Its kinda hard to lock vayne down when you only see her for like 30% of the fight

koshkyra··4 votes·596 views

People think im retarded as a liss main for not being able to lock down vayne in teamfights.

You try using a 300-range ultimate on someone whos only visible for a 0.5 second window and can knock you back.

Its not even that lissandra is a weak champion. Shes perfectly fine. Vayne is not.

Vayne and Riven have the same problem. They have ultimates that give them gigantic buffs (riven gets AD and improved abilities, vayne gets AD and higher MS) which is enough, but then they have another concept that completely breaks them.

In rivens case, its a ranged AoE excecute that will kill anyone below 50% health, and in vaynes case, its an invisibility with a cooldown like 0.5 seconds longer than its duration.

Before you start downvoting saying "RIVEN OP THREAD DOWNVOTE EVERYONE PLS" this is not about riven, its just a comparison.

Vayne has 0 counterplay unless you have the reflexes of... i dont even know what to compare this to

If you think shes countered by "getting locked down and focused" shes not when she is only visible for very VERY brief periods of time. If you do manage to have the reflexes of a (input something with godlike reflexes) and are able to target her before she goes invisible 0.2 seconds later, dont worry, because either

A) you arent in range to use something on her B) you are but then she knocks you back

I dont know why vayne is allowed to have this bullcrap damage output and mobility while shes basically untargetble for 12 seconds.

Please downvote this post, i am highly expecting it to be downvoted and do not care if it is.

11 Comments

Awhegark4 votes

I think, you need to change mains if you play liss and you can't do the only thing that champion is good for which is locking down priority targets. If you were doing your job right Vayne should not have time to use stealth since she would be a frozen statue.

Marshbouy2 votes

Unless vayne ults before Liss can get in range, but i think OP is just a little salted from a recent game.

Awhegark2 votes

Yeah, I am guessing Op got outplayed and is not thinking straight. Liss is not a bad match up against Vayne like that person above me explained.

koshkyra1 votes

{quoted}

Yeah, I am guessing Op got outplayed and is not thinking straight. Liss is not a bad match up against Vayne like that person above me explained.

No, i was not outplayed. I had my entire team feed her while i attempted to carry us, and i ended up having to lose because she would be literally unkillable during fights, then was called a retard for not ulting her.

Avienal1 votes

{quoted}

No, i was not outplayed. I had my entire team feed her while i attempted to carry us, and i ended up having to lose because she would be literally unkillable during fights, then was called a retard for not ulting her.

Sounds like my typical matches in rank when i don't get a smart team, especially in the moments where i literally predicted at the start of the match how the enemy champions would build(such as a currently dreaded setup known as high AP team with a jungling amumu) and suggest some early MR to counterbalance the all in burst alot of the champions tend to carry as AP in the current flow of things.

Ends up with just as the same situation of when a ADC rushes item 3086 over item 1038, the AP champions end up with EZ all in burst and once the amumu has gotten enough farm, he's basically throwing out his true magic damage 'debuff' to make even strong foes get shred with ease, mainly because you have things like the Top laner oping for HP more then putting attention to Magic Resist to help stave the damage off better once those AP champions start completing the high AP damage items that kick off the instant killing situations.

Point is, a Smart team is the first step to even be able to 'outplay' strong champions and ones who aren't smart are just giving pub stomp tier champions the feed to shrink the 'effort bar' and lead to the snowballs. Though if this Vayne was using some Lethality combined with item 3153 build, then its pretty obvious part of the issue is how things like Critical hits are getting shafted by Lethality and Botrk builds these days because the damage output is just plain ridiculous, especially when raw AD is outweighing attack speed and crits in the early game.

Plus thanks to Botrk bringing that opportunity back in, ADCs got alot of room back into the spotlight and not be utterly ruined as much compared to the constant 'burst' type damage champions, especially AP ones in particular. Shame that now we have a bs item 3153 item 3071 build going around which is alot more ridiculous then the ghostblade one since botrk supplies lifesteal, attack speed, a move speed steal active and its delicious '% hp shredder' which means the pair brings out the equilvency of a Vayne W on every hit (shredding armor % and stabbing current % hp with every auto attack).

Make Riot less cheesie, Nerf item 3071 more then just 1% off per stack to bring it from 30% armor shred max stack to 24% armor shred max stack.

[slayer-jinx-unamused]

cinomenapplebae3 votes

Press W on her and then wait until its over and then press r she will be stunned, if she knocks you away after w then flash back and R her.

Handy Sandy 1 votes

{quoted}

Press W on her and then wait until its over and then press r she will be stunned, if she knocks you away after w then flash back and R her.

Vayne should never be in range of Liss's W.

cinomenapplebae1 votes

https://youtu.be/xsCp5lBceTA?t=1m3s

It's fairly large compared to the lane and well for at least me a lot of the Vayne players I see miss-position often

Handy Sandy 1 votes

{quoted}

https://youtu.be/xsCp5lBceTA?t=1m3s

It's fairly large compared to the lane and well for at least me a lot of the Vayne players I see miss-position often

A Vayne is still going to 3 shot her since she's able to attack and use ability, it's better to engage with your ult first so you survive to press w on her. This is lategame of course though, in any other situation w is better, but since Liss is pretty kitable I'd use my ult.

Handy Sandy 1 votes

Vayne's basic attack range and Lissandra's R are both 550 according to the wiki, you should be able to click on her and press R when she stands still to auto.

Catastrop1 votes

Pro tip; Pre target the ult on mobile champions before moving into range(whether it's E or just walking). If they even get a pixel's worth of a step into your casting range, you'll automatically ult them.

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