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LoL is becoming more difficult. What if I don't have fast enough reflexes for mobility meta?

dEAdbUs··81 votes·8,864 views

First of all sorry, if my english is bad. Second - this post is not about what to play, it's about "slowpokes can't play LoL anymore?".

I'm playing LoL since S2, and now when I'm looking on Veigar's changes I think that game has changed dramatically from that time. For last 3 years game lost most targeted CC, changing them to skillshots. Same time we're getting more and more champions with dashes, flashes and insane mobility. I never had good reflexes, thats why most S2 and S3 I was trying to avoid skillshot or mobile champions, or champions with difficult mechanics (long fast combos). I had fun with Singed, Rammus, Taric, Twitch, Annie, Darius or Teemo. Now this time is gone.

Right now I feel like this meta isn't for me.

First time I had this feeling when I tried Lee Sin. He was dominating in S3: fast, mobile, with insane damage, full of combos and skillshots, solo carrying games - best choice if you want to reach high elo. But when I tried him I found that he is too diffcult for me. Then I decided to carry game with ADC and choosed Twitch, because his has easy kit: you don't need target Q and E, R gives you insane range, so you're safe in teamfights. I was like "I can carry games with Twitch, it's an ADC, he can kill anybody". And Twitch was really fun for long time. But later meta changed, and after Lee there came other mobile champions. And then mobile meta tortured me on ADC position - I found that R doesn't give me safeness from enemy assassins and fighters, and I was focused all the time. Lee literally kicked me from ADC position, so I started look for something new and fun, but without skillshots mechnics. In August I watched how Tabe (thx Tabe^^) carrying botlane with Annie, and that impressed me. Most players started play Annie after Worlds, but I started to play it much earlier. Again I had feeling that I can carry games without having perfect mechanics (btw Tabe in interview said same: I don't have perfect mechanics, but I'm only one support that Uzi can play with).

In S4 I was charmed by VelKoz (tentacles and eye lasers, wow!) and I knew he'll be much better on botlane than on mid, so I started to play him as support. That was great progress for me - 100% skillshot champion. But he worth it, because playing him was really fun. Later I stopped play botlane because there came Leona and Thresh, and their bully power and tankiness made Vel'Koz and Annie unplayable.

After leaving botlane I started to look for another champion to play. For something powerful with tactic gameplay. Vi, Lee, Elise, J4, Kha were totally dominating games. And found that Heimerdinger worked perfectly against their diving power. Most part of S4 I was playing Heimer and carried myself to Plat.

Now I stucked. I feel myself unskilled. I see Katarinas, LBs, Vis, Lees, J4s, Blitzs, Threshs everywhere. Every new champion has more and more complicated mechanics. They all require fast fingers and lightspeed reaction. Old champions get reworks, because their mechanics useless vs new fast and furious meta, or because they still have targeted CC. Sometimes I'm thinking that if I started to play LoL now, I won't be able to reach even 30 level, because I won't have enough patient to learn this too-difficult game. When smurfs in every game eating you with LB less than in a second, it's not fun, and it's not motivating you to keep playing LoL. May be this game isn't for me anymore.

I was thinking about rewards for grinding (like in some MMORPG - even if you're not winning in PvP or not getting items from bosses, you still get some equipment that will make next try easier) for players like me - without skills, but trying to be useful for team. But I don't know how to add it into LoL, and I'm not sure this will help.

Another problem that while game requires high mechanic skills there is no map for training it.

You can say: "Mate, play normals", but I don't feel passion in this kind of games. Probably I like that feeling of competition and desire to win, or may be it's something from my hierarchy of needs.

106 Comments

Jesus is Savior26 votes

It's not just reflexes. With over 100ms ping (sometimes 200+ms), I can't actually stun a Katarina in time to stop most of her burst.

Which is annoying....

EDIT: and I played against one who obviously had low ping, and couldn't even use my E as Evelynn, because her ping was low enough she could blink away before it finished casting

gr8job3 votes

Playing at just below or just above 100 ms for years, I always thought this was BS. Then I played a mere minutes from Riot HQ.

Dear lord.

The difference really is insane.

Lemons221 votes

Yea there's a reason that challenger players, on average, have like 20 ms. You simply can't play the game at that level without the absolute best internet.

Poptart Evelynn10 votes

I'm going to be honest. That is just how most games are. This is a fast paced game where strong reflexes are required. Sure you can enjoy aram or normals but you wont get far in ranked without being skilled in all areas.

Meirlkor16 votes

While it's true you need to be good at everything, that only applies at the very top. If you're good enough at something, it should be enough to carry you upwards plenty. For instance, back when I played Starcraft 2, I was in Platinum rank (back when Diamond was the highest) strictly through the strength of my macro play. My 'micro' consisted of 1A-ing my units into his units and hoping I won the fight. But I had the bigger army because of better resource management, and I picked the right engages, and that was enough to be Platinum there.

In this game it's the same thing - I know when to move, where to take objectives, when to engage and when not to. But my actual mechanical play is pretty bad - which is why I prefer low-mechanics impact champions such as, yeah, Veigar and Annie, or tank soaks such as Mundo, where there's no pressure to make highly technical plays, and you win through other means. If your strength happens to be overall strategic moves rather than twitch reflexes, that should be enough to take you plenty high. But Riot has been moving away from that model and there's less and less place for strategic players like myself or the OP, and we're being slowly driven out in favour of highly-skilled reflex plays rather than much simpler-to-execute-but-requires-knowledge-or-smarts like building the correct counter item or playing differently than normal.

I don't think this is a good thing, but I might just be biased. Do you think it's a good thing?

AHeroNamedHawke5 votes

{quoted} If your strength happens to be overall strategic moves rather than twitch reflexes, that should be enough to take you plenty high. But Riot has been moving away from that model and there's less and less place for strategic players like myself or the OP, and we're being slowly driven out in favour of highly-skilled reflex plays rather than much simpler-to-execute-but-requires-knowledge-or-smarts like building the correct counter item or playing differently than normal.

I don't think this is a good thing, but I might just be biased. Do you think it's a good thing?

You might think that's great, but warping the entire lane around you and requiring specific counterbuilding in order to survive isn't exactly enjoyable for the other guy

Why do I automatically lose to my lane opponent if I don't rush QSS and passively farm, even though my lane mechanics are better than his? That isn't strategy, he just clicked someone in champion select

JevelFaithful9 votes

Riot might not agree with me, But I always tought veigar was less smothering than Zed (to name the obvious one). Then again, I think "playing defensively and push" and "harass after blowing his cooldown" are valid counterplay. Strategic counterplay instead of reflex counterplay, but counterplay nonetheless. You say changing build path is not fun? I'll agree rushing a lategame item just to survive is not (hello zed's zhonya + QSS). But being forced to buy a 400g cloak (or a 1k item maybe) is perfectly fine in my book. Everylane is going to be theorically in favor of 1 side. If you're on the loosing side, you can't expect to play like you're on the winning one.

And honnestly? Zed is wraping the lane around himself and require specific counter-strategy! I know I must play defensively to avoid giving him that snowball kill,. I think I have to ward to spot where he's going because the other lanes need to see him coming. The other lanes (!) have to warp their lanes around him too because he WILL roam.

Idealy, both would be present. And Veigar's changes kind of make sense actually. They left him WAY too weak, but the delay + skill shot-Q aren't bad ideas. The bad idea is making the delay long enough that nasus can walk out of it with boots 1 (exageration) and lowering his raw damage output while also up'ing his counterplay. And making him main nuke skill reliant on said 0.75sec delay stun.

AHeroNamedHawke2 votes

{quoted}

Riot might not agree with me, But I always tought veigar was less smothering than Zed (to name the obvious one). Then again, I think "playing defensively and push" and "harass after blowing his cooldown" are valid counterplay. Strategic counterplay instead of reflex counterplay, but counterplay nonetheless. You say changing build path is not fun? I'll agree rushing a lategame item just to survive is not (hello zed's zhonya + QSS). But being forced to buy a 400g cloak (or a 1k item maybe) is perfectly fine in my book. Everylane is going to be theorically in favor of 1 side. If you're on the loosing side, you can't expect to play like you're on the winning one.

And honnestly? Zed is wraping the lane around himself and require specific counter-strategy! I know I must play defensively to avoid giving him that snowball kill,. I think I have to ward to spot where he's going because the other lanes need to see him coming. The other lanes (!) have to warp their lanes around him too because he WILL roam.

Idealy, both would be present. And Veigar's changes kind of make sense actually. They left him WAY too weak, but the delay + skill shot-Q aren't bad ideas. The bad idea is making the delay long enough that nasus can walk out of it with boots 1 (exageration) and lowering his raw damage output while also up'ing his counterplay. And making him main nuke skill reliant on said 0.75sec delay stun.

Zed doesn't warp the lane nearly as hard as Veigar did

The only time Veigar was open to harass is if you had +1k range, because otherwise you're getting stunned unless he fails to click on you, and depending on level/items that either leads to him bursting you or his jungler strolling in for a free kill

Zed is either farming or harassing (or harassing with half damage shuriken that are aimed at last hits), and doing either means he won't have the energy to all in for about 10-15 seconds

Zed can be survived with double Doran's + Seeker's, which don't hurt your damage output like rushing QSS/Mercs does and sets you back somewhat on mana regen. Zed lacks any kind of hard CC so it is possible to avoid his damage, albeit difficult if he ults you. You know exactly where he'll be when he ults (behind you) and can react accordingly

Veigar needs some help and is getting it, but in no way was his gameplay strategic, it was simply "god I hope he misclicks" followed by camping him extremely hard. That or outranging him as Xerath

JevelFaithful1 votes

Maybe I never met a good veigar. YOu can ideally get the MR you need from a quick chalice (which never hurts). But overall I see what you mean.

Chessburger4 votes

He's exaggerating. People are prone to do that. Also people tend to be very biased which is apparent in both of his descriptions of veigar and zed.

RanmanReborn4 votes

You couldn't possibly be more full of shit.

AHeroNamedHawke3 votes

{quoted}

You couldn't possibly be more full of shit.

Thanks that is a very convincing argument and I have reconsidered my stance on the issue

RanmanReborn3 votes

Zed constantly pushes your lane while being able to buy lifesteal items, which negate most any damage you put on him in lane. His energy costs aren't that bad, and when he hits 6, he can likely kill you. While mages are oom, Zed can just sit there and push you in constantly and is most likely gonna kill you at 6.

Veigar's E actually took skill to land, and he has one job and that job is killing the other team's AD or AP carry. If he misses his stun, he dies. If Zed fucks up, he can ult, then ghost back to wherever his original clone was.

THAT'S why you're full of shit. A Veigar missing his stun often means he's dead. A Zed fucking up his combo most often STILL ends up killing someone in an engagement.

My point still stands. You couldn't possibly be more full of shit.

AHeroNamedHawke3 votes

{quoted}

Zed constantly pushes your lane while being able to buy lifesteal items, which negate most any damage you put on him in lane. His energy costs aren't that bad, and when he hits 6, he can likely kill you. While mages are oom, Zed can just sit there and push you in constantly and is most likely gonna kill you at 6.

Veigar's E actually took skill to land, and he has one job and that job is killing the other team's AD or AP carry. If he misses his stun, he dies. If Zed fucks up, he can ult, then ghost back to wherever his original clone was.

THAT'S why you're full of shit. A Veigar missing his stun often means he's dead. A Zed fucking up his combo most often STILL ends up killing someone in an engagement.

My point still stands. You couldn't possibly be more full of shit.

Zed rushes 12% lifesteal with a Cutlass and has 0.8 AS

You autoattack him a single time and he has to autoattack the wave for 4 straight seconds to regain the lost HP

What amazing sustain

The reason mages run oom is because they rush Seeker's with only 1 Doran's Ring vs Zed, and likely don't look into mana regen runes at all.

With only 2 rings and 3 points in regen from masteries, an average mage is regaining 157 mana every 30 seconds from CSing normally at 6

Casting 2 Qs as Ahri at 6 costs 150 mana

Zed doesn't start pushing hard until he's gone to buy and has rank 3 Q, at which point you should have your two rings and be able to cs as well

If you aren't unconscious during laning Zed is going to have to use W to reach you for an ult, and will land directly behind you under tower, where you can immediately throw a CC and fuck him up. He's now ~650 units away from you with no cooldowns or energy and at half HP, you can figure out the rest

People also fail to realize that Living Shadow is on an 18 second CD pre brut/level 14, so if hes using it to harass/waveclear he doesn't have shit for some time

Lastly

THAT'S why you're full of shit. A Veigar missing his stun often means he's dead. A Zed fucking up his combo most often STILL ends up killing someone in an engagement.

REQUIRING THE OPPONENT MAKE A MISTAKE IS NOT HOW BALANCE WORKS

It was an instant cast massive AoE, all you could do was hope he somehow didn't click on you

Thankfully the rest of his kit was shit enough early to prevent him from going FotM mid, and was regulated to support till Riot nipped the problem in the bud

tl;dr: Dont be shit at csing and don't rush Seeker's just because mobafire said to

Reazale1 votes

So , its okey for me to warp my build 1600 g (doran+armseeker) but its not okey for zed to warp his build 875 ( mercury upgrade to boots)? Actually, it sounds reasonable.... /sarcasm

"REQUIRING THE OPPONENT MAKE A MISTAKE IS NOT HOW BALANCE WORKS"

I CALL SO MUCH BS OF THIS , HOW THE ACTUAL F### DO U F###### THINK THE ACTUAL VEIGAR STUN WORKS , OFF UR F###### MISTAKES, COS U HAVE TO F###### WALK TO A F###### WALL TO GET F###### STUNNED FFS!!!!.

This whole game is balanced around the fact that ppl will fuk up, one way or another, thats how u win.

AHeroNamedHawke1 votes

{quoted}

So , its okey for me to warp my build 1600 g (doran+armseeker) but its not okey for zed to warp his build 875 ( mercury upgrade to boots)? Actually, it sounds reasonable.... /sarcasm

"REQUIRING THE OPPONENT MAKE A MISTAKE IS NOT HOW BALANCE WORKS"

I CALL SO MUCH BS OF THIS , HOW THE ACTUAL F### DO U F###### THINK THE ACTUAL VEIGAR STUN WORKS , OFF UR F###### MISTAKES, COS U HAVE TO F###### WALK TO A F###### WALL TO GET F###### STUNNED FFS!!!!.

This whole game is balanced around the fact that ppl will fuk up, one way or another, thats how u win.

You placed the circle edge on a champion at 1k range by clicking on them, but your cursor is big and round instead

You dont miss unless you misclick

That is not capitalizing on positioning, or avoiding your spells then fighting during cooldowns, its literally just "phew he didnt click on me"

And if you really think that Mercs alone was sufficient for playing against Veigar then there isnt really much else to discuss

It's not like you eouldn't be building Zhonya's anyway, and you don't even need to complete it depending on the champion you're playing

Champion Skin2 votes

Veigars E had 0.25 seconds cast time also

Now it is the same way isn't it? Instead of the opponent having to rely on Veigar missing the stun (or buying merc treds or some other counter to is)

Veigar is now relying on his opponent messing up or being silly and walking into his stun.. (isn't both the same... having to hope for your opponent to mess up... though Veigar of course can't buy an item to make his stun land like someone else could buy an item to counter his stun before)

Champion Skin1 votes

Isn't it this way against a lot of champions? If I don't build armor against Riven she will tear me to shreds If I don't get a Zhonyas against Zed he will burst me each time he has his ult If I don't get a banshee or GA mid to late game LB will likely 100-0 burst me

AMYS GRAVE6 votes

Ping plays into this as well. It's hard to cc them if you can't see them there when they actually engage. 100 ms is enough for kat to come in, get off most of her burst, and get out without repercussions.

Iron Angel 2k34 votes

One time the coach said I was too weak to play on the basketball team. Instead of working out and practicing and getting better, I demanded that basketball instead be made easier and all the players better than me have their hands tied together so that I could play.

Great Ozymandius10 votes

You missed the point.

The game requires two skills: strategic thinking and reflexes. Good strategic thinking is partly innate, but you can study the game to better understand and formulate strategies. Reflexes can also partly be trained (muscle memory), but reaction time is pretty much biologically fixed. Very fast reaction times are around 250 milliseconds. Slow reaction times are around 600 milliseconds. This is a biologically determined. Ping also acts like reaction time. Some people have 30 millisecond ping. Other people have 300 millisecond ping.

It's not fun playing a game when outcomes are basically beyond your control. Mobility creep is shifting the game to things outside of player control.

Many plays simply cannot be made without good ping and good reaction time, like dodging spears, canceling a Katarina ult in time, etc.

Some champion skills are used for dps and are mathematically less effective with high ping. Have you played a karthus with high ping? Not only is it harder to land lay waste, but you dps drops because there is a 400 millisecond lag between when the cooldown is off and when you can use send the skill again. It's around a 20% reduction in dps and is totally outside of your control (bar moving to a different region).

Iron Angel 2k33 votes

[{quoted}](name=Great Ozymandius,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nEowzkgK,comment-id=00100000,timestamp=2015-03-10T23:20:29.633+0000)

You missed the point.

The game requires two skills: strategic thinking and reflexes. Good strategic thinking is partly innate, but you can study the game to better understand and formulate strategies. Reflexes can also partly be trained (muscle memory), but reaction time is pretty much biologically fixed. Very fast reaction times are around 250 milliseconds. Slow reaction times are around 600 milliseconds. This is a biologically determined. Ping also acts like reaction time. Some people have 30 millisecond ping. Other people have 300 millisecond ping.

It's not fun playing a game when outcomes are basically beyond your control. Mobility creep is shifting the game to things outside of player control.

Many plays simply cannot be made without good ping and good reaction time, like dodging spears, canceling a Katarina ult in time, etc.

Some champion skills are used for dps and are mathematically less effective with high ping. Have you played a karthus with high ping? Not only is it harder to land lay waste, but you dps drops because there is a 400 millisecond lag between when the cooldown is off and when you can use send the skill again. It's around a 20% reduction in dps and is totally outside of your control (bar moving to a different region).

Today in "Shit Bronze Players Say", someone actually blames genetics for the fact they are bad at the game. Never mind martial artists and racecar drivers who train their reflexes to be razor sharp, because thats obviously impossible.

dEAdbUs8 votes

Month ago in ranked, I was killed by LB. 2.6k damage in 0.4 sec (I have a screenshot). I have 100ms ping, so I had only 0.3 sec to react.

Both martials and drivers getting less information that needs to be analized.

And nobody blaming genetics, please read topic. It's about game and how it's changing.

Iron Angel 2k31 votes

{quoted}

Month ago in ranked, I was killed by LB. 2.6k damage in 0.4 sec (I have a screenshot). I have 100ms ping, so I had only 0.3 sec to react.

Both martials and drivers getting less information that needs to be analized.

And nobody blaming genetics, please read topic. It's about game and how it's changing.

You clearly know nothing about martial arts. A lot of martial artists can hit you so hard you die. They of course don't do that in competitions, but they are also lightning fast and everything from body language to technique to stance to follow-up must be read to predict their movement and counter it, then they have to do the same to counter you back. Martial arts is ultra high speed at upper tiers with athletes that have trained for decades to get their minds and bodies to a razor sharp edge.

Martial arts is all about reading your opponent in the nanosecond it takes for his fist to start moving and reach its destination.

But your ignorance of martial arts is extremely off topic, so I digress, and move back to the main point:

League is not totally unplayable for people with slow reflexes or inability to comprehend the game's mechanics and flow. You're simply locked out of the upper tiers, because in order to compete in the upper tiers, these are skills you must have, and honestly, it has ALWAYS been that way, even since S2 when I started playing. Upper tier players have better reflexes, better game knowledge, and better positioning, because these things are what define your skill level as a whole. A chain is only as strong as its weakest link, so being weak in one of these things (In your case, reflexes, and if I had to guess, probably the other things too) is usually crippling enough to lock you down until you improve.

And yes, you most certainly can improve reflexes. There are a lot of simple exercises you can do to improve your reflexes, but you've never even bothered to look and instead came to G&B demanding that the game be made easier instead of becoming more skilled.

Borigrad5 votes

[{quoted}](name=Great Ozymandius,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nEowzkgK,comment-id=00100000,timestamp=2015-03-10T23:20:29.633+0000)

You missed the point.

The game requires two skills: strategic thinking and reflexes. Good strategic thinking is partly innate, but you can study the game to better understand and formulate strategies. Reflexes can also partly be trained (muscle memory), but reaction time is pretty much biologically fixed. Very fast reaction times are around 250 milliseconds. Slow reaction times are around 600 milliseconds. This is a biologically determined. Ping also acts like reaction time. Some people have 30 millisecond ping. Other people have 300 millisecond ping.

It's not fun playing a game when outcomes are basically beyond your control. Mobility creep is shifting the game to things outside of player control.

Many plays simply cannot be made without good ping and good reaction time, like dodging spears, canceling a Katarina ult in time, etc.

Some champion skills are used for dps and are mathematically less effective with high ping. Have you played a karthus with high ping? Not only is it harder to land lay waste, but you dps drops because there is a 400 millisecond lag between when the cooldown is off and when you can use send the skill again. It's around a 20% reduction in dps and is totally outside of your control (bar moving to a different region).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WBKlzLMj7zY This guy reaches Diamond playing with only his feet

There is a guy who got gold with a disability that forces him to play with pencils in his mouth.

http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/28vkxa/finally_reached_diamond_with_only_one_hand/ This guy got Diamond with one hand.

MUH GENETICS For your shitty reaction time isn't a god damn excuse when you die in lane.

9kPluzZ2 votes

{quoted}

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WBKlzLMj7zY This guy reaches Diamond playing with only his feet

There is a guy who got gold with a disability that forces him to play with pencils in his mouth.

http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/28vkxa/finally_reached_diamond_with_only_one_hand/ This guy got Diamond with one hand.

MUH GENETICS For your shitty reaction time isn't a god damn excuse when you die in lane.

I agree. OP just needs to find a different game.

youngjake934 votes

So basically you wan to be diamond without having the skills that an average diamond player posseses. Anything else would not be fun for you. So Riot should keep as many balanced low skill ceiling champs as possible so that you can compete.

I strongly agree that there should be a sandbox/practice mode though. It really is dumb, especially how League has a bunch of hidden mechanics like Muramana procs three times if you use Jax's W on an ult proc. You wouldn't find that out unless you wasted a bunh of time testing random obscure scenarios. You can't even go figure out which walls you can flash over without waiting 5 minutes in between each attempt.

Sire Hippington2 votes

If you feel like lol is getting to fastpaced for you, try out other mobas like dota or heros of the storm, they are far more strategie focused and pretty slowpaced.

For training mechanics, customgames work pretty well, the bots don't really do more than dummies. Customgames could use alot more options thogh, like actually adding a dummie that can give u details about your damage, and options to start with X startgold and at level X....

dEAdbUs5 votes

I came to LoL from Dota (I started play Dota when Guinsoo was working on it and LoL didn't exist). HoS is too raw, unbalanced and sensless yet.

JevelFaithful2 votes

Amen for the HotS comment. I played it and, while fun, I can't help the feeling it's a bit too boiled down for me.

EverTokki2 votes

I want to say that this game is evolving, therefore is the reason meta is changing. I personally also suck at skillshots and I basically hate to play Katarina because I can't follow her. But it's okay, I tried using sona, fizz, and many other champions and I believe there still are champions that could fulfill your categories- except the game's going to be a little tough. I spam my keys every time anyway.

JevelFaithful6 votes

{quoted}

I want to say that this game is evolving,

Amen. It's true, but we can not-agree with the direction it's going.

I personally think their core philosophy is really good (more counterplay, less binary champions, more obvious effects, less 1-trick-pony champions). But feel like they're too extreme about it. And that really aren't in control of their game.

EverTokki3 votes

Well, yeah. It's kinda becoming extreme.

{quoted}

I personally think their core philosophy is really good (more counterplay, less binary champions, more obvious effects, less 1-trick-pony champions). But feel like they're too extreme about it. And that really aren't in control of their game.

This is so true.

DaCush2 votes

That's what I love so much about this moba tbh. The skillshot and having to dodge them is much more rewarding. It's why I don't play Dota as much. Maybe you should try out Dota, it seems like more your kind of thing. It's what makes the two games stand so far apart. League is a lot more faster paced and mechanical while Dota is more strategic imo. I would honestly hate it if Riot started making Champs less complex because that's what gets me so excited about playing different champs. And honestly, it's just 4 buttons unlike a Moba where you need 30.

dEAdbUs1 votes

I was playing Dota when LoL didn't exist. And Dota has tons of mechanics: Invoker, Geomancer, Phoenix (he was reworked 3 or 4 times, and every version was complicated to play), etc. And last hitting harder in Dota.

Probably you meant MMORPG not Moba? I have to say that for last 2-3 years most popular champs in WoW are two-buttons death knights. 2 years ago in Cataclysm were popular one-button arcane mages.

Thivus2 votes

GIT GUD

Zone of Endless2 votes

This is what I'm fearing. Riot making this game depending too much on reflex for flashy play is a bad thing if they do it too much. If you make it complicated for new/casual players they will not play this game for long/leave the game. If they leave the game then you have no/less casual base player. If you don't have a casual base player the competitive scene won't thrive as much because less people are watching.

Take a look at SC2. They practically have no casual player because of how much reflex required to be good at the game(or just cheese). The game gets complicated and there's no incentive to playing the ladder at all. If you take a look at their competitive scene now it is very much dying. It gets at most 5-6k twitch viewers on a good day and if there's a major tournament it may spike to 8k or 9k. Even CSGO get more views than SC2.

So Riot needs to stop with the BS changes for "LCSBIGPLAYS". Changing everything to a skillshot will just make champ with mobility thrive even more. This game need some decent point and click stun to counter that if they want to have some kind of diversity.

AHeroNamedHawke2 votes

{quoted}

This is what I'm fearing. Riot making this game depending too much on reflex for flashy play is a bad thing if they do it too much. If you make it complicated for new/casual players they will not play this game for long/leave the game. If they leave the game then you have no/less casual base player. If you don't have a casual base player the competitive scene won't thrive as much because less people are watching.

Take a look at SC2. They practically have no casual player because of how much reflex required to be good at the game(or just cheese). The game gets complicated and there's no incentive to playing the ladder at all. If you take a look at their competitive scene now it is very much dying. It gets at most 5-6k twitch viewers on a good day and if there's a major tournament it may spike to 8k or 9k. Even CSGO get more views than SC2.

So Riot needs to stop with the BS changes for "LCSBIGPLAYS". Changing everything to a skillshot will just make champ with mobility thrive even more. This game need some decent point and click stun to counter that if they want to have some kind of diversity.

League is nowhere close to the level of micromanaging required by starcraft, and never will be

Im quite glad Riot is moving away from "I clicked you first so you die" gameplay, as laning against Annie is boring as hell

Zone of Endless1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Charles Barklius,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nEowzkgK,comment-id=00210001,timestamp=2015-03-11T14:16:00.572+0000)

League is nowhere close to the level of micromanaging required by starcraft, and never will be

Im quite glad Riot is moving away from "I clicked you first so you die" gameplay, as laning against Annie is boring as hell

I do agree that this game doesn't require as much micro. But most people who play LoL doesn't play other games that do require a lot of micro. So you can see where most of their skill level maybe and some may not improve that much, but they enjoy how easy some champ are to play.

Now if Riot create everything a skillshot/depend on reflex. Those players may feel too overwhelmed and doesn't feel like it is worth it to try and get better and thus stop playing the game/play less.

junglerboy162 votes

Really, unless you are at some extremely high skill bracket you can completely get away with not being a flashy meta champion because if you play your immobile champ excellently, then you will beat your opponents more often than not. If you are at a higher skill bracket, then I don't know what to say to help you, since I most certainly am not at one of those ranks and don't know how players like you and I should handle this trend.

MrPerson101 votes

Stay in top lane.

dEAdbUs19 votes

People in rankeds saying something like that: "If you can't play other roles, then don't play rankeds".

MrPerson101 votes

If you don't get top lane, dodge. Top lane is the center of high damage offtanks with severe immobility

If you can't play other roles effectively, don't play them. Alternatively, play champs like Katarina Kayle Talon that don't require skillshots

Sirabell23 votes

Telling people to dodge is a horrible idea.

Overlord Forneus1 votes

My apologies, but I find your post unreadable. If I may suggest reading your posts out loud, before posting the the boards.

As for the topic: Mobility champs and the like haven't bothered me at all, though I mainly play as KarthusKarthus SivirSivir and if I must support SonaSona .

dEAdbUs43 votes

My apologies too, for unreadable post. English is not may native language. As I asnwered already to previous comments, this post is not about "what to play", it's about "there is no place for players like me".

Mikal Pikal36 votes

Don't listen to him. I understood perfectly what you were trying to say. You are much more articulate and understandable than half the "english natives" on these boards.

Sammystorm1 votes

Maybe perfectly understood is a bit of a overstatement. I definitely understood you but their were a few moments where I had to reread your post. That being said I could understand you.

dEAdbUs2 votes

I rewrote my post, now it must be easier to read^^

JevelFaithful4 votes

Like MIkal, I understood perfectly too. if you want to know, a few sentenses betray your non-english-ness (is that a word?). But you're pretty clear anyway.

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