, walk away, then poke at him for the next literal eternity it's on cooldown.
You can dodge her abilities. Literally the only ability that can't be dodged is her 'q'.
FireDrizzle1 votesShe is an auto attacker and dodging w just wins a very very close all in with it not doing real damage.
Jamaree1 votesHis counterplay is ranged poke though.
Whisper871 votesThe reason Jax is not viewed as a problem compared to things like Irelia and Aatrox is that he has much, much lower pressure in lane than either of those champs. Except for a couple key matchups like Yorick and Trynd, he doesnt' really bully anyone in lane. And then when you look at his impact on the rest of the map, he just takes longer to come online than things like Irelia or Aatrox. Both of them can CC from much farther away and have ways to get out. While in the earlier stages of the game Jax leap is usually a one way ticket in, and then he has to be in melee range to stun. It's just way more risky for him to go in, and when he does go in, his burst damage is weaker than both of those other champs until much later in the game.
Here's what I will give you, when Jax does get a lead and start snowballing, it's a freaking avalanche. But again, outside of a couple key matchups, no one should really be getting knocked around by Jax during lane phase. And pretty much all of the other fighters and tanks have more agency than he does early on. As far as counterplay goes, I feel like it only seems that way when you're playing another melee AD champ or Tank. He can definitely be hard kited by team fight comps, I just recently played a Jax game into a Janna, Orianna, Caitlyn with tank top comp, and it was a freaking nightmare despite having smashed my lane. Same deal with poke, as his E dodges autos only and his ult is pretty short duration and therefore reserved for the all in. I mean Jax's ult scales with AD/AP, and currently he builds heavily into AD, so mages with high sustained damage like Vlad, Swain, Cass are always very strong into him.
So when you say "no counterplay" I'm assuming what you mean is that in a context of a 1v1 he pretty much outscales everything in the game. But that automatically points out a weakness in a champ as getting a sustained split pushing going is harder now than it used to be, especially in solo Q. I actually think Jax is a really good example of what scaling looks like. In my opinion, all champs should scale proportionally. By that I mean lets say every champ has 10 power points, and during their design these 10 power points are to be distributed between the early, mid, and late game. Jax works because his early game is not very good, and his mid game is pretty bad, so his late game gets to be literally best in class. It's a fair trade off. Compare that to Irelia, who seems pretty equal to Jax very early on, but hits her "mid game" spike a bit earlier and then is just nuts from then on out. It just is not proportional at all. Where Jax power points are like 2-1-7 in terms of early-mid-late power, Irelia is like 2-6-5, making her overall just way more valuable and less risky. I'd say Yasuo has the same issue, where his supposed mid game power dip is not nearly big enough of a trough to justify how easily he can push people in early on without taking too much harass and how well he scales.
Cloud2731 votesThe reason Jax is not viewed as a problem compared to things like Irelia and Aatrox is that he has much, much lower pressure in lane than either of those champs. Except for a couple key matchups like Yorick and Trynd, he doesnt' really bully anyone in lane. And then when you look at his impact on the rest of the map, he just takes longer to come online than things like Irelia or Aatrox. Both of them can CC from much farther away and have ways to get out. While in the earlier stages of the game Jax leap is usually a one way ticket in, and then he has to be in melee range to stun. It's just way more risky for him to go in, and when he does go in, his burst damage is weaker than both of those other champs until much later in the game.
Here's what I will give you, when Jax does get a lead and start snowballing, it's a freaking avalanche. But again, outside of a couple key matchups, no one should really be getting knocked around by Jax during lane phase. And pretty much all of the other fighters and tanks have more agency than he does early on. As far as counterplay goes, I feel like it only seems that way when you're playing another melee AD champ or Tank. He can definitely be hard kited by team fight comps, I just recently played a Jax game into a Janna, Orianna, Caitlyn with tank top comp, and it was a freaking nightmare despite having smashed my lane. Same deal with poke, as his E dodges autos only and his ult is pretty short duration and therefore reserved for the all in. I mean Jax's ult scales with AD/AP, and currently he builds heavily into AD, so mages with high sustained damage like Vlad, Swain, Cass are always very strong into him.
So when you say "no counterplay" I'm assuming what you mean is that in a context of a 1v1 he pretty much outscales everything in the game. But that automatically points out a weakness in a champ as getting a sustained split pushing going is harder now than it used to be, especially in solo Q. I actually think Jax is a really good example of what scaling looks like. In my opinion, all champs should scale proportionally. By that I mean lets say every champ has 10 power points, and during their design these 10 power points are to be distributed between the early, mid, and late game. Jax works because his early game is not very good, and his mid game is pretty bad, so his late game gets to be literally best in class. It's a fair trade off. Compare that to Irelia, who seems pretty equal to Jax very early on, but hits her "mid game" spike a bit earlier and then is just nuts from then on out. It just is not proportional at all. Where Jax power points are like 2-1-7 in terms of early-mid-late power, Irelia is like 2-6-5, making her overall just way more valuable and less risky. I'd say Yasuo has the same issue, where his supposed mid game power dip is not nearly big enough of a trough to justify how easily he can push people in early on without taking too much harass and how well he scales.
When I say no counterplay I mean you can't avoid any of his abilities. If Jax times leap+counter strikes properly you can't avoid the stun. Like I said almost every other top laner has at least one ability that can be dodged. Jax should have some counterplay in his kit as well.
Whisper871 votesWhen Jax pops his E he has to let his staff spin for at least a short time, he cant just press E twice to get an instant stun, there is always at least a little delay. So that means one of two things:
A. He starts spinning his staff in advance, in which case you can get out of range of his leap before he does it. B. He leaps to you and then starts spinning his staff, in which case you have about a second to get out of stun range, which is not much larger than melee auto attack range.
Additionally his E only blocks auto attacks, so that means you can also cc him at any point. I play Nasus into Jax a lot and essentially when i see him pop E, the response is to instantly wither him and then just walk out of his leap range until his staff stops spinning. Or if he leaps first you just wither him while his staff is spinning and walk out of stun range. Seems like a lot of counterplay to me.
The Chad Support1 votesOP thinks new conq is op aswell
Syrile1 votesJax just scales super well. There are worst things in the game... Like "early" game champions that never fall off and have zero skill requirements to delete people with 2-3 buttons.
FireDrizzle1 votesJax is harder too beat than "early game" champs at the moment.
Kurorade1 votesPre-rework Aatrox was unhealthy in my opinion, if he could land his Q knockup it's a pretty much guaranteed pick on a that champ with the Titanic+Guinsoo's combo.